Worth the time to rebuild injectors myself for stock level applications?

[Detroit80]

Recently found a few weeping injectors on my '90 7.3 with Banks turbo...tops are wet where the hard lines screw on. I did the caps/return lines last year. I have absolutely no idea when, or even if, the injectors have ever been changed on this truck. Runs fine, starts without any issue hot or cold, though it does seem like it's idling a bit rougher than usual. Of course, I'll do the simple check first - make sure line nuts are tight, but I'm thinking this is probably a good time to change out the injectors anyways.

I've read over procedures for cleaning/rebuilding/pop testing injectors, and it sounds pretty straight forward. Of course, this is all relative...I think rebuilding automatic transmissions are pretty straight forward too, and others feel like they're boxes of voodoo black magic, lol.

Seems like many of the usual suspects for replacement injectors are out of stock at the moment, so I started looking for rebuild parts for my existing injectors...looks like it's going to cost me about the same whether I do it myself by the time I get a pop tester, new nozzles, seals, etc., or get a set of remans from some place.

So makes me wonder...for someone who's happy with stock level performance (well, stock with the Banks turbo, lol), is there really any good reason to do this myself, other than the "I did it myself" satisfaction? Is there really that much of a chance of stock remans being a wide enough pop pressure range across a set of 8 to notice it by the way the engine runs?

 

[chillman88]

I wouldn't, and I'll rip anything apart. Besides, I'm not exactly sure where you'd source new nozzles anyway.

If you had a fleet maybe. For the cost I'd just get a set from Russ or Wes and call it good knowing you bought a quality product from someone who will stand behind their product. Plenty of other places to save a nickel by doing it yourself.

 

[Detroit80]

Nozzles - first hit I got was from DCP, $95 for a set of 8 nozzles. I figured by the time I get the other seals and parts, pop tester, shims, etc, I'd probably be into it for around $300. Or I could order up a set of new Delphis from Pensacola for $280...


Doing things myself usually isn't so much about saving money, and much more about knowing exactly what's in there and how it's set up. Like the big block I built for my Blazer - probably would have been cheaper to just buy a crate motor, but this way I know exactly what every single clearance is, every fastener torque, timing of the cam, head gasket thickness, bore diameters being exact across all cylinders, etc., inside that motor. It's also set up exactly the way I wanted it.

The kinds of things I care about with performance builds, whereas my daily driver beaters would just get whatever cheap rebuilds I can find at the local parts stores, lol.

I suppose a better way to phrase the question might be whether I really need to be concerned about the quality of the rebuilds or new injectors I might buy in terms of balance across the 8, or whether I might want a specific setup for a NA motor with an aftermarket turbo on it that I'm not going to get with an "off the shelf" injector.

I couldn't really say one way or the other when I be was looking over the various web pages of the vendors.. Seemed like it was either - "here's what you want when you're going for the most power possible" or generic whatever we have cheap for the trucks you don't care about... And I feel like I'm in between that, lol. I want quality parts, but not looking to deceive myself into thinking I have some kind of drag strip hero either . Overall I've never felt as if I was lacking in power with the truck for what I do with it, and I'm not interested in dropping a grand plus trying to chase another 20HP/TQ.

 

[chillman88]

DCP and Pensacola are both in the hall of shame for shoddy products. Russ has posted videos to Facebook of how crappy the spray pattern is on even the new Motorcraft injectors out of the box.

You're certainly welcome to try, but I'd hate you to waste all that money and end up worse than you started too, or to find out you need to buy three sets of nozzles to get 8 good ones... I'm not trying to be difficult, just trying to help you make an informed decision.

 

[chillman88]

I suppose a better way to phrase the question might be whether I really need to be concerned about the quality of the rebuilds or new injectors I might buy in terms of balance across the 8, or whether I might want a specific setup for a NA motor with an aftermarket turbo on it that I'm not going to get with an "off the shelf" injector

These things will run fine on very crappy injectors. A properly pressure matched set with a good spray pattern will make a significant difference in performance and mileage.

 

[snicklas]

Nozzles - first hit I got was from DCP, $95 for a set of 8 nozzles. I figured by the time I get the other seals and parts, pop tester, shims, etc, I'd probably be into it for around $300. Or I could order up a set of new Delphis from Pensacola for $280...

My biggest suggestion to you and anyone else.... read the Hall of Shame before you buy anything.....

https://www.oilburners.net/threads/the-oilburners-hall-of-shame.19805/

 

[Detroit80]

Well, if I wasn't looking for feedback, I wouldn't have asked before buying, and already whipped out my Visa

I know Pensacola has a bad rep for the rebuilds, but everyone seemed to be happy with the new Delphis, and I figured Pensacola's ham ****** goons couldn't screw up new in box products? That's why I was looking at the new stuff rather than the rebuilds, especially not when new was only about $50 more than rebuilds.

But at the same time, I wasn't sure that I was going to see any real benefit from $500+ worth of "performance" injectors on the end of a stock pump in a truck that only sees a few thousand miles a year either. If it wasn't for the leaks I noticed, I wouldn't even be thinking about the injectors..

 

[Shadetreemechanic]

I did my own injectors earlier this year, and I would say it not worth it. Someone had given me the pop tester, and I had a drawer full of injectors to pull nozzles and shims from. The biggest issue is that without a full shim kit I was mixing and matching shims to get my pop pressures right. Sometimes I had to do the same injector 5 times to get it right.
In the past I have bought injectors from Conestoga diesel and Type 4 (Russ). Both were great right out of the box. I will buy from one of them again next time.
It is satisfying when you finally get them right thoughhttps://photos.app.goo.gl/YUoBMpuL6HxU3ax76

 

[snicklas]

Big thing with the new Delphis, Their pop pressures are in a tolerance range, and lets say that range is 1800lbs, +or- 150 lbs...... so you could have 8 injectors, 2 that pop at 1650, two that pop at 1950lbs, 2 at 1800lbs, one at 1725 and one at 1875........ see the problem here..

The vendors here, Russ, Wes, Mel, pop match the sets they sell.... to something like 1800lbs +or- 25 lbs........ so your range is 1775 - 1825.... not 1650 - 1950.... the time it takes to pop match a set can be lengthy.... so that is where the extra cost comes from.....

 

[chillman88]

Which is exactly why I mentioned injectors from Russ. $400 with a high quality return line set. He pressure matches everything and won't send out junk.

Lot's of people feel that way about the new injectors, but fact is the QC is sub-par on the new stuff. I've seen several times someone has tested brand new injectors that leak out of the box, or have pop pressures all over the place.

I understand your thought process, but I personally will buy from someone here who looks everything over before sending it out so I KNOW it's perfect when I get it. And I can't ever recommend anything else in good conscience.

@snicklas types faster than I do!

 

[IDIBRONCO]

I have nothing more to add to this. It was said great.

 

[nelstomlinson]

Nozzles - first hit I got was from DCP, $95 for a set of 8 nozzles. I figured by the time I get the other seals and parts, pop tester, shims, etc, I'd probably be into it for around $300. Or I could order up a set of new Delphis from Pensacola for $280...

From what everyone says, those new Delphis would just be a starting point for your rebuild.

I suppose a better way to phrase the question might be whether I really need to be concerned about the quality of the rebuilds or new injectors I might buy in terms of balance across the 8, or whether I might want a specific setup for a NA motor with an aftermarket turbo on it that I'm not going to get with an "off the shelf" injector.

Talk to Conestoga Diesel or Classic Diesel Designs. They do quality rebuilds, and they can build you what you want if you don't want stock. Wes and Mel have both put a lot of time into experimenting, and know what's going to work. This is a place where DIY isn't likely to be either cheaper or better.

From what Wes has been telling us lately, it sounds as if the stock injectors are able to flow more than enough to go with a better-than-stock pump, so you may not need anything special beyond uniform pop pressure and spray pattern, which you apparently aren't going to get without going to one of our specialists here.

It really does make sense to have a cheapie pop tester if you're going to be buying off the shelf injectors from anyone but one of our specialists here.

 

[Fredrickson]

I have tried reaching out to Conestoga a few times recently...(relatively close)
I have not been reach anyone by phone and have not gotten any reply to email.

Is there a secret handshake I am not doing? or code word I should know?

 

[Shadetreemechanic]

Suzie usually answers, but I have had to leave a message before and they called me back. I seem to remember pretty slow email response. It is a small family business.
They were able to source me a pretty obscure pump for my mid 60's international harvester so they are definitely on my good list.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

They were able to source me a pretty obscure pump for my mid 60's international harvester so they are definitely on my good list.

I remember you mentioning that pump a while back.