Truck doesn't start.

[amishtrucker]

thanks for reply s.blake, you seem to be the only one hanging in. As the glow plug controller clicks on and off, voltage to the fuel shutoff solenoid fluctuates between 11v and 11.75v. I ran a jumper directly from the battery + to the FSS and no change.

But, what i'm saying is, that when you open the Inj pump cover and manually flip that lever that the solenoid moves, the truck starts! The solenoid positively clicks when I directly connect it to the battery. But, it seems that the problem is that the lever inside doesn't snap back.

Question is, is there a spring inside the bowl of the Inj Pump that pulls the lever back , or is it the spring on the solenoid that does? IT APPEAR THAT THE SPRING ON THE SOLENOID IS WEAK.

 

[s.blake57]

good idea i forgot about the run away sucks happened once to me my heart sank while i watched the engine come undone right in front of me i had nothin to cover intake

 

[amishtrucker]

JD, Yes, look for it, and thanks. Does it have a FSS, or just cover? Does it have the two washers/seals that seal the holes where the FSS screws come through? Mine are rotted away. Please let me know.

 

[OLDBULL8]

IP pump fuel solenoid. Make sure the bright silver square in the middle of the solenoid cap is where I show in the other pic, or a runaway engine can occure. The pump pic shows the correct steel line placement to injectors. Numbers indicate the cyl. numbers.

Look at the cover, there is a black rubber seal around the edge, there are no seals where the screws go thru.

You may or maynot have a torque screw, disregard it.

It's natural for the voltage to drop some with other things operating, voltage is OK as long as it don't drop below 10 VDC. Your chasing your tail with all the voltage readings, there just fine.

 

[Diesel JD]

I hope I can find it, tonight I wasn't able to, but I haven't looked everywhere yet. If I can find it it's the whole top cover I'm pretty sure, but don't get excited yet. I'm told nothing was thrown away but you never know. Is it a pressing matter to get this truck back on the road?

 

[OLDBULL8]

voltage directly to engine coolant temperature switch (red/grey wire) is 12.29v with Key On. With hot engine (block heater) resistance between terminals with key off is 18 ohms

4. With probe on - battery and other probe to GP cap, key on, while clicking, 2v, after clicking stops, 12.29v

Forget about the coolant temp switch, that controls nothing but the Hi Idle solenoid, has nothing to do with the IP.

#4. You cannot track the voltage with a digital meter, you have to have an analog meter to watch the needle swing while the clicking is going on.

 

[amishtrucker]

JD, no problem, do what you can. Pressing? Heh heh, it is my only vehicle; been stranded for 3 weeks, thankfully, we have an almost Amish lifestyle, but I do need to get it back on the road. I am willing to try my hand at putting it back together tomorrow and seeing if it will crank up, but now I am concerned about 'runaway'?

Old Bull, what do you mean bright silver square? What am I supposed to DO/NOT do, to avoid runaway?

Are you saying it could also accelerate out of control while I'm driving and not turn off with key switch? Or, just in testing mode?

Suffocate the turbo intake with a board to get it to stop? (the rest of the intake is disassembled to work on it, pedestal and air filter holder)

(I thought the temp switch also went to the cold timing advance, which helps it to start when cold and could have been the problem? But, I guess not now.)

 

[OLDBULL8]

Old Bull, what do you mean bright silver square? What am I supposed to DO/NOT do, to avoid runaway?

If you look at the cover with the solenoids, you will see a bright silver square at the bottom, that pushes against the black tab where it is clearly noted on the other pic of the IP with cover off. If it's not in that position the fuel will not shut off and you have a runaway engine, turning the key OFF has no effect.

You won't be able to drive it, that engine will speed up so fast you have hardly time to stop the air at the intake. Thats the only way you can stop it shut the air off.

 

[amishtrucker]

Thanks, Old Bull
Do I need to attach the lever of the FSS to something in the lower half?

If it seems to be functioning on idle, is there a chance it will accelerate runaway later?

Any advice on the 'spring thing'? what makes the lever spring back when solenoid is not actuated? And, can i just replace that spring if that is the problem?

 

[OLDBULL8]

Thanks, Old Bull
Do I need to attach the lever of the FSS to something in the lower half?

NO.

If it seems to be functioning on idle, is there a chance it will accelerate runaway later?

If you have the cover ON and it's idleing OK, it's on correctly. NO it won't runaway later.

Any advice on the 'spring thing'? what makes the lever spring back when solenoid is not actuated? And, can i just replace that spring if that is the problem?

You have to have the cover OFF, move that Black tab back and forth a few times, should move easy against the small spring, could be gummed up.

 

[burtcheca]

David,

Pay attention to the instructions to avoid a runaway engine. That's a serious thing. The only way to stop it is to close the air intake of the turbo with a piece of plywood or wood. Measure that opening, prepare that piece of wood and have it close to you.

Now, on the FSS, is interesting that it's also in the same circuit the controller is. Do you remember that after 4 seconds in the first cycle it starts to clic on and off quickly every time we turn it on? If after you check every glowplug and all are good (I know the harness is good because I check every one of those wires and did a live test) and continues doing the same thing then we could have an electric problem that reflects in the controller going crazy and I wonder if it's not affecting the FSS too.

By the description of what Julio and you found I think it may be a weak spring only, not related to any electric problem. I hope JD can find that part for you. I'm happy Julio was able to help you, I told you he's a very smart person when I send it to you. It will be great to have that part of the IP replace and working fine because not only to get a new IP is expensive but to install it and get it correctly on time is out of our league. I don't have the tools and knowledge to do it. I'll talk to you later.

Burt.

 

[Agnem]

The SPRING is not your problem. The spring is responsible for shutting the truck DOWN, not making it start. The solenoid overcomes the spring, and holds the lever back the whole time the truck is running. When current is shut off, the spring will shut the truck off. Guys who have trucks that keep running when the key is off... they have a spring problem. Not you. My suspicion is that the arm is retracting, but that your metering valve is sticking closed. What you can do is with the top cover off, siphon some of the diesel fuel out of the pump and spray the snot out of the metering valve, and connected paraphanalia including the govenor weights. Then fill the pump up with Howes Diesel Treat and let it soak overnight. Operate the internal linkage manually a bunch of times, and then put the cover back on and cross your fingers. Make sure you get the alignment of the top cover lever correct. You can energize the FSS with some aligator clips before you put the cover on, to ensure it is in the run position and that the lever is being held back. Truck should start.

 

[amishtrucker]

thanks again, burt, oldbull, Agnem.
AGNEM, if the spring fails while I'm driving, could it accelerate out of control, or go into a high idle state and burn up while driving? We stretched the spring a few coils and crimped it over the holder- not exactly a precise holding mechanism. Is this OK?

I did as you said, but all I had around was Stanadyne Lubricant additive, hope that works.

Any possiblilty my solenoid is weak, though it does actuate when I apply 12v on the bench? Is it recommended to replace? Or not?

 

[Diesel JD]

I'm going to look real closely for my parts box again this afternoon but I may not be able to find it, my dad has moved a lot of things around this past fall and I'm having a hard time finding things I used to know the whereabouts of. If you can't get mine you should be able to find one in a junkyard, as I say I have heard that any GM or Ford IDI with the DB2 pump should have the right pump cover, but double check with someone who knows for sure to make sure that is the case. Actually I'm really confident that if it came down to replacing a pump you and Burt could do it. It does not take a professional, I have done it a few times, it is not a fun job but not technically difficult. Lets hope you don't need one though and I kind of think you don't.

 

[amishtrucker]

JD, what is my purpose in changing the cover? new solenoid? or what? I think maybe the problem is that metering lever? to clean that and get it sliding again? thanks for looking anyway