Source for new 7.3 IDI engine?

[Dogdude222]

I have a 93 F250 7.3 IDI non turbo. Truck actually runs pretty well, but has a rough idle with intermittent white smoke. Consumes a fair amount of oil on the highway. I took it into a respected local diesel shop who said that it needs new heads due to bad valve guides. They quoted me $5k to do this, which seems high. The truck actually has a pretty good body and bones to it, so I'd rather spend a little bit more and have a new or trusted reman complete engine given that the bottom end has 260k with unknown history otherwise. I'm also nearly certain that the transmission was replaced at some point because it just runs too damn smooth for a truck with 260k. Local shop quoted me 10-12k for an engine replacement, which also seems very high.

I'm pretty handy and have access to a buddy with a big shop. I feel relatively confident that we can do an engine swap in a couple of days, especially after seeing just how few connections this fully mechanical diesel has. My buddy has done two engines on 460 gas OBS trucks already, and this seems simpler, though heavier.

Can anyone recommend a source for new or reman 7.3 IDI's? I'd love to upgrade to a factory turbo setup if possible. I cannot get the local International dealer to call me back, though I doubt they still sell them. After reading horror stories of bad remans on here, I'm somewhat reluctant to go that route without a specific recommendation. I did email Justin at R&D and haven't heard back. I'm also seeing this website for "wholesalediesels.com", but they don't have a phone number listed. Also found "sageparts.com"

Thanks a ton.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Reading the reviews, wholesale diesels.com sounds questionable at best to me. I couldn't find any engines listed on sageparts.com. I would try R&D. Classic Diesel designs may be another option. Promar is used quite often, but the issues with them is that they don't always properly reinstall the two oil galley plugs that are behind the cam gear. This can cause one or both of the plugs to fall out when under oil pressure. It also causes a loss of oil pressure after that happens. If you are aware of this and take precautions before you install the engine, then they seem to be pretty good. Other than that, as far as I know, you are left with finding a qualified individual to rebuild yours or rebuilding your engine yourself.
Before you go out and buy another engine, answer some questions. How did the shop come to the conclusion that the valve guides are bad? Has there been any "chuffing" in your exhaust? Did the shop pull one or both valve covers and find the telltale sign that the exhaust guides are bad (soot looking stuff around the valves and springs)? Did they do something to tell whether or not there's excessive side to side play in the exhaust valves? If you don't know the answers, I would recommend that you talk to the shop and get some answers. Maybe the valve guides have already been taken care of. 260k miles is quite a lot to not have had some issues with the valve guides on a 7.3, although some engines certainly do run that long and longer without issues. If the guides are bad, why do you want an entire new engine? If the lower end of the engine is good, then why not have the heads redone instead?

 

[Dogdude222]

I'll answer the heads/valve guide questions first. Basically they wouldn't tell me specifically exactly how they came to that conclusion other than that they had "seen and done a ton of these 10-15 years ago." They said they "ran some tests" with it cold and hot. I asked if they pulled the valve covers and that was a hard no. I pushed as hard as I could to get specific answers, but they wouldn't let me talk directly to the tech who is actually the brother of the owner/gentleman that I spoke to. He just basically said, "look my brother says it needs heads, he knows."

I'm not sure what you mean by "chuffing", but the truck will intermittently just have a puff of white smoke at idle.

The reason I'm leaning towards the complete engine is that I actually have the skills and tools to replace an engine. I don't have a machine shop. There was only one stand alone machine shop in town (Missoula, MT) and unfortunately he passed away. The diesel shop that I took the truck to apparently has an in-house machine shop. Even just to machine the heads they wanted 3k plus. I would rather spend a bit more to have a completely fresh engine than spend less to have basically the same amount of labor and an unknown bottom end. The money isn't as big of a deal to me as value for money and having a reliable truck for the future.

I'm not seeing engines on classic diesel designs site. I guess I'll try to call Justin at R&D.

 

[Brody]

If the shop you're talking to can't be bothered to explain how they came to the conclusion they did and are treating you like this during the part of the process where they should be trying hard to get your business, you should leave. Find a shop that will explain what they did and will work with you on this. If you go ahead with these guys I have no doubt this will not have a happy ending.

On another note I usually gamble on 500$ motors and just stab em into my truck and hope for the best. I've gambled 3 times doing this and only had one bad motor so far lol

 

[Finn]

White smoke is likely caused by low compression, not faulty valve guides. There’s a procedure out there to measure crankcase pressure using an orifice in place of the cdr. Try that before you pull the heads.

 

[Lonewolf182]

You should be able to get some rebuilt heads cheaper than that, but don't go too cheap. I got some with a 6 month warranty and a month 7 they dropped two valves.

Two or 3 years ago I checked International here in Dallas. They still had the 7.3 turbos for about $8000

 

[TexasTruck]

White smoke and rough idle sounds like dirty injectors.

$5k buys a LOT of oil.

Diesels love their oil

 

[Dogdude222]

If the shop you're talking to can't be bothered to explain how they came to the conclusion they did and are treating you like this during the part of the process where they should be trying hard to get your business, you should leave. Find a shop that will explain what they did and will work with you on this. If you go ahead with these guys I have no doubt this will not have a happy ending.

On another note I usually gamble on 500$ motors and just stab em into my truck and hope for the best. I've gambled 3 times doing this and only had one bad motor so far lol

Yes, I agree. Unfortunately, this is par for the course here in Missoula. Just big enough to have a shop like this, but not big enough for them to have any competition. Based on reviews of the few other dedicated diesel shops, they are the only ones I would trust to do the work right. But I agree, it would be painful. I don't think they care to work for my business because their lot was so packed full of broken Fords, I couldn't find a place to park or get my truck out when I came to pick it up.

White smoke is likely caused by low compression, not faulty valve guides. There’s a procedure out there to measure crankcase pressure using an orifice in place of the cdr. Try that before you pull the heads.

The white smoke is only intermittent. Ovalized valve seats can cause low compression intermittently.

You should be able to get some rebuilt heads cheaper than that, but don't go too cheap. I got some with a 6 month warranty and a month 7 they dropped two valves.

Two or 3 years ago I checked International here in Dallas. They still had the 7.3 turbos for about $8000

Good to know. I'll keep trying to get a quote from the international dealer.

White smoke and rough idle sounds like dirty injectors.

$5k buys a LOT of oil.

Diesels love their oil

Truck has brand new injectors.

Thanks for all of the replies.

 

[Brody]

I don't know the geography where you're at but having a motor shipped somewhere or driving 10 hours might be totally worth it in your case. A weekend of driving or a few hundred in shipping might save you a lot of trouble.

 

[Dogdude222]

I don't know the geography where you're at but having a motor shipped somewhere or driving 10 hours might be totally worth it in your case. A weekend of driving or a few hundred in shipping might save you a lot of trouble.

Absolutely. I am definitely willing to pay shipping. I just want to do this one time and have a nice, reliable truck. Ideal world I end up with a turbo motor too.

 

[264WSM]

Where in MT are you?

 

[SLC97SR5]

I went with a Promar remanufactured unit as my engine was not rebuildable.

I have had the aforementioned oil galley plug pop out from behind the cam gear on my freshly sealed timing cover and a coolant freeze plug from behind the bell housing.

Both failures took a lot of troubleshooting, time and work on my part.

Promar was responsive and communicated well but in the end it was my problem. I'm not sure that any reman would go off flawless although for the money laid out, they should.

If I were to do it over I would roll the dice on a complete, running truck.

 

[Dogdude222]

Where in MT are you?

Missoula/Polson

I went with a Promar remanufactured unit as my engine was not rebuildable.

I have had the aforementioned oil galley plug pop out from behind the cam gear on my freshly sealed timing cover and a coolant freeze plug from behind the bell housing.

Both failures took a lot of troubleshooting, time and work on my part.

Promar was responsive and communicated well but in the end it was my problem. I'm not sure that any reman would go off flawless although for the money laid out, they should.

If I were to do it over I would roll the dice on a complete, running truck.

Thanks for the good data point.

 

[RedTruck]

Would you entertain the idea of a 6.9 in your pickup? What transmission do you have?

 

[aggiediesel01]

Try www.car-part.com put in the basics of what you’re looking for an you might find a decent low to avg mile engine in Idaho or eastern Washington or Oregon.