Which Moose pump?

[Alwaysreadyrob]

What dou you mean by clean out a stock pump

I have no clue on the fuel amounts available on the moose pumps, but an 093 with the wastegate locked down can clean up a maxed out stock pump, and push 12-15 psi doing so.

?

 

[pelky350]

Meaning when full spool there is little smoke(unburmt fuel)

What dou you mean by clean out a stock pump

?

 

[Dieselcrawler]

Mel and some of the other guys were there when we played with my timing on my old 94 at Mel's last pa rally. We set it for 8.5, then 9.5 then 10.5. 10.5 it lost power. 9.5 made more hp and tq than 8.5. So I always try and set them around 9-9.5. When I installed Rich's pump, it was way retarded. I never line up the little lines, just toss it on. He got to hear one at close to 1 degree. So I loosened and advanced it. Now we were at close to 11, so backed it down in a few steps and nailed it in at 9.5

 

[centennial60]

Thanks for the input!
Why 6*?
Corey's got more than a bit of experience and his preferred timing is 9.5* which is where we set my truck. With the wastegate unplugged, it's making 10-12 psi with egt's at 1050* and the coolant right at 210*. 7-9 psi with the wastegate hose connected. It feels strong and is reasonably clean...

Sounds like you could benefit form more fuel if you are only hitting 1050 deg F. But not having to keep a close eye on the pyro would be nice. I had my timing set at 9.5* and then set it down to 6.5* just to try it. I like the way it ran at 9.5 better so I will be setting it back up. Probably set it to 8.5-9 and call it good. One thing to think about is timing has a big effect on cylinder pressures. the more advanced the higher the pressure.

 

[saburai]

Sounds like you could benefit form more fuel if you are only hitting 1050 deg F. But not having to keep a close eye on the pyro would be nice. I had my timing set at 9.5* and then set it down to 6.5* just to try it. I like the way it ran at 9.5 better so I will be setting it back up. Probably set it to 8.5-9 and call it good. One thing to think about is timing has a big effect on cylinder pressures. the more advanced the higher the pressure.

I'm quite happy with not having to eagle eye the pyrometer. Let's hope it stays that way when I'm towing the 30 ft TT.

 

[HS108]

I personally have mine timed to 9.4 BTDC, runs good, unsure of EGTs tho, and it does smoke a little more than it used too and more than I would like

When I went to time it I was at 2* ATDC and it ran fine honestly, only thing that made me thing something was off, is when I started burning out glow plugs and I read that it could be from very retarded timing, thus why I checked

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[FORDF250HDXLT]

Watch this video, dyno run shows 7* BTDC makes most HP out of the runs he did.

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I've never dynoed my truck but I tried the 9 and 9.5 BTDC for a whole season last year.I timed it back to 7 BTDC and I didn't need a dyno to tell me,that my truck had more power.It was pretty obvious.I don't understand how our trucks can like such different timing settings than others,than perhaps our local fuel supplies maybe.
The biggest difference I feel between 9 and 7 BTDC is that the truck no longer feels held back rolling down the road.With the higher timing,it felt held back and restricted like more back pressure was introduced if this helps explain it best.
I've always voted for 7 BTDC. (I've never tried 6 yet.)
This is with chip truck
'93 F250 dully,dump convert.
7.3L IDI
Banks wastegated sidewinder.
Intercooler.
Bull Moose IP.
G code fuel injectors.
Hypermax smoke puff limiter.
E4OD trans.
3.55 gears.
8k lb curb weight.

Log truck,my '93 F450 came with a reman IP,timed @ 8 BTDC and I've never touched it.I figure with 5.13 gears,it's going to feel just as much like a tractor anywhere between the timing ditches of 6 to 10 that I doubt I could feel a difference and fuel economy with this truck means 0% to me as it makes so much $ per trip.

Corey, how is the install going? Guys, I'm sorry I'm just not on here as much as I used to be. The business keeps getting busier, and I've built and sold 20 Moose pumps in the last 2 months, and demand remains strong. I'm glad you are all able to carry on the work of helping people.

Great news Mel! It's hard to hold back the train once people figure out what the best of the best is.Keep on keeping on.

 

[HS108]

Good to know I prob get the same fuel you do living in New England, I just bought my own meter and plan to go down on the timing, I’m not liking the 9.5 due to the amount of smoke, I don’t know if the timing is what is causing it, but i know I’m getting more smoke since I changed my timing.

Hopefully next spring I can install a new pump and injectors. I have a set of new BBs ready to go in, just gotta decide what pump I wanna go with.

No matter what pump I decide on I will be running a hypermax puff limiter on it tho.




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[Hydro-idi]

Tried around 6 btdc and my rig ran ok. Then I timed it to about 9.5 and that made a huge difference in power. 8-9.5 is recommended timing numbers for these engines. They seem to run the best.

 

[FORDF250HDXLT]

Tried around 6 btdc and my rig ran ok. Then I timed it to about 9.5 and that made a huge difference in power. 8-9.5 is recommended timing numbers for these engines. They seem to run the best.

Say's the guy living in a state which demands high cetane fuel (quicker burning fuel)

California diesel fuel has a minimum cetane of 53

Cetane number - Wikipedia

Here in Maine we're probably lucky if it's the minimum of 40 and more like an actual 38.
(I don't have a clue what it is but I bet it sure isn't anywhere near 53.)

 

[chillman88]

I personally have mine timed to 9.4 BTDC, runs good, unsure of EGTs tho, and it does smoke a little more than it used too and more than I would like

When I went to time it I was at 2* ATDC and it ran fine honestly, only thing that made me thing something was off, is when I started burning out glow plugs and I read that it could be from very retarded timing, thus why I checked

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I'd love to toss a meter on mine now and then retard it where it was when I picked it up. Mine was fully retarded when I got it. I think someone just tossed a pump on and didn't care. I timed mine by seat of the pants and it's where it feels perfect but it's all the way advanced too. NA 7.3 I was a couple degrees retarded from where I am now and you could feel a BIG difference when the cold advance turned off. I'm hoping to get a new pump and injectors soon. Pretty sure my injectors are stock at 185k

 

[Thewespaul]

I time na trucks at 9.5 and turbo trucks at 8. Last turbo idi I did it came to me at 2* and just adjusting it to 8 made a huge difference, like as big of a difference as having your secondaries not opening on a carb and then finally fixing it. Big difference.

I always go less timing on turbo trucks because they have more cylinder pressure because of the additional psi being forced into the intake. More pressure more heat means a quicker burn. Na trucks need a bit more time to burn that fuel.

 

[Agnem]

I think a good point has been made here, in that the cetane value of the fuel is a major factor in what timing works best. All the numbers that get kicked around are in pulse method discussions, because that IS the way that works best. However, if you go back to the original 6.9 specs, the method used at that time was luminosity, and luminosity required that you know your cetane value, and you referred to a chart to time ACCORDING to the cetane value. Ideally, we would have a cetane value timing chart for the pulse method, but we don't. This thread appears to be addressing that, but there is not enough science behind it for anything to be conclusive. SO, the factory spec is 8.5 degrees PLUS or MINUS 2 degrees. That means that by the "law" anybody running 6.5 degrees to 10.5 degrees is not wrong. However, all of us that time know how much of a difference 2 degrees can make, so we always tend to time according to what our experience shows the local fuel requires. Unfortunately, for those who travel a long distance to get timing done, unless you have enough fuel that you are running your home fuel when you get timed, there is no guarantee that your performance will be equal once you get back to where you normally buy fuel.

 

[saburai]

I think a good point has been made here, in that the cetane value of the fuel is a major factor in what timing works best. All the numbers that get kicked around are in pulse method discussions, because that IS the way that works best. However, if you go back to the original 6.9 specs, the method used at that time was luminosity, and luminosity required that you know your cetane value, and you referred to a chart to time ACCORDING to the cetane value. Ideally, we would have a cetane value timing chart for the pulse method, but we don't. This thread appears to be addressing that, but there is not enough science behind it for anything to be conclusive. SO, the factory spec is 8.5 degrees PLUS or MINUS 2 degrees. That means that by the "law" anybody running 6.5 degrees to 10.5 degrees is not wrong. However, all of us that time know how much of a difference 2 degrees can make, so we always tend to time according to what our experience shows the local fuel requires. Unfortunately, for those who travel a long distance to get timing done, unless you have enough fuel that you are running your home fuel when you get timed, there is no guarantee that your performance will be equal once you get back to where you normally buy fuel.

Thanks Mel, good point. For those of us who do travel and tow, what would you suggest as a good and safe timing? Futher, would you recommend a different setting for a NA vs. turbo engine? I understand that trial and error on a individual basis would be the ideal process. For those of us who don't have the luxury of a method to adjust timing in route, what are your thoughts?

 

[Thewespaul]

Thanks Mel, good point. For those of us who do travel and tow, what would you suggest as a good and safe timing? Futher, would you recommend a different setting for a NA vs. turbo engine? I understand that trial and error on a individual basis would be the ideal process. For those of us who don't have the luxury of a method to adjust timing in route, what are your thoughts?

Here’s a good read for ya
http://www.conestogadiesel.com/support/fordiditechsection.html