Thank You Wes !
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Glow Plug Solutions from Classic Diesel Designs
- Thread starter Thewespaul
- Start date
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I think .5 is a bit high, I typically read less than .2 on good plugs when you subtract the resistance in the meter leads. I’ve been thinking about this a lot and started comparing the wiring diagrams between brick and obs trucks. The obs trucks use a different gauge than the brick nose trucks, but use the same controller and glow plugs, so I don’t think there was much tuning being done with the wire gauge, or maybe there was and the change was to improve the cylcling of the controller? And they actually had a screw in controller that read coolant temp in the 6.9s, but that controller had more issues than the solid state controller. I don’t think it will cause a noticeable issue with extending the leads, but even if it does well take care of it
ifrythings
Full Access Member
I’ve been meaning to post this up for sometime now but didn’t know where. I have a meter that reads low resistance accurately to 0.01 ohm, I bought 8 brand new zd9 plugs, at a room temp of around 70-72F they all read 0.25 ohm, this will decrease some the cooler it gets outside.
The current sense resistors (z resistor) is below what I can measure. Now excluding wire loss but including battery sag of say 10.8V, 0.25 ohm / 8 glow plugs gives 0.03125ohms, 10.8V/0.03125Ohms =345.6A but decays quickly as the plugs heat up.
I have a converted pc power supply that can do 60A at 12V, I can heat one plug to bright orange in 2 seconds. Interesting note that the 7.3 DI glowplugs draw half the current that the IDI does.
I currently have a factory controller with 8 separate 14ga wires running to the glowplugs and the controller will still run them 15s in cold weather, these controllers are fairly forgiving on the wiring as my last setup was a single piece of 8ga with ~3” taps to the glowplugs and it still operated correctly. Now I’m sure if you were to wire up 4 cat batteries with 4/0 cable and ran that to the controller and 8-10ga to each plug, the controller may have a over current detection built in to shut down the system, though I have personally seen it burn off a pinched plug wire before and not even break a sweat so not sure how if it really does have over current detection.
If anyone wants more tests or things to check let me know and I’ll see what I can do. P.s don’t ask me to run all 8 plugs at once, I don’t have a 400A power supply........yet
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The current sense resistors (z resistor) is below what I can measure. Now excluding wire loss but including battery sag of say 10.8V, 0.25 ohm / 8 glow plugs gives 0.03125ohms, 10.8V/0.03125Ohms =345.6A but decays quickly as the plugs heat up.
I have a converted pc power supply that can do 60A at 12V, I can heat one plug to bright orange in 2 seconds. Interesting note that the 7.3 DI glowplugs draw half the current that the IDI does.
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
I currently have a factory controller with 8 separate 14ga wires running to the glowplugs and the controller will still run them 15s in cold weather, these controllers are fairly forgiving on the wiring as my last setup was a single piece of 8ga with ~3” taps to the glowplugs and it still operated correctly. Now I’m sure if you were to wire up 4 cat batteries with 4/0 cable and ran that to the controller and 8-10ga to each plug, the controller may have a over current detection built in to shut down the system, though I have personally seen it burn off a pinched plug wire before and not even break a sweat so not sure how if it really does have over current detection.
If anyone wants more tests or things to check let me know and I’ll see what I can do. P.s don’t ask me to run all 8 plugs at once, I don’t have a 400A power supply........yet
Do you have a way to actually measure the current draw to one plug as you apply power? We have been calculating the power draw, but as we know as the plug heats up that drops. I know you probably cannot plot the current draw curve, but was wondering if you could get a feel for what the initial current draw is and how quickly it drops off, and what the current draw is toward the end of 10 seconds.
You’re the man! Thanks @ifrythings for wrangling the electrical pixies for us. Interesting you mention the ps plugs drawing less, I’ve noticed the 6.0 harnesses I tested used much smaller gauge than the IDIs, now that makes sense why. I have taken a lot of amp inrush readings on the glowplugs system and it’s like you said, big spike to around 350 amps then quickly drops and never really settles. That’s why I went the fusible link route with the full conversion kits as opposed to a breaker, figured in extreme cold weather people could run into issues with popping breakers every time that inrush current jumps in. Luckily the white Rodgers is rated for 600 amp inrush so no issues there.
ifrythings
Full Access Member
Finally got my new oscilloscope in, I used the negative wire from the power supply as the current sense resistor which is why I have a ton of noise but it worked, I captured a total of 7 seconds which is when the glowplug was fully orange.
The yellow trace is the voltage, you can see at ~8v the voltage stops instantly climbing and ramps up to the final 12v value, that’s caused by my power supply going into current limiting till the glow plug starts
drawing less amps, I can definitely say that this power supply can’t do 60A haha.
The bright blue trace is the current, ignore all the background blue as that’s just noise it’s picking up. At the peak it drew 46.56A and at the end it was drawing 16.8A.
Do note that this isn’t very accurate for a real world application as this is just one glowplug and with a power supply that can pretty much hold it at 12V. I will try and do another measurement on my truck when the weather decides not to be -28C.
The yellow trace is the voltage, you can see at ~8v the voltage stops instantly climbing and ramps up to the final 12v value, that’s caused by my power supply going into current limiting till the glow plug starts
drawing less amps, I can definitely say that this power supply can’t do 60A haha.
The bright blue trace is the current, ignore all the background blue as that’s just noise it’s picking up. At the peak it drew 46.56A and at the end it was drawing 16.8A.
You must be registered for see images attach
Do note that this isn’t very accurate for a real world application as this is just one glowplug and with a power supply that can pretty much hold it at 12V. I will try and do another measurement on my truck when the weather decides not to be -28C.
-28 yikes! Thanks again for testing this out, can I send you some different brand glow plugs and have you test them to see how they read differently from the zd9s?
ifrythings
Full Access Member
Ya you can but I’m in Canada so shipping maybe high. I may have an autolite and maybe a Bosch plug laying around if I didn’t throw them out, I’ll take a look tonight when I get home.
IDIBRONCO
IDIBRONCO
I have no idea why you wouldn't have thrown them out.
lakesurfer
Registered User
I'm in the midst of a series of normal maintenance tasks, minor repairs, and minor upgrades. Replacing my janky GP harness was on the list. I wish I had not already invested in a "brand-x" 6.0L harness before @Thewespaul announced his kick-butt harnesses. I finished modding the 6.0L harness and installing it. (Turns out even the GP harness from a 6.0L needs "bulletproofing", 
). I haven't fired the truck up yet and already hate the connectors. They went on tight at first, but are now super loose. To get it "right" I am going to have to rework the whole thing with bullet connectors like @Thewespaul offers.
Yeah. I should probably just take my lumps and order Wes's killer rig. His factory turbo version is more expensive (for very good reasons) but I have the skills, tools, and most of the materials to DIY. I may yet place the order, but I'm stubborn and too frugal sometimes. Just sayin' three things:
I did not like the 6.0L connectors at all.
I wish I'd spent my money up front on Wes's product. If if it were 6 weeks ago and I knew about Wes's offering then, I would have.
I hope my experience saves someone from some pain.
). I haven't fired the truck up yet and already hate the connectors. They went on tight at first, but are now super loose. To get it "right" I am going to have to rework the whole thing with bullet connectors like @Thewespaul offers.Yeah. I should probably just take my lumps and order Wes's killer rig. His factory turbo version is more expensive (for very good reasons) but I have the skills, tools, and most of the materials to DIY. I may yet place the order, but I'm stubborn and too frugal sometimes. Just sayin' three things:
I did not like the 6.0L connectors at all.
I wish I'd spent my money up front on Wes's product. If if it were 6 weeks ago and I knew about Wes's offering then, I would have.
I hope my experience saves someone from some pain.
I had the same experience with the 6.0 connectors (I have four sets of them if anyone needs a spare set for their 6.0) and they turned out too short to consistently reach all four glow plugs when I tested them out. They stay put on 3/4 on each bank but one on the end always falls off. Still have a set on the shop truck that i need to replace with one of my kits (when I get time to work on my own projects..) and it starts just fine on 6 glow plugs for our mild Texas winters
lakesurfer
Registered User
It wasn't even that with mine. I read that the spacing wasn't quite "right" such that one would "pull" at the end. That wasn't good enough, so I disassembled the conduit assembly, and reassembled it such that the spacing was right. Now too loose. Grrr.
8gitmusik1
1994_E350_7.3_IDI_N/A_E4OD
Nice of you to make this harness available to all of us that struggle with the OEM glow plug harness and bullet ends.
I wish I would have seen this BEFORE I bought the bullet ends from Accurate Diesel and started the process of individually cutting off the old OEM bullet ends and crimping and heating each bullet end replacement for all 8 glow plugs.
This is a fairly simple repair for younger wrench turners but a genuine backbreaking repair, for those of us with "tired and worn out hinges".
This is going to make a LOT easier for many folks out there. I still may get this, if when I finish the other bank of 4, have continued problems, hopefully not, but, as the wiring is still from 94, I can only hope.
Is the price on this still available to me for $35?
If so, as I am writing this, I am feeling kinda dumb for not just ordering this and calling the first bank of 4, a "back aching learning experience", since, a my "common sense, not so common kicks into gear", tells me......
If I do this once with your "kit" it will be "once and done".
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I’m happy to offer it! All the updated pricing is here: https://www.oilburners.net/threads/glow-plug-solutions-from-classic-diesel-designs.84824/
The preorder sell ended Jan 31st. To make life leagues easier working on these trucks, get yourself a top side creeper. It will save what’s left of your back!
The preorder sell ended Jan 31st. To make life leagues easier working on these trucks, get yourself a top side creeper. It will save what’s left of your back!
8gitmusik1
1994_E350_7.3_IDI_N/A_E4OD
So, Wes,
Just making sure I understand correctly....
Question # 1. The $60 is what your charging now, after your presale at $35, and is for the non turbo IDI harness alone and that would be a direct fit replacememnt for my 1994 cargo van (7.3L-Non turbo, IDI-w/e4od)?
Q#2. Wes, do you have a full "kit" that would work on my van, if I wanted to do the "complete" bypass of my stock system and run a manual glow plug push button style and tap of the water temp sending as you outlined.
Could that "kit", be modified to NOT add in the addl. cost of glow plugs as, I already have a set of 8 from Diesel RX and I planned on getting a matching Diesel RX glow plug relay (yes, I now realize I should have gone OEM ZD9 but can't easily return them so) Wes, what would be the cost in my situation?
Thanks for your help.
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