Front Cab Mounts

[Thewespaul]

Being a business owner myself in the automotive field, I can say quoting jobs and especially a project like yours is the hardest thing we do. Legally, you may be bound to the original contracted price but remember this is our livelihood and projects working on old stuff escalates, you turn one bolt on one side of a truck and on the opposite end a power steering line starts leaking, it’s just how it goes. However, he should have informed you that the project has grown and he’s going to need to take more time than originally estimated to do a proper job for you. It’s not a good way to handle the situation for you to just hear about it at the completion of the project, I’m not sure from reading this if that is the case or not, but either way you should meet with him, go over the contracted work and have him explain how it grew from there and what extra work had to be done, and find a common ground. You never want to burn a bridge with someone who’s worked on a project like that for you if you can, because more than likely someday the truck may need some more work, and he will know it better than anyone.

 

[HammerDown]

Is there a clause in the original quote that allows them to upcharge, or are they just telling you now at the end?

I'll admit it can be hard to accurately predict the extent of rust damage before tearing in. That being said, this isn't passing the smell test.

There is "fine print" at the bottom of the quote that states unforeseeable problems could up the price.
All along (through the 15 days he had the truck) I though we were at $1,500 with no hint there would be a significant increase until late yesterday and I got the exact number this morning.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

I'd also try arguing the next day freight charges. I'd bet that you weren't asked about the charges. If I could save a decent chunk of money, I could do without my truck for a few extra days.

 

[HammerDown]

FELLAS, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR FEEDBACK I READ THEM ALL, BUT PLEASE READ THE BELOW.

The shop owner and I did have a talk this morning...I kindly asked; "so how did my job go from 25 hours to 57 hours?" The list was long!

I was standing right there...when his son first crawled under and around the truck to ascertain the situation. I heard: "12.5 hours per side, the interior carpet and front captain chairs etc had to come out, we do this all the time, it's simple, we'll make-up the needed supports and floor panels...come on in the office and I'll write-up the work order." And there it was $1,500...that's what I budgeted for.

Now my was of thinking was; wouldn't it be more cost effective (saving labor time and me money) if you simply ordered the sheet metal pieces vs making them? So with that he went ahead and ordered parts that turned out to cost more $$$ + next day shipping I had to pay vs him making them...simply because I mentioned what I did.

****get this...(I was kinda shocked) he said..."I also had to charge you extra for raising the cab back to it original position and realigning the doors"
I said..."Bob, the reason the cab is sitting on the frame and the doors are pinching at the fenders is because the FRONT CAB-MOUNTS rotted away and that's why I'm here!" "Were you actually going to repair the rotted cab-mounts and leave the cab sitting on the frame and not adjust the doors?"
HE SAID..."YES, I wouldn't have raised the cab back up it was not in the original quote, but you wanted it back where it originally was" I WAS thinking to myself...*** DID I JUST HEAR???

I can understand...when digging into a 31-year old vehicle and when rust is concerned you may not be able to see the entire picture...BUT...they are the experts, they do this "all the time and it's easy". To not call me withing the 14 days work was being performed and not give me updates as to why the bill will be higher is kinda lame.

*For whatever reason my cab Dome light and the two little spotlights now don't work...and when I cleaned-out the cab Sunday night BEFORE dropping it off the next Monday the dome light worked cause it was on. The fuse for the inside dome/courtesy lights tested good (tested with a 12v test light) but no dome light or two personal spot lights.

He wrote on the bottom of my bill..."front core support is rusted and needs to be repaired"
I said, "heck I can't imagine what that job would cost" And had to inform him, the lower radiator support for a DIESEL is different vs a gasser and it is not available in the aftermarket (as he thought) as the gas engine is.

It is what it is...the lower rad support needs to be repaired (I knew this) but with the extra $$$ he charged for the cab-mounts it's out of financial out of reach and I honestly wouldn't know who to trust that wouldn't burn me again.

 

[Thewespaul]

Well it sounds like some very poor communication, and that he kinda got over his head with this project, he ended up spending more time on the project from it needing more work than originally thought, and because he didn’t do proper research on availability of replacement parts. I would say it sounds like he’s not very familiar with these trucks, but I’d like to clarify a few things here...

What replacement panels ended up being used? His or the aftermarket? What was the final cost? $1500? Did you end up paying for both sets of panels?

I’m a bit confused as to why when you came to pick up the truck and was asking about the extended time that he decided to order different panels and install them instead of the (I’m assuming already installed) custom panels?

Pull the lens off the dome light and check the bulb, if it doesn’t have any power there then check the door switches.

 

[HammerDown]

Well it sounds like some very poor communication, and that he kinda got over his head with this project, he ended up spending more time on the project from it needing more work than originally thought, and because he didn’t do proper research on availability of replacement parts. I would say it sounds like he’s not very familiar with these trucks, but I’d like to clarify a few things here...

What replacement panels ended up being used? His or the aftermarket? What was the final cost? $1500? Did you end up paying for both sets of panels?

I’m a bit confused as to why when you came to pick up the truck and was asking about the extended time that he decided to order different panels and install them instead of the (I’m assuming already installed) custom panels?

Pull the lens off the dome light and check the bulb, if it doesn’t have any power there then check the door switches.

I wish I could post a pic of the original work sheet for $1,500 and the final bill for a tic under $2,000.
A $500.00 increase may not seem like much but, it's what a well experienced shop told me, gave me in writing and what I budgeted for and why I went ahead and had the work done...$500.00 is a significant increase on $1,500
The panels used were from LMC and another supplier he uses. He did not replace either floor panel in it's entirety, but the one day I stopped in it looked like a diagonal patch-in. He did state he had to make a small section where the high-low beam foot-switch is located.

The "door switch", brilliant suggestion...but the door switch doesn't control the two spotlights on either side of the centered dome light, that also worked the night before I dropped-off my truck. (I'll look into it)

 

[chillman88]

The "door switch", brilliant suggestion...but the door switch doesn't control the two spotlights on either side of the centered dome light, that also worked the night before I dropped-off my truck. (I'll look into it)

I could be completely off base but my first thought was grounding issue. The cab used to be riding on the frame, it's not anymore. It's very likely something else, but worth mentioning just in case.

 

[david85]

I wish I could post a pic of the original work sheet for $1,500 and the final bill for a tic under $2,000.
A $500.00 increase may not seem like much but, it's what a well experienced shop told me, gave me in writing and what I budgeted for and why I went ahead and had the work done...$500.00 is a significant increase on $1,500
The panels used were from LMC and another supplier he uses. He did not replace either floor panel in it's entirety, but the one day I stopped in it looked like a diagonal patch-in. He did state he had to make a small section where the high-low beam foot-switch is located.

The "door switch", brilliant suggestion...but the door switch doesn't control the two spotlights on either side of the centered dome light, that also worked the night before I dropped-off my truck. (I'll look into it)

IIRC the dome light has a quick connect near the base of the B-pillar. Its possible they forgot to plug that back in when the interior got reassembled. Alternatively, there are three connection screws inside the dome light assembly:

1. Screws directly into the roof reinforcing strap and is also one of the screws that secures the light. This is the ground.
2. Powers the door light. This one comes on when the door is "A Jar", as they used to say in the 80s...
3. Powers the spot lights. This one should be always hot, even with the ignition off.

See the attached photos. The ones circled in red power the separate light circuits, while the one circled in black gets grounded.

Regarding the final price of the work.

When you first posted the work hours had more than doubled, I have to admit I was worried the final price had increased proportionally. Whether those are true hours or just a bogus number to make you feel better about a 33% increase, we may never know.

I don't know how extensive the damage was or the quality of their work, but I can say that no shop in my neck of the woods would rebuild floors and mounts for that low a cost. But as I said before, prices can be downright stupid up her in kanucistan.

How does the workmanship look?

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[HammerDown]

IIRC the dome light has a quick connect near the base of the B-pillar. Its possible they forgot to plug that back in when the interior got reassembled. Alternatively, there are three connection screws inside the dome light assembly:

1. Screws directly into the roof reinforcing strap and is also one of the screws that secures the light. This is the ground.
2. Powers the door light. This one comes on when the door is "A Jar", as they used to say in the 80s...
3. Powers the spot lights. This one should be always hot, even with the ignition off.

See the attached photos. The ones circled in red power the separate light circuits, while the one circled in black gets grounded.

Regarding the final price of the work.

When you first posted the work hours had more than doubled, I have to admit I was worried the final price had increased proportionally. Whether those are true hours or just a bogus number to make you feel better about a 33% increase, we may never know.

I don't know how extensive the damage was or the quality of their work, but I can say that no shop in my neck of the woods would rebuild floors and mounts for that low a cost. But as I said before, prices can be downright stupid up her in kanucistan.

How does the workmanship look?

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Thank you so much for the dome light info!
The shop owner wants me to bring the truck to him next week and they will look into why the light is now not working...I will certainly pass your info along to him.

As far as the repair...well...I can say it's nice riding in my truck to where the cab isn't sitting on the frame and I hear buckling sheet metal under my feet. And I no longer feel the floor moving when going over a twisted road etc.
As for how it looks...I really can't say as, the one day I stopped in the drivers side corner-floor was spot welded every 1/2" then when I went back a day later to look at the door-hinges it had rubberized undercoating sprayed on it. I have not crawled under the truck yet but, I was told they undercoated the repaired areas.
Onto the lower core support/radiator support. (I'm guessing you know about how they rot-out?)
I double checked with LMC, they do offer the lower core support for my year HOWEVER ...it's W/O air conditioning. I'm guessing there is no brackets for the AC condemner???
Do you think the brackets could be fabricated or, maybe grinned-off mine and welded on a substitute aftermarket front core?
I have not researched what owners of my year (1988) W/AC are doing for the rotted front. lower core support...but mine is bad, real bad.
Thank you again for your time and feedback...much appreciated, Ray.
Oh, I failed to mention; the shop owner stated he didn't know my year Ford/truck had a double layer floor. But again, he did say "we repair these all the time" and his son was under the tuck yelling out how many hours and what needed to be done.
I had though he was also going to replace the two front 31 year-old rubber cab bushings...nope, that was extra.

 

[david85]

Double layer floor???

Uh, there are areas that are reinforced, like around seat mounts and cab mounts. But, there are no double layer floors on any truck I've seen (Ford or otherwise). Walls sure, but not floors.

The core support is something I'll have to deal with eventually, too. Yes, there are extra tabs welded onto AC optioned trucks to hold the condenser. Other then that, I don't think there is much of a difference but don't take me as an expert on that.

It really sucks because the gasser style rad supports are quite cheap even up here in Canada. I replaced one in my Dad's ranger recently and it was barely more than $100CAD delivered. It wasn't quite OEM quality but still ok.

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[laserjock]

LMC does not have a brick nose diesel support for the tall radiator last I looked. Without AC means it was the short wide rad. I have seen a kit someone was selling to repair them. Honestly, your best bet is probably to import a clean one from out west. Even at $400-500 you would probably be ahead. They are super scarce around here for a good one. Scuff and POR 15 it and swap it. Probably wouldn’t take more than a day for the swap. The hard part is the cooling system. I don’t know if you could get away without draining the radiator or not. You can do it without opening the AC if you are careful.

The other option is to get a gas core support and swap in your lower hoop if it’s salvageable.

 

[Shadetreemechanic]

Here are two options

https://www.ebay.com/i/163488961140...MIrMv-1MiO4wIV0rXACh3IZgMNEAQYAyABEgKBYvD_BwE

https://www.partsgeek.com/gbproduct...MIrMv-1MiO4wIV0rXACh3IZgMNEAQYBCABEgL3PfD_BwE

I just replaced mine last year. I was able to find a clean factory one, and paid about the same as these new ones for it pulled and delivered.

 

[Shadetreemechanic]

Sorry. When I posted earlier I had my 1994 on the brain. I forgot you were a bricknose. I have a good non ac support for a bricknose if anyone needs one. Looks like the ac ones are made of gold..

https://www.ebay.com/itm/DIESEL-RAD...38G-87-91-FORD-F250-F350-173950-/153210879554

 

[david85]

I think only the OBS bodystyle has aftermarket support at the moment. There used to be a source that made the separate components for the drop hoop in order to convert a gasser style rad support. But I don't know if they still make them. I even saw a guy make his own components from scratch. Can't remember if it was here or over on FTE.

EDIT: found link:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1456012-1997-f-350-obs-7-3-core-support.html

 

[chillman88]

Also I would imagine that you could probably get the hoop off an 92-97 diesel and put it on a gasser core support. Not that I was want to cut apart a perfectly good core support but sometimes you'll find a deal that makes it worth it.