SCAQMD Citation For Smoke

MidnightBlade

Shiftin' Smooth
Joined
Jun 29, 2010
Posts
1,020
Reaction score
2
Location
Johnstown, PA
Some one I know got in an argument with me once (long story) and I know they have an aluminum smelter (melts starters and alternators, anything alum into small bricks of alum.)I heard they are illegal and cause an awful smell and pollute, they're suppossed to have air filters. So being a good citizen I reported to to the local police, EPA, DCNR, and whatever other hippe organization I could find. After 2 weeks of emails and phone calls it got no where.:dunno obviously PA doesn't care about the enviornment and the emission "inspections" are just a scam to get more money to the scumbags that run this state......

-Jon:rolleyes:

very good my friend. have been thinking of saying that myself. Protest anyone?;Sweet:backoff
 

Goofyexponent

Mentally Unstable..
Joined
Jan 7, 2009
Posts
4,567
Reaction score
4
Location
Halifax / Nova Scotia
funny thing about that. The county recently bout a whole bunch of new plow trucks to replace the old ones, and with all the new emissions crap on them they get a whopping 3-4 mpg. Great, they dont smoke and they burn twice as much fuel putting out twice as much exhaust doing the same job. Now the county cant afford to use their nice new emissions compliable trucks.

Agreed 100% I can get 25 MPG Imperial. Try THAT with a new emissions compliant vehicle.

These trucks are designed like the old NTC cummins and whatnot. Bulletproof, easy on fuel and easy to work on.

I wonder how much the vehicle industry pays places like California to "eliminate polluting vehicles" like our IDI's?:rolleyes:
 

Diesel JD

Full Access Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2006
Posts
6,148
Reaction score
7
Location
Gainesville, FL
I think we're already seeing signs that the newer diesels can be evry fuel efficient. The guys at Diesel Power tested a 6.7L Ford a couple issues back and they were getting low to mid 20s US gal. The learning curve was tough and we may still have some more bumps. Personally I think they might have gone a little too far with the emissions regulations. A well tuned IDI isn't a big smoker and certainly a 7.3 PSD is not. The engines that were probably comparable to the old 70s and early 80s gassers when they got rid of the leaded fuel and cracked down on gasoline emissions are probably the 6.0 and 6.4. Loads of power and economy to be had if you could ditch the DPF and other emissions related equipment, if anyone dares.... but maybe the new PSD does pretty well even with what it's saddled with. Having said that, I think anything that reduces fuel economy to reduce emissions could well be a false economy, it depends on the particulars of the situation. I sure wouldn't like to have a huge amount of air pollution to live with. I guess in FL it makes no difference, cause we never really have any air quality issues, the air masses just don't sit here long enough, and we don't really dump our emissions on anybody else in any meaningful way as far as I can tell. The regulations that make sense in LA make no sense here, and even within CA, the regulations that might make sense in LA don't make sense somewhere out in the sticks. I guess the real problem is having enviro-nazis with an anti oil, anti capitalist agenda and empowering them to enforce their wills on the rest of us, rather than fair minded pragmatists who realize the limit of their authority should be to keep the environment from being unfit for human and animal life/health. You people in CA need to take the power back from the radicals.
 

6.9poweredscout

Bleeds IH red...
Joined
Jul 31, 2007
Posts
3,323
Reaction score
14
Location
Northeastern Pa
What I dont like is how California comes up with these laws and then everywhere they are ennacted. OK so LA has smog and needs emissions regulations, that makes sense. By why do I have to follow the same laws when I live 3000 miles away? Take for example the new jerry can they sell. You know, the one with a funny looking hard plastic nozzle. They dont have vents on the top of them, so when you go to fill up your weed eater or chain saw or whatever, gasoline sprays EVERYWHERE. I can spill less gas (or none at all) with an old vented style can than a CARB complient one. Oh and the reason for the change is so no vapors evaporate when you store it. Have any of yall ever left a half filled one out in the sun? The thing swells up like a balloon. And when you open that little cap.....WOOOOOOSH you are engulfed in fumes. Do the expect you to keep that can in the freezer? Boy I could go on and on but yall have hit on most of what I think - especially the point that those with no skills are going to be at the mercy of those with skills when the proverbial **** hits the fan.

couldn't agree with you more, new gas cans SUCK! best bet is ditching the cap when filling and using a good funnel.

and midnightblade, i skipped the **** emissions sticker issue, everything i own is either pre-1975 or diesel!!! ;Sweet;Sweet:rotflmao i love only spending $25 instead of $55!

-jon
 

david85

Full Access Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Posts
4,849
Reaction score
1,114
Location
Campbell River, B.C.
I am encouraged by some of the numbers put out by the new 6.7L, but there isn't much secret to that. Basically what you save in fuel economy, you loose in buying **** water. Also, ford has been gearing their trucks way too low over the last few years and my understanding is the 6.7 comes with a new 6 speed that finally offers a decent top gear final drive ratio. I remember reading some of the accounts of proud new 6.4L owners that were topping out at around 75 MPH in some cases.

You guys know what my truck can do with 20 year old technology so forgive me if I'm unimpressed if they are finally starting to match something 2 decades old. My truck simply doesn't smoke anymore unless I am leaning on the pedal. Idling in direct sunlight, nothing is visible and I have 20/20 vision. Cruising at speeds that consistently deliver 24-25 MPG same thing - no smoke.

What I sometimes try to explain about engines and vehicles in general is there is a limit to how efficient they can be even if you built one with absolutely no reguard for emissions and were strictly concerned with thermal efficiency.

Gasoline internal combustion engines are 30% efficient maximum
Diesels start at 35% and can sometimes reach 40% (50% or more is possible, but only in large low speed diesels).
Gas turbines are also at or around 30%
Tripple expansion steam engiens, 25%
Electric motors, are anywhere from 50% up to 98%

And so on.......

Anything you do to add emission controls or otherwise use power from the engine takes away from that narrow efficiency window so the fuel economy goes down. Its simple physics. Engineers 100 years ago knew how to measure net operating efficiency and understood how to get all of it if needed. Its simply easier to measure today due to better tools at their disposal. Despite all the advances made in engines to make them burn cleaner or make more power, the net thermal efficiency has a ceiling that cannot be exceeded. Basically what it means is when you have something like a VW TDI getting 60 MPG, you are simply closer to that 40% limit. 6.4L getting 14MPG - probably closer to 25%, but the only way to really measure it for sure is stuffing the whole truck into a test lab. Something ford most likely did but since F350s don't have to be MPG tested, we'll never know what those results were.

If the 6.7L has finally begun to undo some of the damage, thats great. But there is still the efficiency limit to consider no matter how advanced the engine might be. Its fact of life that a water jacketed cylinder will vent fast amounts of heat out the exhaust and the cooling package and it makes no difference how precisely you meter the fuel, the maximum efficiency cannot be exceeded.

This is why some of you might remember me ranting and raving that any diesel from our era can reach 20 MPG, weather its an 6.9, 6.5, 6.2 or 5.9 cummins. The physics at play are so close from one engine to another, that it really doesn't matter very much.
 

nyteshades

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2009
Posts
348
Reaction score
0
Location
Tulsa, OK/Ashland, WI
Computer's geeks, air conditioned offices burocrats and all other kinds of society's parasites are going to be in deep trouble soon when power goes off and supermarket shelves got empty.
We "the old timers", the ones with callused hands, the ones seasoned in hardwork and troubles will be the only ones able to put food on the table.
We, "the old timers", will be the only hope this country has to survive. And as "old timers" I don't mean old folks only but any person that cherishes the values that made this country great.
The values that made America "the land of the free and the home of the brave".
The Lord have mercy of us.

Not everyone that sits behind a desk, or that can fix/program computers is a parasite and incapable of fending for themselves. I just decided long ago I didn't want to wrench for a living, or stand outside in the hot sun welding a boat dock made of drill pipe in a goat pasture. And if it wasn't for parasites like me, you wouldn't be able to sit in front of your monitor ranting about how worthless we are on a website.
 

burtcheca

farmer/cabinetmaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Posts
434
Reaction score
0
Location
Live Oak, Fl.
Shades,
I'm talking about values, vision and ethics.
Do you share those values that made America great? Then even behind a desk now, you will have no problem to adapt and to do what you have to do, to take care of your family and neighbors that need it, when the times comes.
I'm not ranting here, but even if I am, it's my right to express my concern. The things that are happening can and will hurt many people. There are some that will take it not as a rant but as good advice and will make the moves and will prepare themselves to take care of their families, now that we still have a chance.
There are some, however, that will react bad to this warnings. They will use the insults and will try to shut us up. They will try, and succeed for a time, to silence the few that have the right information, the vision and the solution, the real solution.
You can be one of those with the values, the vision and that are getting ready, maybe you are already one of us. Only you and the Lord know.
But if you react bad to these warnings, if you get offended because you think you are bigger than the trouble that is coming our way, and you take this "rant" and twist it and put the emphasis in what is not, and think the whole idea was to say that you are a parasite, because for reasons only you and the Lord know, you are behind a desk for a time now. Then my friend you are part of the problem and you will join those that believe in shuting some people up because they don't agree with what they are saying, they get "offended" and make us a "danger".
Too bad you are in OK, if you were my neighbor, when the time comes (and it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when) you and your family will not go hungry because I will share our food with you, because while you were making good money behind a desk I'm sure that you were sharing it with those in need also. That's what I'm talking about: Love your neighbor as yourself. It's love what moves me to sound the trumpet, it's love what will move us to take care of each other when the moment comes.
Maybe you are already one of us. Only you and the Lord know.
(I didn't step up in the soap box this time)
Your friend, Burt.
 
Last edited:

nyteshades

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2009
Posts
348
Reaction score
0
Location
Tulsa, OK/Ashland, WI
Burtcheca,

The only offense I take is being lumped into a stereotype that all "computer geeks" are disconnected with reality and can't survive without their "puter". I was raised in the mountains of Colorado by my parents and grandmother. My Dad was raised on a farm in Iowa....with the midwest ethics and values that you put your family first, work hard, a man's word is his bond, and was taught to repair most things on my own. My mother was the oldest child of 3, who lost her father when she was 6. She raised my sister and I to be fiercely independent, depend on no one but ourselves, and to think for ourselves. My grandmother was raised in the depression and beat into us Christian morals, as well as the value of money. You have to make do with what you have...and do what you can to get by.

I've worked as a mechanic since I was 8, helping my old man with his beaters. As well as teach me about cars, I was taught to fix just about anything in the house. I often tease my father about my abused childhood, while other kids were playing video games, and had the nice toys...I was in the garage learning trades and life skills. I've served in the Air Force, worked construction, driven a truck, wrenched for a time, done manual labor, and finally decided on a career in computers. I taught myself how to fix pc's and 10 yrs into a career, I put myself through college which I finished at the ripe old age of 33.

I have 2 kids, an ex-wife, on wife #2, and a disdain for any SOB in DC or the state capital that tells me they know what I need or how I should live my life. I drink, I smoke, and I ride motorcycles (some times at the track at triple digits with my knee on the ground, and a huge smile on my face). I hunt, fish, camp, and backpack. I enjoy being miles away from anyone, or anything, in a mountain canyon watching an eagle ride the thermals and the sunset behind the mountains. I have 3 dogs that I love like they are my children. In all honesty, I have much more compassion for animals than I do people. I'll speak my mind when forced and not be afraid to do so, wither I am right or wrong in my position. I'll make no apologies for it either, but I will promise it'll be honest.

All I know is there's a balance to be had with everything, in politics, in nature, in relationships, in science, in faith, and within ourselves. I believe most people are too arrogant, and too stupid, to understand that need for balance. I haven't a clue what impending doom you are referring to. As far as the country goes, well...I personally believe the sooner we get back to honoring the Constitution and following those ideals, the better off we'll be.

I don't know if all that makes me part of the problem, or not.....but I do know, just because I sit behind a desk and work in the world of computers doesn't mean I don't understand, or am incapable, of working with my hands, fending for myself, providing for my family, sweating, valuing a hard days work, nor have I forgotten what made this country great and the price that has been paid for that greatness, and I'll fight to the death to protect those I love. .

A parasite are those able body people sitting on their ***** watching Springer and Oprah, eating ho ho's and pepsi bought off food stamps, living in a house paid for by welfare, and complaining that they have to go drive to the store in their Escalade because the 6 kids need milk and diapers. All the while ******** that Obama and his marxist regime aren't doing enough to support their lifestyle and blaming Bush (while he wasn't the best president, he was no where near this horrible) for everything that's wrong in the world.

No sir, I am not a parasite
 
Last edited:

snicklas

6.0 and Loving It!!
Staff member
Joined
Aug 7, 2006
Posts
6,168
Reaction score
2,350
Location
Greenfield, Indiana
This is my OPINION, please take it that way........

I have been watching this thread, and I can see various viewpoints on this subject. I understand where everyone is coming from, and what I am seeing is there is alot of "one way, period" viewpoints, and someone said it before, that both sides need to work together and make a compromise, rather than digging in and refusing to give, which is part of the problem now.

This is not a "set in stone" statement, but is seems like the two main viewpoints are either, no regulation, let us do what we want and it will be okay, or, things need to be locked down, and tightly controlled. I have seen some in-between but not as many as I would hope to. I do think there needs to be a compromise, to make things better for everyone in the future. Do I think we need to be completely controlled, and have everything locked down to the point that if you fart, they give you a pollution violation citation, no I do not. However, I do not think there should be absoutely no rules on pollution, because at that point we will have many "gross polluters" and things will be far worse that they are now. I think there should be some type of control over pollution with a reasonable set of guidelines. These guidelines should allow for things to run smoothly, and efficently, but prevent massive ammounts of pollution from being expelled... I think the citizen turning in citizen "snitch lines" are way out of bounds. However, there would have to be oversite to make sure the guidelines are being followed.

I have a "desk job" working for one of the largest communication corporations in the world. My job is one that makes you ability to use your phone, "wireless device" and the internet possible. Having this type of job does not make me think the world is fine, and go along "dumb, fat and happy". I do enjoy working on/with and repairing computers. However, contrary to the "computer geek stereotype" that may people have of me is farther than the truth. When I am not at work, I am not at home glued to my computer, or the TV for that matter. When I am away from here I enjoy being outside, camping or boating. I have a camper, and enjoy having the ability to use and enjoy the great outdoors. I also enjoy working on mechanical things. I collect, use and "restore" IH Cub Cadet Garden Tractors. I enjoy being a diesel enthusist, and hope to be able to continue that "habit". I take my kids out and try to teach them how to wrench when I ma working on something, the only one that has interest right now is my 2 year old. I have the Ex that Travis was referring to, and I did not buy it because to was an emission controlled vehicle. I bought it because that is what I wanted. I really like the truck, and am very happy that it is a 6.0PSD Diesel. It does not smoke, and on the rare occasion that it does, it means that I have not worked it hard in the last few days, and a couple of hard accelerations or a heavy tow clears that up. Now that is not to say that I do not like smoke shows, in the proper place. I have rolled a little coal in the Goat Truck, and one of my all-time favorite things is going to a Tractor Pull and watching the diesel stockers rolling a huge load of coal.

I and my children all enjoy the outdoors. We enjoy being able to camp, boat, swim and occasionally fish. We enjoy being able to spend time in the backyard, and be able to garden. I want my children and grandchildren to be able to pass on the enjoyment of being able to go outside and enjoy nature, work in the yard and garden without having to wear an SCBA and sunscreen with the SFP Factor of mayonaise.

A middleground is were things need to be headed, but what I see things will still be, very one way or the other.... and right now, the ones that are wanting regulation are winning.

A program that I see personally is the one that is being used in Indianapolis / Marion County Indiana. On days that meet certain criteria, (right now heat and humidity levels) that have what are call KNOZONE Action Days. These days RECOMEND to carpool, do not idle in drive-thru's, combine tasks and wait until after 6 PM to fill fuel tanks. They are doing this to raise awareness to the air quality in the Greater Indianapolis Area, so that thru voulentary actions, we can keep the air quality levels where they should be, so they DO NOT have to enact regulations...... and this does seem to be working.
 

snicklas

6.0 and Loving It!!
Staff member
Joined
Aug 7, 2006
Posts
6,168
Reaction score
2,350
Location
Greenfield, Indiana
nyteshades,

It looks like you and I have several things in common.

Also, well said..... there needs to be a balance in all things. I to love to be miles away from anyone (except my family). I had someone ask me once about going camping, and they just really didnt get it...... their opinion was I can sit a home and relax and not have to drive to the middle of nowhere and "pay to relax". They asked what I did if my cell phone did not work when I was at the campground. My answer to that was be happy that it doesnt work. They could not fathom being without a cell phone all weekend........
 

MidnightBlade

Shiftin' Smooth
Joined
Jun 29, 2010
Posts
1,020
Reaction score
2
Location
Johnstown, PA
couldn't agree with you more, new gas cans SUCK! best bet is ditching the cap when filling and using a good funnel.

and midnightblade, i skipped the **** emissions sticker issue, everything i own is either pre-1975 or diesel!!! ;Sweet;Sweet:rotflmao i love only spending $25 instead of $55!

-jon

and we only have emissions in some counties with 50,000 or more people i think. and here in cambria we got 50,001, just my luck. lol. and they are thinking of pasing a law that you need a DPF on your diesel if it came stock with one now. again que the 80's:D
 

nyteshades

Full Access Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2009
Posts
348
Reaction score
0
Location
Tulsa, OK/Ashland, WI
nyteshades,

It looks like you and I have several things in common.

Also, well said..... there needs to be a balance in all things. I to love to be miles away from anyone (except my family). I had someone ask me once about going camping, and they just really didnt get it...... their opinion was I can sit a home and relax and not have to drive to the middle of nowhere and "pay to relax". They asked what I did if my cell phone did not work when I was at the campground. My answer to that was be happy that it doesnt work. They could not fathom being without a cell phone all weekend........

;Sweet I think career IT people are in the same boat anymore. They are plugged in 24x7 and when they get a chance to get away....being totally unplugged is the best vacation.

I'm heading back to Colorado in 2 weeks to go camping for a week with family. My boss asked me if I was taking my phone. I said yep, but won't do any good....there's lousy cell reception and txt's aren't much better. The only way to get a hold of me is carrier pigeon, and if I see a pigeon in the mountains I'm just going to shoot it, because I know it's from you.

The Chinese have known for 1000's of year life is about balance. The Indians knew it too. I think Californians understood that at one point as well, back in the day. They saw the effects of strip mining and overcrowding in the east and didn't want it to happen out west. I can certainly respect that. In the last 150 years, technology has evolved so fast that balance has been thrown out the window. As with all things, now we're seeing the opposite end of the spectrum in the form of the EPA, tree huggers, and political agenda's based on "scientific" evidence that is narrow in scope. Hopefully sooner rather than later, we'll find a common middle ground. Climate change is a political fad that's about run it's course. In the 70's it was limited oil, in the 80's it was the Ozone layer, in the 90's global warming started. We're due for a new global menace. Maybe this time it will be something useful like....reality tv sucking the will to live or something.
 
Last edited:

snicklas

6.0 and Loving It!!
Staff member
Joined
Aug 7, 2006
Posts
6,168
Reaction score
2,350
Location
Greenfield, Indiana
;Sweet I think career IT people are in the same boat anymore. They are plugged in 24x7 and when they get a chance to get away....being totally unplugged is the best vacation.

I'm heading back to Colorado in 2 weeks to go camping for a week with family. My boss asked me if I was taking my phone. I said yep, but won't do any good....there's lousy cell reception and txt's aren't much better. The only way to get a hold of me is carrier pigeon, and if I see a pigeon in the mountains I'm just going to shoot it, because I know it's from you.

I agree completely. Sometime the best thing to do is hold down a lawn chair and watch the campfire burn.... and think about NOTHING!!!!!

I would shoot it also..... At one time, I was the only IT guy for 2 centers, 400 miles apart, and I was on call 24x7x365....... I was glad when that finally changed.....
 

burtcheca

farmer/cabinetmaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Posts
434
Reaction score
0
Location
Live Oak, Fl.
Well, I'm not going to "rant" anymore. With one condition only: Nobody in DC or at EPA try to mess with my "road kills", that's were I draw the line!:rotflmao
For those city folks: Road kills are the critters you find on the road early in the morning, killed by some car or truck in the middle of the night when they were crossing. They can range from an opposum to a deer.
Shades, you are one of the good ones. You said you were in the Air Force, we thank you for your service. May the Lord our God bless you and keep you alert so you can be a blessing to others and take care of your children when things come crashing down.
Sometimes I wish I'm wrong.
Your brother and friend Burt, a Florida *******.
 
Last edited:

NapaBavarian

Dually driver 6.9
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
Posts
2,032
Reaction score
4
Location
Napa CA
I call them spill gauranteed, not spill proof ;Sweet the first thing that happens to mine is a very small drill bit penetrating the highest point, not so much as to slosh, but enough to avoid pressure buildup or vacume from destroying my can, now the nozel can work as it should, don't expect it to let air in while pouring, that leads to spills, just enough to keep the air pressure at ambiant.

What I dont like is how California comes up with these laws and then everywhere they are ennacted. OK so LA has smog and needs emissions regulations, that makes sense. By why do I have to follow the same laws when I live 3000 miles away? Take for example the new jerry can they sell. You know, the one with a funny looking hard plastic nozzle. They dont have vents on the top of them, so when you go to fill up your weed eater or chain saw or whatever, gasoline sprays EVERYWHERE. I can spill less gas (or none at all) with an old vented style can than a CARB complient one. Oh and the reason for the change is so no vapors evaporate when you store it. Have any of yall ever left a half filled one out in the sun? The thing swells up like a balloon. And when you open that little cap.....WOOOOOOSH you are engulfed in fumes. Do the expect you to keep that can in the freezer? Boy I could go on and on but yall have hit on most of what I think - especially the point that those with no skills are going to be at the mercy of those with skills when the proverbial **** hits the fan.

He who said middle ground, I'd tend to agree, what bites me is people who use this to get back at someone who drives a vehicle they don't like, some people don't understand trucks and seem to think all people should drive a brand new little car and sing coom by ah and sit around the camp fire and make smores...
 

Forum statistics

Threads
91,376
Posts
1,131,372
Members
24,177
Latest member
RangerDanger

Members online

Top