My E4OD is a werewolf!!!

[LCAM-01XA]

Or maybe just a wolf - either way, she howls pretty good, she's nice and quiet at idle but from 1000 rpms up she howls and whines. This is mostly noticeable in park and neutral, not so much when there's a load on it while driving. ATF is still pink and there's not even a hint of burnt smell, I think the level is good too but with the lovely design of these dipsticks I can't really see too well in the dark with the headlights shining on it... Will low ATF level cause the werewolf behavior?

 

[david85]

Torque converter buzz?

My AOD does that ALL the time but doesn't seem to hurt anything. My E4OD on the other hand never did. Some E4OD shift kits claim to cure it though

Does it happen while driving under load? How about engine braking?

 

[87crewdually]

Second the torque converter. Also side note check that ATF in daylight, it should be red, not pink. Pink is a sign of contamination of water in the fluid.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

That's what I'm thinking, converter buzz, but it started all of sudden, wasn't there last time I drove the truck which was on Monday. I didn't drive the truck today in any different manner than I always do, which is putting along at 43-44 mph turning at 2000 rpms in 3rd gear with the converter locked. No noise under engine braking tho, none whatsoever.

I'll double check on the fluid tomorrow in daylight, I don't expect any water contamination in it cause I don't go through rivers and stuff, but it could be low...

 

[OLDBULL8]

I towed my 25 ft. GN yesterday with my 99, but it has the 4R100 in it, almost the same as a E4OD. I started to have a strange whirring noise when I let up on the throttle, didn't do it empty (not towing) on the way back. I kind of suspect something is going kaput with the TC. I'll know if it flies apart.

Check fluid level HOT and engine running in idle.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Yeah, I'll have her idling for good 10-15 minutes before I go check the fluid.

Mine is quieter when I have load on it, such as when accelerating or climbing a hill, then when I let off to where she starts engine braking she quiets down real nice. With the converter unlocked and engine off throttle (basically coasting to a stop) she howls. My converter is an aftermarket unit of some sort, and locks and unlocks real nice, and when locked don't slip one bit both during accel and engine braking.

 

[sootman73]

def sounds like the TC. get that thing out of there quick! any time they start making noise they are gonna go out fairly soon! You could keep driving but i think you know what your risking. It will still lockup just fine. mine didn't make howling noise but it was making a light metal grinding noise if i didn't keep enough load on the motor(or engine braking) My trans guy rode in it and said "Its Bad!, get it out of there now or i'm not gonna cover the trans warranty."

Do you have a valid warranty anymore?

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Oh great, just what I needed to hear! No warranty on the converter, as it wasn't me who replaced it, when I got the truck it was already in there.

But what would cause it to start whining like that all of sudden? Truck hasn't seen a trailer in over a year now, and I mean any trailer, I just use it drive to the parts store and Walmart. Also, as David85 noted some AOD transmissions buzz all their life, and they go for hundreds of thousands of miles... The sound I hear is just like how an AOD howls and whines, no metal grinding sound like what you heard, and actually for a while I thought it was the power steering pump cavitating cause of low fluid. So what's different between AOD and E4OD converters that allows a howling AOD converter to survive for years and years, but makes a howling E4OD converter die a painful and untimely death?

 

[sootman73]

I dunno. how does it shift? does it shift kinda hard or is it pretty soft? do you have a manual TC lockup switch also? sounds like you do by another post i read.... its pretty important to use that thing carefully(i learned that the hard way) i dont use mine much anymore unless i'm off road or pulling a sled.

what kind of converter is it do you know? know any specs?

 

[LCAM-01XA]

She shifts just as firm as usually, after the shift kit and the larger line pressure modulator valve she's not your typical slushbox no more, and I haven't noticed any difference in the way she shifts before and after the howling started.

Yes I do have a manual switch for the TCC, but I use it pretty much the same way the PCM does - only in 3rd and 4th gear, and before I lock it I actually let off the throttle a bit so it's easier on the clutches. Really I only have it so I can keep the converter locked at off throttle situations and have engine braking. The converter unlocks automatically when I touch the brake pedal, and I keep it unlocked in 1st and 2nd gear, also if I'm to downshift from OD into 3rd I'll unlock the converter then downshift then lock it again, which is exactly what the PCM does.

But I can't be running around at 45 mph with the converter unlocked all the time, as it will slips like 500 rpms when under load so I can only imagine how good the ATF would heat up if I were do drive like that for miles and miles. No idea on what the converter actually is tho, other than it's bright red, its front looks beefier than factory converters I've seen, and it has no drain plug in it...

 

[sootman73]

i see. and how many miles on it? i'm just trying to figure out if its just an age thing or a manufacturing issue...

 

[david85]

In the case of the AOD, its mostly air and cavitation inside the torque converter and has more to do with valves than the torque converter itself. It also buzzes strong enough to even feel some of it in the shift lever sometimes. And yeah, its been that way for years without any real issues. Its still the fastest shifting auto I have ever seen.

I really have no idea how common this is to happen with an E4OD though. The AOD has practically no DNA in common with the E4...

If something were to be comming apart inside the torque converter, you likely will have metal showing up on the pan by now. Shifting problems could also be on the way as metal chips get pumped through the valve body. E4OD converters also tend to blow up rather quickly after things first start going south. From what I've heard and read, it can often happen when accelerating just as you approach stall RPM and it doesn't have to be a case of heavy loading either. Right on the thresh hold of 90% slip being taken up.

Here's a silly question.....when was the last time you popped it into 4th? I wonder if there might be an air pocket that could be causing this.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

David, I have an AOD too, or at least had one, she'd buzz so loud in neutral or park I could use the shifter to vibration-stir the sugar in my coffee, lol.

The E4OD, I know the factory converters die like you described, this is a different animal tho, too bad I have no idea what it actually is.

She was last into OD yesterday for a few miles, and she was howling both before and after that...

Time to check on that fluid level thing now, will report back on my findings soon.

 

[trackspeeder]

Because the tranny is noisy in neutral and park. Its most likely the converter getting tired. If the whine was continuous in gear, it would be the pump.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Well I couldn't get her to whine today - warmed her up, drove her around a bit, no howling. Crawled under there with a long screwdriver to use as a stethoscope, all I could hear/feel were the vibrations from the engine. Fluid level is good, color is redish, no burnt smell. Shifts through all gears like normal. Now what the heck did I hear yesterday then?