94' IDIT...... Recommended turbo upgrade? Banks? R&D? etc?

Macrobb

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Nice, is that without changing fuel and timing? How much faster spool?
Oh and is your wastegate wired shut or just unplugged, or still functioning?
I'Ve had too much fuel since I got the motor in there a few months back - it's got my RD2-110 and a set of Stage 1 injectors.
It kind of creates a thin black cloud at full throttle. Not billowing black smoke, but worse than I like it by far. It does it a bit less with the new wheel, but it's still there.

I'll have to post some video footage when I get a chance to upload it spool-wise.

Wastegate is unplugged. Before, I tried wiring it shut with soft aluminium wire to see if it actually opened under load, and it didn't seem to.

I'll probably end up putting a stock IP on this motor so I can use my RD2-110 on the S360 build, once I get the heads for it back from Russ in August.
 

Thewespaul

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So, just a heads up - I got a wicked wheel ordered about a week ago, it arrived and I installed it in my Factory Turbo '93.
I went from ~11 PSI absolute max, to about ~15 PSI. It's a bit louder(when spooled) and it spools better too.

In a few weeks, I'm going to go see Russ about his improvements and see what I can afford to buy from him. I'm not too concerned about having spent money on this wicked wheel at this point; it did help a bit, and I have plenty of trucks it could go in if I get something better from Russ.
I’m really surprised you were only hitting 11 psi with a 110, how’s the shaft play on the factory turbo? Do you have a 3” downpipe? Any leaks? I have a customer with a similar sized pump and a factory turbo that’s in the mid 20s
 

Macrobb

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I’m really surprised you were only hitting 11 psi with a 110, how’s the shaft play on the factory turbo? Do you have a 3” downpipe? Any leaks? I have a customer with a similar sized pump and a factory turbo that’s in the mid 20s
For some reason, I've had poor luck with these factory turbos. I've verified fuel pressure to the pump, tried varying the timing... but just haven't been able to get a ton of boost out of them.
I've looked for leaks - tightened everything up, cleaned it and had no change(and now no more soot leaking).

What's odd is that with my first factory turbocharger on an '88 motor in my '93, I managed around 15 for a couple of months, then it just... stopped making that boost anymore.
That was with stock injectors and the RD2-110.

My second one(on the <$400 factory turbo motor I got from the JY) just never made more than 11, even with installing Stage 1s. I just got more smoke.

Note that I've not modified the downpipes at all - it's, well, stock. But I still ought to get 15 psi out of it, like I originally did... and even that was enough for 250 at the wheels(the max I've gotten out of a Banks setup as well).

Meanwhile, my '92 with a Banks Sidewinder will easily max out the 15 PSI gauge unloaded, with just a stock IP and Stage 1s. That thing is really responsive, too... but I think it's still i the 220 RWHP range.
 

Thewespaul

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For some reason, I've had poor luck with these factory turbos. I've verified fuel pressure to the pump, tried varying the timing... but just haven't been able to get a ton of boost out of them.
I've looked for leaks - tightened everything up, cleaned it and had no change(and now no more soot leaking).

What's odd is that with my first factory turbocharger on an '88 motor in my '93, I managed around 15 for a couple of months, then it just... stopped making that boost anymore.
That was with stock injectors and the RD2-110.

My second one(on the <$400 factory turbo motor I got from the JY) just never made more than 11, even with installing Stage 1s. I just got more smoke.

Note that I've not modified the downpipes at all - it's, well, stock. But I still ought to get 15 psi out of it, like I originally did... and even that was enough for 250 at the wheels(the max I've gotten out of a Banks setup as well).

Meanwhile, my '92 with a Banks Sidewinder will easily max out the 15 PSI gauge unloaded, with just a stock IP and Stage 1s. That thing is really responsive, too... but I think it's still i the 220 RWHP range.

That’s odd, I made 27 psi first time out on the factory turbo and my big pump, and I’m easily making 15-16 psi with stock pump I pulled off a parts truck. I’ve always had the banks kits make boost easier, but always seem to have higher egts with them. They definitely seem to be more of a choke point at higher boost levels than the factory turbo, even with the better downpipe the banks get. Personally I don’t believe the 3” downpipe makes a big a difference as people preach so I don’t think that is your issue. I’m going to try and break 250 with the stock pump and turbo on the shop truck then upgrade from there.
 

Black dawg

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Never had any trouble getting 15psi out of a factory turbo with stock pump maxed , with the big outlet and downpipe. Without the exhaust stuff, was a little harder to get that boost, and egt would go into the 1450 range.
 

Black dawg

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Wow! 1450° and no melt down?

Those were just 0-70ish runs, never towed. After adding bigger outlet and downpipe..and the rest of the exhaust, towing would run 1250 wide open for as long as the cooling system could keep up.
 

YJMike92

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I have just purchased a 93 7.3L turbo idi, What kind of boost would be considered normal? I will need to put a boost gauge on the truck (it's on the to do list)
 

Macrobb

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I have just purchased a 93 7.3L turbo idi, What kind of boost would be considered normal? I will need to put a boost gauge on the truck (it's on the to do list)
Stock? 0-6 PSI. Unless the fuel has been cranked up, you don't have enough fuel to make much boost... and no need for any more than 1-2 PSI anyway.
Pretty sure that with sufficient fuel, you can get up to 10 before the wastegate opens. Unplug it(with sufficient fuel) and you can get maby 15-ish best case? That's about the limit of the turbo efficiency in any case.
 

Macrobb

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Based on the melting point of aluminum that still seems Mighty hot to me...
Yes and no. The aluminum melting point is just a red herring - if your piston got even to half that, it would expand and sieze to the walls, or simply get soft and melt.
The cooling jets of oil keep that from happening - as long as you keep spraying oil, things don't melt nearly so easily.

Also, it depends on where the temp is measured - In the exhaust manifold? Pre-turbo? Post turbo?
These numbers can change the "critical number" by a huge amount.
 

Thewespaul

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The only failures I’ve seen from egts are pistons melted down on one side down to the ring land, causing low compression and lots of blow by, and precup cracking past the fire ring of a headgasket, which blew the gasket out. There’s a lot of surface area that is exposed to the flame front in an idi engine. All of those failures were on trucks with no pyro, so who knows what temp those failures actually occurred at. I’d like to buy a beat up factory turbo truck, and put a big pump on it to run it through some tests. I want to know at what psi of drive pressure the headgaskets fail after retorquing them, and at what egt things come apart at. Yes it’s automotive homicide, but it’s for science!
 

Macrobb

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The only failures I’ve seen from egts are pistons melted down on one side down to the ring land, causing low compression and lots of blow by, and precup cracking past the fire ring of a headgasket, which blew the gasket out. There’s a lot of surface area that is exposed to the flame front in an idi engine. All of those failures were on trucks with no pyro, so who knows what temp those failures actually occurred at. I’d like to buy a beat up factory turbo truck, and put a big pump on it to run it through some tests. I want to know at what psi of drive pressure the headgaskets fail after retorquing them, and at what egt things come apart at. Yes it’s automotive homicide, but it’s for science!
So... you are talking about me then? Because that's more or less what I've done:
My '93, bought it about December 2016. Overheated it in February 2017 due to the belt tensioner breaking. It started weeping coolant a little from the corners of the gasket. So... Shove a big pump on it and crank it up!
April 2018 was when the head gasket finally let go, after towing an empty trailer to my dads that day. I'd pulled plenty of full trailers before that(and by full, generally 8-9K total trailer weight).
I never had a pyro the entire time I ran that engine.

Pulled that motor out for new gaskets and a freshen up, and swapped in... a '93 factory turbo motor from the JY. Cost me $370 inc turbo. It knocks, it ticks, it smokes at full throttle and EGTs jump pretty quickly... but I haven't seen any leaks yet. Still not getting more than 13-15 PSI of boost though.

Of the motor that came out of the '93, it was an '88 block that had evidently been bored .020 over, probably back in 2001 judging by the date written on it. Still looked pretty darn good inside, though I did see what almost looked like small spider cracks in the exact center of every piston, within a quarter's diameter. I took a wire wheel to it and they disappeared(could just be metal smearing).
Either way, it's getting some rebuilt heads(done by Typ4), the Typ4 cam, studs, and my big pump and we'll see what happens.


Speaking of head bolt retorque, I've checked on a couple of well worn engines(including the '88 motor in my '93 after I saw the leaks), and the bolts were all to spec. No tightening needed/available.
 

Thewespaul

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Well... sure, but I like to do testing like this myself instead of relying on other people’s experiences, when I’m talking retorquing I’m talking about bringing the stock head bolts within 20 ft lbs of yield, so over torquing them to get as much clamping as possible. Ford thought this was a good idea since the factory turbo engines have a higher torque spec than na.

End hijack :sorry:
 

saburai

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Yes and no. The aluminum melting point is just a red herring - if your piston got even to half that, it would expand and sieze to the walls, or simply get soft and melt.
The cooling jets of oil keep that from happening - as long as you keep spraying oil, things don't melt nearly so easily.

Also, it depends on where the temp is measured - In the exhaust manifold? Pre-turbo? Post turbo?
These numbers can change the "critical number" by a huge amount.

Of course. Many variables. Corey (Dieselcrawler) cooked his engine pulling a trailer. iirc, I think he said he wasn't much over 1150° and not for very long either:dunno
 

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