Trans Temp too cold?

[Booyah45828]

If what you have is working, then run it as is. I wouldn't complicate something simple. And having a gauge to tell you the temp is better then most out there. You didn't mention which fluid you use, but switching to something thinner like maxlife multivehicle atf would gain you better fluid flow at cold temps.

I'm the other side of the fence though. I don't think I'd ever run an air-oil unit only. The oil-water units are much more effective at ridding heat, Water/coolant is much better at heat convection then air is. Also, your coolant in the bottom of the radiator shouldn't be the same temp as the coolant in the engine. If it is, the radiator, fan, or clutch isn't working. I've had to fix trucks and RV's where guys bypassed a leaky oil-water cooler with an air-oil unit, only to overheat it and blow all the fluid out when running it hard.

I guess my question to david85 is if he ever tows with it? If not, he'll likely be fine, but I doubt this will work if you tow heavy.

 

[XOLATEM]

The oil-water units are much more effective at ridding heat, Water/coolant is much better at heat convection then air is. Also, your coolant in the bottom of the radiator shouldn't be the same temp as the coolant in the engine. If it is, the radiator, fan, or clutch isn't working.

I gotta say that is an excellent point...

You are absolutely right about the temp being lower in the bottom of the radiator...I have checked them with an infrared tool and seen it for myself.

Some coolers, though...run vertically in a side tank...

And Yes, surrounding the internal cooler with coolant as a medium of heat exchange is more effective in transferring the heat because there is no way..... short of a massive air bubble in the system... that the coolant will not be able to cozy up to the cooler and work its stuff.

That is all good and well if the internal cooler is fairly new and you can reasonably expect that it will last long enough for the customer to get more than their money's worth.

If you are going to chance having a catastrophic failure on a unit you just built and are expected to warranty for a customer that will not buy a new radiator....well....that was something that I was not willing to do....I did not need that kind of hassle...

I want to add that it is important as to where and how an aux. cooler is placed if you want it to work at all...just hanging it without any consideration for getting max airflow through it will not do the job.

And...sandwiching an aux cooler between the AC and the engine radiator will sabotage your efforts...

I noticed that a common practice among drag racers with super-high stall convertors was to hang a finned aluminum fluid cooler somewhere convenient and attach an electric fan to it...

If anything can heat up some fluid...a 5000 or 6000 rpm stall convertor will do it...

I would also like to add that it is possible for some people to destroy anything they drive or otherwise operate because they are either clueless or too headstrong to listen to reason or good advice.

I had an engine machinist make a comment on a particular racing team years ago..."You know those guys...they could break an anvil with a glass hammer.."

I've had to fix trucks and RV's where guys bypassed a leaky oil-water cooler with an air-oil unit, only to overheat it and blow all the fluid out when running it hard.

You mean they did not buy a new radiator...? See above...I guess you went and brought them around to putting in a new radiator...good job..

Also...there are good aux coolers and other things that say they are aux coolers but I figured that they just looked cool and not much else...

I appreciate your input on this Booyah...another point of view is good...keeps everybody thinking and figuring...you helped me see another aspect of the topic...

 

[Booyah45828]

You mean they did not buy a new radiator...? See above...I guess you went and brought them around to putting in a new radiator...good job..

Exactly. Cooler ruptured, pumped atf into the radiator, and the "repair" was eliminating radiator cooler and adding a tube style aux cooler instead. I'm sure they would have worked if they were used as a 2nd cooler like they were designed as. Some did it to be cheap, some did it because there wasn't a radiator readily available and they were on the road wanting to get home.

Like you said, location of the cooler is tantamount to it working well. That and keeping it clean. Put it behind the bumper and folks would wonder why it's still running hot.

I agree that the cooling system has to be good for them to work, whereas it's irrelevant in a air-oil unit. And I don't blame you as a rebuilder not wanting to deal with customers "cleaning" those coolers after a transmission grenades. I wouldn't either. There's no good guaranteed way to do it, besides replacement. Good luck getting them to do that. It's a dollar driven world, where you'll lose 95% of your customer base if you require radiator/cooler replacement with a trans rebuild.

I've never rebuilt one and not installed it myself, so I'm fortunate there I guess.

 

[trackspeeder]

If what you have is working, then run it as is. I wouldn't complicate something simple. And having a gauge to tell you the temp is better then most out there. You didn't mention which fluid you use, but switching to something thinner like maxlife multivehicle atf would gain you better fluid flow at cold temps.

I'm the other side of the fence though. I don't think I'd ever run an air-oil unit only. The oil-water units are much more effective at ridding heat, Water/coolant is much better at heat convection then air is. Also, your coolant in the bottom of the radiator shouldn't be the same temp as the coolant in the engine. If it is, the radiator, fan, or clutch isn't working. I've had to fix trucks and RV's where guys bypassed a leaky oil-water cooler with an air-oil unit, only to overheat it and blow all the fluid out when running it hard.

I guess my question to david85 is if he ever tows with it? If not, he'll likely be fine, but I doubt this will work if you tow heavy.

99-00 Ford Superduty had the oil to water cooler eliminated to save cost. Ford warrantied alot of transmissions because of that move. 01 they returned that cooler. Oil to water is the primary cooler. Oil to air is secondary. This why you plumb oil to air cooler after the radiator.

 

[Cant Write]

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I just stole that from @Cubey. Thought it relevant to this discussion. Here B&M, a respected (?) transmission retailer/manufacturer shows in their own gauge as 220 being the acceptable high range...

I can tell you this. We had a 2007 6L80 and they were known to have a manufacturing defect in one of their drums. We had that defect. And I watched trans temp like a hawk! If temps went above 150F, I knew that Reverse had left the building. And if trans temps went near 190F, pull over as slipping was imminent. I limped it for 20k like that.

Wife got really mad at me there and we got a new trans with all the updates.

 

[XOLATEM]

Didja get the sender for the guage..?

If you did...(or not...) when you hook it up...where are you going to tap in the sender..?

 

[Cubey]

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I just stole that from @Cubey. Thought it relevant to this discussion. Here B&M, a respected (?) transmission retailer/manufacturer shows in their own gauge as 220 being the acceptable high range...

Considering the big RV with C6 rarely got much over 210 in the pan, in 90-100 degree drives in the mountains of Arizona, Idaho, Utah ... one would think an E4OD might run a bit cooler. The RV has a pretty darn big and thick cooler though. The biggest issue was how the engine temperature rises, it sheds more to the ATF so that drives it up.

Last summer in AZ northbound from Phoenix to Flagstaff. Upper is pan, lower is uncooled from TC. I took an exit to let things cool down since I had more steep grades ahead.

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[IDIBRONCO]

one would think an E4OD might run a bit cooler.

I'll bet that it would. Between the lock up convertor in the E4OD, the less weight of the van, and the less wind resistance of the van, you should see much lower temperatures.

 

[Cant Write]

On Cubey’s post above, I heard somewhere sometime ago that trans temps typically run 100F over ambient. I’m sure there are tons of variables, just something I’ve read or heard.

Cubey’s MH is pretty much running 100F over ambient being worked hard. No lock-up.

 

[jbm6900]

Better cool than hot is my 2 cents...