Tips for Dropping Tranny

[swampdigger]

Hi guys, first post here.

I'm considering purchasing an '85 F-250 6.9L. The problem is, the bellhousing for the T-19 cracked around the shift fork. The price is fair considering this, and I would like to buy it. Unfortunately, I'll have to fix it where it sits on the pavement.

I've done many an engine swap, but never with a 1000 pound diesel up front. Myself and a friend were planning on removing the skid plate under the t-case, undo the tranny crossmember, t-cases linkages, speedo cable, d-shafts etc, etc.. and then benchpress the tranny and t-case out in one go.

Will this fly? Or am I going to need to support the engine while doing this?

I'm guessing 50 pounds for the aluminum t-case, and 80 for the cast iron tranny. Sound about right?

Thanks

 

[towcat]

firstly,
welcome to the basement
you chose a pretty tough item to tackle. personally, I cheat on the 4x4 clutch jobs...the workers at the trans shop I help manage get to do those. there's no doubt wrestling both the trans and transfer case is a real challenge. even with the "cradle" I have had welded together needs a large trans jack to hold it all up. The home mech doesn't have the resources as easily as a shop will. as a result, I'd highly reccomend draining and seperating the transfer case from the trans. Its going to be a chore, but doing it as one unit without a trans jack or floor jack, is just plain looking for a disaster to happen.
good luck

 

[Agnem]

Welcome to the site. Have you considered trying to drive it home without a clutch? Sounds dumb I know, but more than one of us have been forced to do it in a pinch. Just get the engine warmed up in neutral, and shut it off and put it in first. Start it up, and shift carefully matching the engine and road speed for the gear you want. Stop signs and red lights are the bane of existance. I guess I'm not recommending this if your in the city, but if your 200 miles away seperated only by an interstate and a few ramps, I'd do it. Anyway, if that is not an option, here is some advice. To do it right, you'll need to remove the front seat and the carpet or mat. Some guys skip this step, but I don't like to undo a shift lever I can't see. An added advantage of doing this step, is you may find money, tools, brand new fasteners, and you'll get to see if there is any floor rust. Once you can see the top of the shift lever, you will see that it has a collar that unscrews. Once you get that loose, you just pull the lever streight up, but be carefull. There is a pin in there that you don't want to have fall into the trans. Next, figure on an hour to get the cross member out. It's the biggest pain in the rear of the whole job. Lots of hard to turn bolts. Definitely seperate the transfer case from the trans. If you don't, the whole deal will try to spin counter-clockwise on you as you remove or install it. The 8 bolts or so that hold it on just aren't worth it. You will need a new gasket between the two. Drain all the fluids out too. You should also get a new clutch fork, pivot ball, throw out bearing, and a new transmission input shaft sleeve. The bell housing cracked because of high clutch pedal effort. This occurs because the input sleeve and TOB were not maintained properly. I'd check the dash for cracks, and or the presence of the reinforcement plate that is standard issue on a truck this old. The bell housing can be welded, and will hold up fine if done properly. I'd hate to have to rush this job and do it over when I got it home. Consider getting it home somehow to do it right the first time.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Mel beat me to it. You can drive a truck without a clutch. You just crank the engine in first gear to get moving and "float" the gears when shifting. It's what semi truck drivers do every day.

Personally I think you are under-estimating the weights of the trans and T-case.

Also you will need to source a bellhousing for a diesel trans, bolt patterns are different than gassers.

 

[dsblack]

Don't know where you are, but maybe someone can help you with a trailer etc, and get it home and do it right. I have not done one, but I would not want to be in a hurry either.

 

[adrianspeeder]

It is a cast iron monster and I'd flat shift it home.

Adrianspeeder

 

[SKimballC]

Yeah, that trans is heavy. The t-case is easy, especially with 2 able bodies, but I wouldn't try to bench press the trans, period. Its too much weight when you're lying on the ground. A floor jack is crucial.

 

[reklund]

I've pulled the ZF-5 in my truck, and that sumbitch is heavy! Like the others said, you should try to get 'er home before you repair it, so you can take your time and do it right. Bench pressing it really isn't the best way to do it, considering it's so heavy and cumbersome. You'll want a floor jack with a tranny adaptor, and a buddy or two to steady it as it comes out. You won't need to support the engine- it should stay level enough to work with without support.

I was fortunate enought to do mine on a lift with a fullsize transmission jack, and it sucked. Doing it on your back is gonna be a little more difficult...

Ryan

 

[subway]

that is one heavy tranny i put a t-18 in my jeep with the transfer case on a tranny jack by myself. not fun....a job i would reccomend for your home shop not in a parking lot somewhere. people have done worse in a pinch though

you say the housing is cracked how bad? could you reach up and lube were the throw out bearing goes to get by? i would make sure all the bolts are tight and with no speed shifting you should be able to drive it.

i drove home my turbo thunderbird with the tranny ears broken off of the block of my freshly swaped motor. the tranny was only being held by the top two bolts of the bel housing and my input shaft. was wondering why it shifted hard until i got underneath. turns out my helper buddy on the swap put the ground cable BETWEEN the tranny and engine and not under a bolt head. parted the car out after that and made $600 more than i bought it for.

 

[zigg]

I've done this job a bunch of times. I've manhandled it out with one buddy before, but it's way to heavy to put in like that, so we put it up on a bottle jack and screwed around for about 3 hours to get it in there, and it was just a miracle someone didn't lose a finger or something.

since then, I've made a jackstand for lifting trannys into place.

The T-case isn't too heavy, I can lift one out by m'self, and Im just a little guy(175 lbs) The tranny is very heavy though, and I wouldn't try to lift it out without some kind of tranny jack. You might want to look into renting one. I also think it's just plain smart to jack up the back of the engine for support.

Zigg

 

[f-two-fiddy]

Like Zigg said, rent a real tranny jack. It'll save ya some hours and lotsa wear and tear.

 

[Agnem]

I've always wondered why we have that chunk of alluminum between two hunks of steel.

 

[sle2115]

Where are you? Great bunch of guys here and one of us might be able to help get it home for you! Is it possible to just tow it? They don't roll that bad, but if you do that, have the engine running for brake assist! Driving it home is also an option if the crack is not severe, if you shift an just exert light force while feathering the throttle, they will virtually fall into gear, don't force it, it is all a matter of getting everything to spin the same speed.

 

[swampdigger]

Thanks for the replies guys! Lots of great advice in here.

I had a Ranger that seized the pilot bearing--did the clutchless shifting thing once before. Haha, nothing like stopping the motor at a stop light, and starting it in first to get going again. She's got two brand new batteries, so I could probably make it home

Home isn't much better for me though, I'm going to college outside my hometown, and I'm staying in the dorms. The school's automotive shop will do the work for free--in two months. Although having here in the dorm parking lot would make it way easier to get helpers, I'd have a coffee maker close by, and I could pull late nights

I have a floor jack, but renting a tranny jack sounds like a good idea!

I'm glad to have received an explanation for why the bellhousing cracked: I figured it was because someone jammed on the clutch too hard, but not knowing "why" made me nervous. Things don't just break.... if I go forth with this, I'll definitely be inspecting the bellhousing innards carefully.

Thanks again!

edit:

I'm in Nanaimo, BC

 

[zigg]

I'm in Nanaimo, BC

Well, why didn't you say so!! I'm in Victoria!

I could just bring you my tranny jack one weekend here. It's homemade, but works fine, and is quite familiar with the weight of a t-19. not to mention, I just happen to have a second t-19 if needed for parts, and also a t-19 bellhousing!

I'm having surgery tomorrow, so I'll be out for a couple days, but maybe if you had a place to work on it, I'd even come help pull that sucker...

Where is the truck?

Zigg