icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
The hypermax intercooler hat fits the turbo and the intake with no adjustments. Sadly that same hat will not fit my Banks sidewinder turbo without modifications.
Do i need an intercooler for the Bull Moose pump?
- Thread starter Shawn MacAnanny
- Start date
jhenegh
Truck Still Earns its Keep
I had a factory turbo, bull moose and new stock injectors and I could spike EGT too easily for my liking. Smoke on demand and 1300+ EGT was seen once.
Your current 7psi is seen because that is where the factory wastegate is set at (mine was there too). Most would agree you could adjust the gate to 10-12psi on a stock engine and get a little more air in. I ended up inteercooling mine a few months after installing the bull moose and no longer have any EGT issues. Before, while towing, even with the slightest headwind, I was stuck with 50MPH and no overdrive because of 1000+F EGT. No longer an issue with more boost and an intercooler.
If I didn't tow I'd personally be looking at Moose junior (and was originally gonna get one but I found a barely used Bull Moose for sale on this forum and bought it instead for cheaper)
Your current 7psi is seen because that is where the factory wastegate is set at (mine was there too). Most would agree you could adjust the gate to 10-12psi on a stock engine and get a little more air in. I ended up inteercooling mine a few months after installing the bull moose and no longer have any EGT issues. Before, while towing, even with the slightest headwind, I was stuck with 50MPH and no overdrive because of 1000+F EGT. No longer an issue with more boost and an intercooler.
If I didn't tow I'd personally be looking at Moose junior (and was originally gonna get one but I found a barely used Bull Moose for sale on this forum and bought it instead for cheaper)
2 fwiw notes
1 with my non gated banks on the 88 , bb's and a junior moose 1000* was no sweat anytime the 5er was on the back.
2 having ridden in Idiots 6 door prior to the meltdown, ( watching the gauges while we took the newley timmed rig out for a rail) see to RAIL.
I vote ic should be nessary anytime you mat the pedal!
Mel is the guru' so heed his input.
1 with my non gated banks on the 88 , bb's and a junior moose 1000* was no sweat anytime the 5er was on the back.
2 having ridden in Idiots 6 door prior to the meltdown, ( watching the gauges while we took the newley timmed rig out for a rail) see to RAIL.
I vote ic should be nessary anytime you mat the pedal!Mel is the guru' so heed his input.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
Well today i got a chance to use the Ferret timing meter i ordered. With the engine hot from the drive home, i checked it at 2000rpm and found my timing was at 4 degrees. I am using an INNOVA 3568 timing light. I noticed every now and then the crank line would jump off of 0 but i figured it was just the ferret meter glitching. I sanded the fuel line and installed it with the engine off. im sure its making good contact. I increased the timing to between 6 and 7 since i read that seems to be a good spot for turbos. I noticed theres actually smoke when i rev the engine now and when i accelerate. Like not a lot, but before there would never be any smoke. I also noticed i couldnt seem to get boost above 6psi. EGTs seem about the same.
I think i'm going to go ahead and install the bull moose pump, and misters, and just carefully drive it. I dont tow with it, i daily drive it around 150-200 miles a day, 95% highway 55-65mph.
I am going to fill up first thing tomorrow, run another 600 miles and see if the timing made fuel ecconomy better or worse. I record everything in the fuelly app. Then i'll swap the injection pump and injectors. Its suprisingly easy to time. I had bought that fancy snap on wrench, it doesnt fit, ill have to grind it alot thinner toget it to fit i think. I was able to just use an offset 9/16" and stubby 14mm (because i dont have any stubby standard) to get to the two hard to reach nuts.
I'm strongly considering the hypermax intercooler, or making my own - it seems really nice but not $1450 nice, a good intercooler should be only $500 and the piping $300 tops. I only have a DC tig so it'd have to be stainless if i made my own piping. It doesn't seem like its going to hurt anything installing it but it sounds like the additional power may require me to install a new clutch.
I think i'm going to go ahead and install the bull moose pump, and misters, and just carefully drive it. I dont tow with it, i daily drive it around 150-200 miles a day, 95% highway 55-65mph.
I am going to fill up first thing tomorrow, run another 600 miles and see if the timing made fuel ecconomy better or worse. I record everything in the fuelly app. Then i'll swap the injection pump and injectors. Its suprisingly easy to time. I had bought that fancy snap on wrench, it doesnt fit, ill have to grind it alot thinner toget it to fit i think. I was able to just use an offset 9/16" and stubby 14mm (because i dont have any stubby standard) to get to the two hard to reach nuts.
I'm strongly considering the hypermax intercooler, or making my own - it seems really nice but not $1450 nice, a good intercooler should be only $500 and the piping $300 tops. I only have a DC tig so it'd have to be stainless if i made my own piping. It doesn't seem like its going to hurt anything installing it but it sounds like the additional power may require me to install a new clutch.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
Just curious but what type of mileage are you seeing with your setup? It sound like you regularly drive it too like i do. I see 14.4 to 15.5 which i dont think is terrible but i think i can make it better, i average 44-48mpg is the passat tdi i have, i'm an easy driver.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
What is the difference between the Hypermax pulse intercooler and the factory turbo one? i see the intake hat has two inlets and the factory turbo intercooler comes with a different wastegate actuator? Does anyone use a boost controller for the waste gate control or do they not work with diesels?
http://www.gohypermax.com/ProductDisplay.aspx?ID=c3b62dc7-ee0a-4a56-aae9-882fd653b776
http://www.gohypermax.com/ProductDisplay.aspx?ID=609d8d58-1275-42db-a6c0-930988464089
http://www.gohypermax.com/ProductDisplay.aspx?ID=c3b62dc7-ee0a-4a56-aae9-882fd653b776
http://www.gohypermax.com/ProductDisplay.aspx?ID=609d8d58-1275-42db-a6c0-930988464089
this is the innercooler i used.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNIVERSAL-L...ash=item27c4c85d6e:g:R04AAOSwMmBV5Jjl&vxp=mtr
http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNIVERSAL-L...ash=item27c4c85d6e:g:R04AAOSwMmBV5Jjl&vxp=mtr
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Difference between the two kits is the piping. The two different turbo kits locate the turbo in a different location, so the pipes would be bent differently.
Personally, I bought an eBay intercooler, and an eBay 2.25 aluminum piping kit, 2 2.25 to 3 inch 90 degree boots and went to work. It was stupid simple other than welding a stub of pipe on the turbo intake snail to make a good solid connection there. I had a shop do that for me.
I posted a link earlier in the thread of the specifics.
Here is my install thread.
http://www.oilburners.net/forums/sh...-snail-seals-and-intercooler-pics!&highlight=
Btw, abut 350 bucks in all this.
Personally, I bought an eBay intercooler, and an eBay 2.25 aluminum piping kit, 2 2.25 to 3 inch 90 degree boots and went to work. It was stupid simple other than welding a stub of pipe on the turbo intake snail to make a good solid connection there. I had a shop do that for me.
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I posted a link earlier in the thread of the specifics.
Here is my install thread.
http://www.oilburners.net/forums/sh...-snail-seals-and-intercooler-pics!&highlight=
Btw, abut 350 bucks in all this.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
Did you ever fix you boost loss issue? I think this guy is on to something with running the wategate off of the intake hat for sure. I dont think it would make much of a difference if it was the stock setup but defnitely with an IC
Waste gate is actuated off the intake hat port now. I am used to the boost pressures now. Stands to reason the cooler air contracts a little and thus, the psi is a little lower. Biggest difference is pulling up long grades. I rarely have to shift down because of EGT. Just when the engine starts to get below the power band.
I max out boost around 9.5 now. It's enough, but I think that will get better after a few more mods. I am sure I have some leaks in the hot side causing some loss. Engine is about to come out for a rebuilt engine swap, new typ4 cam, and head studs, and I will address the exhaust piping at that time.
I max out boost around 9.5 now. It's enough, but I think that will get better after a few more mods. I am sure I have some leaks in the hot side causing some loss. Engine is about to come out for a rebuilt engine swap, new typ4 cam, and head studs, and I will address the exhaust piping at that time.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
I think i might try something different than you guys. I might try a water cooled intercooler - cooled/heated with engine coolant. I have a port at the bottom of the radiator i could put from, and return to the top radiator hose. Even if the coolant got to 200F thats probably colder than a non intercooled engine right? I might get a temperature probe and install it into the air intake and see what temperatures are at various boost levels. If i pulled from the engine block and fed straight 195F air through it i wonder what impact it would have on efficiency for fuel ecconomy. I know it's less oxygen but would it provide a better burn for the mixture keeping it a consistent temperature while cruising or accelerating. I'm going to do some research on the optimal intake temperature on a diesel. Even if i tried it, and it didnt work well i'd only be out like $200.
79jasper
Chickenhawk
That's not how a water to air intercooler works. Lol
It uses its own separate cooling system.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
It uses its own separate cooling system.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
Well I know that haha but would 190f iats really hurt a diesel? The more I was thinking about it though it would be safer to run a seprate cooling system as the heavy duty coolant the truck uses is awful for aluminum. Everything I've tested is a ph of 10-11 and no molybdate or tolytriazole. They all use sodium nitrite to protect steel cylinder sleeves from oxygen pitting/cavitation. I added my own to protect my radiator but still have concerns with the aluminum at a ph of 10. A radiator or heater core is much cheaper than a cylinder sleeve though. Having an aluminum heat exchanger jacketed with a coolant of 10.0 plus and a heat load wouldn't be ideal. If it leaked it could hydrolock. I think I'll setup my own water cooled with ****** propylene glycol around 30% and aluminum specific corrosion inhibitors. Water lines are much cheaper and easier to run than ic lines and a water cooled ic is only about 12x12x4. I think it's worth a try
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Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
For instance this setup here is less than $400, i think it'd be ideal because i could install and adjustable thermostat for the intercooler fans, and possibly eventually regulate intercooler temperature with a thermostat of some sort to fine tune the ideal intake temperature. I can tell you with 100% certainty on the same exact tank of fuel in my passat TDI i can average 52mpg on the same trip at 60F during the day and it be 28f in the next morning, take the same trip and only average 44mpg. I think too low of an intake temperature can also hurt fuel ecconomy on a diesel.
http://www.frozenboost.com/liquid-air-intercooler/water-to-air-intercooler-p-1006.html
http://www.frozenboost.com/liquid-air-intercooler/water-to-air-intercooler-p-1006.html
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79jasper
Chickenhawk
Damn, $299 is a steal.
I don't know what it is with the tdi's, but they do like warmer Temps. I've noticed the same. Ours was sticking around low 30 mid-high 20's during the cold. Finally went back up when the Temps came up.
But these bigger engines don't shed heat as well.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
I don't know what it is with the tdi's, but they do like warmer Temps. I've noticed the same. Ours was sticking around low 30 mid-high 20's during the cold. Finally went back up when the Temps came up.
But these bigger engines don't shed heat as well.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
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