chillman88
Full Access Member
I think the way I was told to do it is put a business card between the balancer and the probe?
Glad you got it figured out!
Injectors or timing?
- Thread starter fordw60s
- Start date
I think the way I was told to do it is put a business card between the balancer and the probe?
Glad you got it figured out!
Steven Sochalski
Registered User
chillman88
Full Access Member
That's how I'd try first. I believe another member here said that's how he does it.
Fredrickson
Full Access Member
The theory works for the ignition coil on lawnmowers..
probably works for IDI's too
probably works for IDI's too
You must be registered for see images attach
Big Bart
Tow&Slow
Gents,
Correct just put the card between the probe and the harmonic balancer per your picture. Insert the probe till it hits the card, then remove the card. If your probe is damaged/weak, you may have to use something thinner like a feeler gauge if you do not get a reading after using a business card. Concept is not to grind the probe against your harmonic balance and damage either one.
Fordw60s many on this site suggest they like the timing better at 9.5 BTDC VS spec of 8.5 BTDC at 2000RPM. So your call if you want to unhook all your lines for 1 more degree. But it may also help take the pressure off the lines if you twisted the IP very much. Which means they are less likely to crack due to stress.
Just a FYI, the reason when using the probe for a timing signal (VS the aftermarket timing light) you have to have a 20 degree offset is the probe hole is not at TDC. (Its 20 degrees off TDC.) So per the picture above when using the probe you have to set a 20 degree offset. Then the meter shows the actual timing of the motor, not the timing of where the probe is.
Also keep in mind when using a aftermarket timing light (On the metal bar of the meter.) VS the pickup probe, you do not need the 20 degree offset because the mark on the harmonic balancer is at TDC. So the timing light shows the real/actual timing via the timing mark on the harmonic balancer. The concept is to use a timing light with advance because there is no 8.5 BTDC mark. So you advance your timing light to the 8.5 or 9.5 BTDC, then move the IP (Not while running.) till the timing mark is on the TDC mark at 2000 rpm. That means you are at 8.5 or 9.5 BTDC. Many on this site have stated not all timing guns work well with the metal loop, so if you do not have success try a different model or brand of timing gun.
Your experience with the shop again confirms what so many on this site suggest. Local repair shops either never bought a timing unit, broke it, and did not replace it, or perhaps don't know where it is. So many mechanics simply try to time by ear and then test drive to seek a happy medium. But as Fordw60s found out, that really does not work in most cases. So it really does make sense to spend a couple hundred to buy this timing machine if for nothing else to give to your local shop so they can do it right!
All the best!
Correct just put the card between the probe and the harmonic balancer per your picture. Insert the probe till it hits the card, then remove the card. If your probe is damaged/weak, you may have to use something thinner like a feeler gauge if you do not get a reading after using a business card. Concept is not to grind the probe against your harmonic balance and damage either one.
Fordw60s many on this site suggest they like the timing better at 9.5 BTDC VS spec of 8.5 BTDC at 2000RPM. So your call if you want to unhook all your lines for 1 more degree. But it may also help take the pressure off the lines if you twisted the IP very much. Which means they are less likely to crack due to stress.
Just a FYI, the reason when using the probe for a timing signal (VS the aftermarket timing light) you have to have a 20 degree offset is the probe hole is not at TDC. (Its 20 degrees off TDC.) So per the picture above when using the probe you have to set a 20 degree offset. Then the meter shows the actual timing of the motor, not the timing of where the probe is.
Also keep in mind when using a aftermarket timing light (On the metal bar of the meter.) VS the pickup probe, you do not need the 20 degree offset because the mark on the harmonic balancer is at TDC. So the timing light shows the real/actual timing via the timing mark on the harmonic balancer. The concept is to use a timing light with advance because there is no 8.5 BTDC mark. So you advance your timing light to the 8.5 or 9.5 BTDC, then move the IP (Not while running.) till the timing mark is on the TDC mark at 2000 rpm. That means you are at 8.5 or 9.5 BTDC. Many on this site have stated not all timing guns work well with the metal loop, so if you do not have success try a different model or brand of timing gun.
Your experience with the shop again confirms what so many on this site suggest. Local repair shops either never bought a timing unit, broke it, and did not replace it, or perhaps don't know where it is. So many mechanics simply try to time by ear and then test drive to seek a happy medium. But as Fordw60s found out, that really does not work in most cases. So it really does make sense to spend a couple hundred to buy this timing machine if for nothing else to give to your local shop so they can do it right!
All the best!
IDIBRONCO
IDIBRONCO
I bought mine because the last time I called around to check on prices for setting the timing, it was $80. It was also 5 years ago and I now don't care how much it costs at shops. Even at the $80 price, it won't take very many times of paying to have the timing checked to more than make up for the cost of the meter.
Thanks and the guy I brought it to was doing this on the side and I highly doubt he has one. Most shops around here treat it like an ugly step child and I was hoping to just let him do it do but now I am learning it and I do have to do what Steven said and mill it out some to fit the probe. Once I do that I will see where it is. I'm hoping it won't be too far off.
Definitely Thank You all for the advice for this. I've always heard horror stories on IP so just been intimidated on them.
Well I finally got to try to start to work on it, Family life, work and work having me go to a graduate school isn't helping with time. lol Got the magnetic pick-up to fit and started to run it to see what it came up with. You can see in the pics some of the readings I was getting. I think though i still have something going on though maybe with the Pizo? when i was at starting temps it was pretty stable just was getting high numbers for timing such as 44 deg. at 2k and this was then the high idle cut off but not at temp. the pics you see though are at operating temps but i still need to have better idle control because it was a hard time trying to just keep it at 2k by hand. Also though I would have a large variability of RPM range which is why i am wondering if something wasn't reading right. i was getting it close to by ear it being around 2k but it was spiking tp to closer to 4,500 according to the meter but barely let off it would drop down to about 1,200. The other two pics are some of the timing numbers it was reading. i do think the pump is way out of timing though still. Thoughts on what may be causing the variability?
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
IDIBRONCO
IDIBRONCO
Maybe having too much space between your mag probe and the balancer? Maybe a ground that's not quite clean enough? I've never used a mag probe so those guesses may not be worth anything.
quickster
Full Access Member
Make sure the hard line is shiny clean. You don't want any paint or rust on it. And like Bronco said, the ground needs to be good. I have the same meter and it was wonky at first, so I went over all the connections till it was right. And the probe needs to be close, and the groove on the balancer needs to be clean.
Grove is very clean I checked it, I did the business card to gap it but may try the dollar bill or sheet of paper to gap it. Something definitely isn't reading right. The number one line is sanded for about 2" to 3" and then I cleaned it up with alchohol. The RPM's with the wife holding it to 2k on the tach the unitvwas getting to 8k. Hopefully this weekend I'll try to polish the line and get the puck up closer.
Thanks for the help in trying to get this straight.
Thanks for the help in trying to get this straight.
Old Goat
Full Access Member
You said you had trouble holding it to 2K RPM.
Here are a couple good videos from Joe Schmoe
a member that was on one of these forums, haven`t seen him in a while.
He is using the Ferret timing meter but the same basic idea.
Goat
Here are a couple good videos from Joe Schmoe
a member that was on one of these forums, haven`t seen him in a while.
xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
He is using the Ferret timing meter but the same basic idea.
xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
Goat
Yeah I will be looking to get a couple turnbuckles. Just still need to get my readings stable. I have watched his videos a couple times.
Thank you though.
Thank you though.
gnathv
Full Access Member
Did you set the correct offset before you started?
gnathv
Full Access Member
I haven’t used one of these but I see the trigger point is set to low in each of your pictures. Is that a setting that is correct for the 7.3 idi? When I read the manual for it, low is triggered at 30% pressure and high is triggered at 70% pressure, so I’m thinking it’s somewhat of a sensitivity adjustment, rpms are sensed here. I wonder if that is causing your rpms versus pedal position to be so touchy. Just wondering myself.
Similar threads
