Dual IP with a twist - Hello me brainstorm this out

[WisdomWarlord]

Dual IP with a twist - Help me brainstorm this out

My first experience with a diesel engine was in the Navy with the 12V71 Detroit 2 strokes. They have a dead simple and very elegant cold starting procedure.
1) Crank until you have at least 3 psi oil pressure, then stop cranking.
2) Insert an ether "pill" into the little cup on the blower and close the cap to burst the pill.
3) Hit the starter again and listen to her roar to life. Simple and effective and worked without fail every time.

After I broke a tooth off the flex plate by using ether and not disabling the glow plugs, I have decided that the best way to start my IDI is just the same way as the old 2 stroke Detroits.
So that leaves me with a spare hole in each precombustion chamber.

My plan is to install a complete second fuel system. 2 IP's, 16 injectors (8 in the holes made for the injectors, and 8 more in the holes for the glow plugs), and zero glow plugs.

This will give double the fuel, so double the power should be a simple matter, with enough boost.

I will have to design and build a dual pump drive and figure out how to keep it all under the hood with a 4" hood scoop at most.

Given the extra clutter on top of the engine, I doubt there will be room for the turbo, or turbos, so those will have to go under the cab. That could be a good thing since I should be able to install some pretty substantial intercoolers down there, hopefully simplifying the turbo plumbing and making the added heat easier to manage.

The big problem I see is this. What will it take to machine the precombustion chambers to take an injector? They are made of inconel which is not known for its machinability. I'm thinking that to ease any alignment problems with mounting the injectors, the precombustion cups should stay in the head and be machined with the head.

I'm also expecting to have to fab up an intake manifold. I'm expecting to be able to use Sanderson headers for a NA engine, and maybe just mount the turbos right on the collectors.

Remember, when I mentioned this idea initially, I said it was simple, not easy.

I know, some of you are gonna scoff and say an inline pump is easier, or a Cummins swap is better. But, I'm not asking about an inline or p pump or Cummins swap.

So, any thoughts?

Thanks

 

[6.9poweredscout]

Can't wait to see it. My only question is how will you regulate it so it'll idle and not just dump fuel while idling

 

[WisdomWarlord]

Can't wait to see it. My only question is how will you regulate it so it'll idle and not just dump fuel while idling

My hope is that both IP's can be turned down at idle enough to give a steady factory like idle. There will be a staggered or progressive throttle setup where both IP's feed idle fuel, then one IP will be increased to its full throttle position, but at roughly 40% pedal travel. Then the second IP will come in above that and by 100% pedal travel, both IP's are feeding all the fuel they can deliver.

If I can't turn the IP's down enough, I should be able to drop the secondary IP's supply fuel pressure down to almost nothing, reducing the fuel flow without starving the IP for lubrication.

 

[BrandonBerkosky]

Do you have the capabilities to machine ur own timing gears?

 

[Leeland]

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Couple screen shots from the you tube video.
http://youtu.be/FwFWNReCmck

 

[WisdomWarlord]

Do you have the capabilities to machine ur own timing gears?

No, but there is enough of a selection of off-the-shelf gears and chain drives available that I shouldn't need to actually make any gears. A case to mount the pumps to and a chain drive is the direction I'm leaning towards. Simpler than gears and just as strong.

 

[WisdomWarlord]

Leeland, thank you for that. That's a lot like I'm going for, but with dual injectors as well. I expect dual injectors to give a more streetable engine and let me have more control over how long fuel is injected for. If I needed to, I could time it so the second IP didn't start injecting fuel until the first IP was almost done, so the range of control over the injection event is pretty wide. Tuning it will be interesting for sure!

 

[Leeland]

There was some what of a discussion on timing twin IP's etc on a high horse power IDI thread a while back.

 

[Greg5OH]

The progressive linkage would be similest and easiest IMO, like a mechanical secondary carb. Very cool idea, post pics!!

 

[justinray]

Timing wouldn't be a task with 2 ip's, just time each individually by killing the FSS on the one not being timed.

 

[justinray]

I have been thinking about this for a while, just use a shift light to engage the second pumps fss, find out what rpm your engine hits peak torque with only one ip, then set the switch to come on at that rpm, would give a nice flat torque curve with a bit of a rise. You could also move the switch higher and lower based on what said engine was putting out for egt's.

 

[WisdomWarlord]

My understanding is that the FSS kills fuel to part of the IP. If that's true, doesn't that mean the IP with the FSS turned off would be turning at half crank speed with no fuel circulating inside it, and therefore no lubrication, since the fuel flowing through the IP is the IP's lubricating medium?

 

[justinray]

I thought it only killed the fuel to the injectors, not the flow through the pump.

 

[laserjock]

That tractor is freakin cool. I think that is an interesting way to deal with the fueling problem.

 

[jwalterus]

my only question is: will it still start in january?