Fan clutch upgrade...

ifrythings

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i was thinking a bit and the best way i can see to make the adapter would be to find a piece of pipe that closely fits the size needed, put a length of it in the lathe, cut the inside and outside threads on an inch of the pipe, then cut the threaded piece off and repeat. you are then left with an adapter.

That’s what I found to use at work, ignore my incorrectly drawn sticky note haha

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or some pretty billet:D

It will be a nice piece of billet steel :D

I think you’d want this made in steel. Probably not aluminum.

The pipe piece I have is SA105N, 70,000psi tensile strength and 36,000psi yield strength, should be more then strong enough.
 

laserjock

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That’s what I found to use at work, ignore my incorrectly drawn sticky note haha

You must be registered for see images attach




It will be a nice piece of billet steel :D



The pipe piece I have is SA105N, 70,000psi tensile strength and 36,000psi yield strength, should be more then strong enough.
Looks like some of my cad drawings.

LOL

After further investigation, my lathe will not do left hand threads without modifications I really can’t do. So I guess I’m on the sidelines cheering you on.

[emoji16]
 

rwk

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Your lathe wont feed to the right? left hand threads are easy, feed off the shaft, scraped my share of parts threading to the shoulder or going too far and break tool w/right hand threads!
 

laserjock

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No. It’s a grizzly g0602 but with variable speed. Have to add an idler gear in the stack to reverse the rotation. Although I watched a guy do the neatest bit the other day. He turned the tool upside down, then ran in reverse. That let him start at the left side and thread off the end. It was one of those facepalm moments.
 

jaluhn83

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At work so don't have time to read through the entire thread but a couple of things offhand:

1) The Horton clutch is a electro-magnetic clutch - same style as the AC compressor. It's 100% locked or freewheeling (except for a few that have permanent magnets added for a bit of drag - this is the one I have). My $0.02 is this is a much better solution than a electro-viscous setup - it's simple and 100% lockup. Electo-viscous has all the problems and failure points of a regular clutch and adds electronic failure points. Flip side is you get more control, but I'm not sure the reliability or repair cost will be any better than a traditional idi clutch. That being said, the Horton clutch is hard to find, so I understand working with what you have.

2) My approach for the adapter would be to take a junk idi clutch and use that for the starting point so the internal threads are already done. Then all you have to do is cut, machine the OD and thread. I've got the lathe if someone has a 6.4 clutch they'll send me to play with I can probably make the adapters.
 

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that would be a faster way to make one. would be one less machine process with the inside done, just cut and thread the outside.

so the 6.4 clutch is just a full lock up? no half way?

really dont matter to me, still interested.
 

laserjock

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I think what he’s saying is the 6.4 is not electromechanical. It’s still a viscous clutch, it just uses electrical actuation rather than a bimetallic strip.
 

crash-harris

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At work so don't have time to read through the entire thread but a couple of things offhand:

1) The Horton clutch is a electro-magnetic clutch - same style as the AC compressor. It's 100% locked or freewheeling (except for a few that have permanent magnets added for a bit of drag - this is the one I have). My $0.02 is this is a much better solution than a electro-viscous setup - it's simple and 100% lockup. Electo-viscous has all the problems and failure points of a regular clutch and adds electronic failure points. Flip side is you get more control, but I'm not sure the reliability or repair cost will be any better than a traditional idi clutch. That being said, the Horton clutch is hard to find, so I understand working with what you have.

2) My approach for the adapter would be to take a junk idi clutch and use that for the starting point so the internal threads are already done. Then all you have to do is cut, machine the OD and thread. I've got the lathe if someone has a 6.4 clutch they'll send me to play with I can probably make the adapters.


Do you have a link to this clutch? Their catalog is only giving me results for CAT engines when looking for both International and Ford fan clutches.
 

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I think what he’s saying is the 6.4 is not electromechanical. It’s still a viscous clutch, it just uses electrical actuation rather than a bimetallic strip.

oh ok, got ya. so instead of having a spring engage the fan the electric mechanism engages it in a more controlled way.
 

laserjock

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I believe that’s the idea. It engages the fan based on the electrical signal fed to it so it’s adjustable.
 

jaluhn83

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I have a thread on here from when I got mine....
https://www.oilburners.net/threads/electic-fan-clutch.70947/#post-824325

From there:
Horton pn# 996127, 996135 & 996128 all seem to have the correct dimensions to work. (mostly, see below) Be careful, 996123 & 996124 are both T444E units that will look identical but have the wrong thread.

It's under International in the Horton catalog, and somewhat hard to find IIRC. EC450 model clutch. The 2 I have are actually not Horton but a knock off. The one on the truck is something German that is similar in design but one better as it has permanent magnets added to give a small amount of drag and hence some flow when not engaged for sitting at idle, AC, etc - same idea as the stock clutch. The Horton would freewheel completely, so you have basically no airflow when it's unlocked.
 

jaluhn83

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Fan clutch 101:

Viscous fan clutches are a fluid coupling, same basic idea as a torque converter. 2 rotors adjacent to each other with a fluid between them so viscosity of the fluid transfers power. There's a valve and pumping setup so that the fluid is kept generally out of the rotors when not engaged and ported to the rotors when needed. On the old mechanical system this is controlled by the bi-metallic spring on the from of the clutch. In theory there's a degree of portoptioning, ie greater oil flow for greater engagement as temp goes up, but in reality I'm not sure how true that is - it seems much more of a on/off actuation in reality.

This is a simple, and for the most part highly reliable setup. The down side is that when the oil goes away so does the ability to run the fan, and there's no good way to check the oil level or see how well it's going to work before you need it. Also, the actuation temp is based on the spring, which is not controllable or readily adjustable.

The newer systems replace the bi-metallic spring with an electric actuator. This is the electro-viscous setup discussed here. The mechanical side is the same, but what you add is the ability to control the clutch electronically, so it can be varied as needed. This is done primarily for emissions/fuel economy reasons, **not** because it's really any better. Yes, you get more theoretical control, but at the cost of more stuff to break/mess up. All of the potential failure points and downsides of the old clutch are still there but now with more things to go wrong. This is especially true for something like this when you're using a customized control setup.

Another point to make is that a viscous clutch is not ever going to 100% lock - there's always some amount of slip. Same idea as a non-lockup toque converter in an automatic. You get 90%, but never 100%.

The Horton type clutch is a full 100% lockup clutch, and it's simple to boot. Also relatively easy to override and manually lock on if you needed in an emergency.
 

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the fan clutch you have ends up being a more expensive option? from what i remember.
 

jaluhn83

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Most likely, yes. I think both of the clutches I have were in the $2-300 range off ebay. Very rare to find them however. New price seems to be around $1000 although I'm not even sure they actually are for sale anywhere still new - that may just be an out of date listing.

How much are the 6.4 clutches? IIRC those are not cheap either, plus the cost of the conversion work you'd have to do and a new fan.....
 

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