New turbo, no power

[cozinsky]

I finally got my new turbo install finished today. It's a CDD GTX 3852 with intercooler, 110 pump and stage one injectors. I used a luminosity probe and set the timing as close as I could to 8 degrees at 2,000 rpm. It was all I could do with two prybars to get the pump advanced that far, it's way past the scribe mark. Took it out on a test drive and something is definitely wrong. Under light cruising the boost gauge stays at zero all the time. Moderate acceleration brings it up to 1 or 2 psi, and if I floor the pedal it builds 6 psi max. Tons of black smoke and the egt shoots up almost instantly and I have to let off. I had more power naturally aspirated than I do now.

No boost leaks. Everything is new, all connections are tight and I don't hear any hissing sounds. The wastegate is not opening either. There is a small exhaust leak around the slip pipe connection on the Y adapter. I'm thinking this is a timing issue? The engine seems nosier than it used to be with my old pump and seems to start harder now too. But I don't understand how it can be this far off. I used a timing light with adjustable advance and timed it to the 0 mark on the pointer tab. I did not have the housing cover off so I know the gears are still in time. Any ideas?

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Did you get ahold of Wes and ask for his opinions?

 

[cozinsky]

Not yet. Thought I would get more opinions here.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

I would say to contact him first. He knows his products better than anyone and if (for some reason) there needs to be a warranty claim, he's the one that you'll have to talk to. I'm not saying that there's a problem with his stuff, but he is human like the rest of us and can make a mistake.

 

[chillman88]

My concern is are you timing correctly with the luminosity probe? It's not done the same way you would with a timing light and you have to know the cetane value of your fuel. I haven't done much reading into it, just enough to know I don't want to mess with it.

What was your procedure?

 

[03wr250f]

@chillman88 has a great point there is pulse timing, which is a clamp on the #1 injection line and lumosity which is via a probe in the glow plug hole. They do not time the same way. Pulse measures fuel in before the fire starts
Lumosity measures after the fire starts and timing must be done completely differently as far as what numbers you are shooting for.
I would start there.
Also calling the supplier of your parts is a good place to start

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[cozinsky]

I used a Snap on MT254 and followed the instructions on the back. This morning I moved the pump back toward the driver side until the scribe marks were aligned. It's better, but still not right. It is more responsive now, starts easier and runs quieter but still will not build over 6 psi under wide open throttle. Still tons of black smoke and egts go through the roof so I have to let off the accelerator after a few seconds. I still see zero boost at cruising speed and only a couple pounds under moderate acceleration.

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[chillman88]

I used a Snap on MT254 and followed the instructions on the back. This morning I moved the pump back toward the driver side until the scribe marks were aligned. It's better, but still not right. It is more responsive now, starts easier and runs quieter but still will not build over 6 psi under wide open throttle. Still tons of black smoke and egts go through the roof so I have to let off the accelerator after a few seconds. I still see zero boost at cruising speed and only a couple pounds under moderate acceleration.

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Take a read through this thread. I'll attach a screenshot of what I'm referring to.

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[tjsea]

Yep, like @chillman88 said if you are timing by luminosity the timing figures are far different. The 8 degree setting is for the pulse method only.

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[03wr250f]

Also no boost along with high egt sounds like you have boost leaks
Wastegate settings will also play into that, and I have no idea where those are set on that turbo

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[The_Josh_Bear]

Also no boost along with high egt sounds like you have boost leaks
Wastegate settings will also play into that, and I have no idea where those are set on that turbo

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I agree with the timing remarks and to talk to Wes.

Black smoke is at least one good sign that you have lots of fuel and are not severely redarded in timing.

According to that screenshot by @chillman88 your original timing was advanced beyond optimal by 12-14*!! Hence the two bars, which is also going to put a lot of strain on your injector lines. These engines can be sensitive to timing, especially when boosting and lots of fuel. If you don't know your cetane rating shoot for 5*ATDC as a start.

Boost leaks don't have to be audible. Over the roar of that beast under your hood you wouldn't hear a minor leak or 3. I have one now and you can only tell because of oil sprayed all over my intake hat area from the leak and low boost at lower RPMs.

Get that timing dialed it per the linked instructions and see what's up. After that, spray every intake clamp with soapy water and drive down the road hard then pull over and look for bubbles.

Also if you are matting the throttle at low RPMs(1k-1.5k) you'll get tons of black smoke and high EGTs. If you're matting it at 2k rpm+ then that's a different story, the turbo should boost hard up there. Again that will vary a lot with timing.

 

[Laine D]

I’m not a master mechanic but the large amount of smoke, high egt’s, and low Boost really sounds like a large exhaust leak and a boost leak. I had a large exhaust leak on the slip fit and cruising I was at 1-2 psi of boost. After I fixed it jumped back up to 5-6 psi

 

[cozinsky]

I’m not a master mechanic but the large amount of smoke, high egt’s, and low Boost really sounds like a large exhaust leak and a boost leak. I had a large exhaust leak on the slip fit and cruising I was at 1-2 psi of boost. After I fixed it jumped back up to 5-6 psi

How did you seal it? I know I have a small leak around the slip pipe fitting on the Y adapter. I can hear and feel it leaking around that connection but I'm not seeing any soot around it.

No boost leaks. I pulled the hose off the hot side of the turbo and removed the boost gauge line, then capped off the hose and pressurized the entire system through the boost gauge port using a rubber tipped blow gun and compressed air. I put as much pressure in as I could hold back with the tip of the gun, then let off the trigger of the blow gun and continued to hold it tight against the fitting. I'm able to hold pressure in the system for a good 20-30 seconds before it slowly bleeds off. If I had a boost leak that massive I wouldn't think it would hold that long.

I replaced the original wastegate with an aftermarket adjustable one and put an 18 pound spring in it. I have verified the wastegate is fully closed and tried disconnecting and plugging the line, no change.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

How did you seal it? I know I have a small leak around the slip pipe fitting on the Y adapter. I can hear and feel it leaking around that connection but I'm not seeing any soot around it.

A lot of people use copper RTV to seal their leaks like yours. Be sure to clean everything up really good first.

 

[cozinsky]

Take a read through this thread. I'll attach a screenshot of what I'm referring to.

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So, how do I set ATDC? I know where the zero mark is on the timing tab, but all I can do is dial in degrees of advance on my timing light, no negative adjustment. How do I read this correctly?