So I have been running a mix of R290 & R600a in my A/C system

FoolhardyIDI

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Well I have been running R290 and R600a in my ac system for 6 months now. On a 115 degree day I am getting 50 degrees out the vents on high while driving. When sitting in traffic I get 62-64 degrees. I have tried the blue at .067 and red .062 orifice tube so far. My next trial will be the orange .057 orifice tube. My hope is that I can squeeze a few more degrees out of the system with the smaller orifice tube. So far I have updated my entire ac system. I switch out everything for r134a in the system. Condenser, evaporator, Suction line, Liquid line, and Compressor. The reason for trying the new refrigerants is the best my system could cool on the R134a was a dismal 68 degrees. Any thoughts, questions or advice is always welcomed.
 
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cpdenton

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You have something going on there. What are the pressures you are seeing high side, and low side.

My r-134 system will blow 38 degree air. That is with a compressor of unknown age too. Had a broke condenser when I bought the truck. I slapped a new one on and put a little freon with dye in to look for other leaks. 3 years later I am still cooling well.

One other thing to try might be a heater core shutoff valve like the explorers and rangers have.
 

DaytonaBill

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That's why I switched to a propane/isobutane blend in the summer of 2009.

R-290 (European CARE® 40) is Propane and R-600A (European CARE® 10) is Isobutane. Yep, they use the stuff in cars, in Europe AND Australia!!! Long story...

Btw, if you use any hydrocarbon refrigerant like this, you have to tell the A/C service guy or he will kick your ass for letting him ruin his expensive recycling machine!

I once got 45 degrees out of the vents, full fan, with outside temps running 105 degrees in Nashville, TN., July of 2012...

I've been playing with the stuff for a long time, back when R-134A was a buck per can...

Heh, once it was 42 outside and within a minute I had vent temps of 5.6 degrees @ full fan... :hail

There are two things you have to watch for whenever you use refrigerants that were not specified for our systems...

High head pressures in hot weather... (R-134A is notorious for this)

Adequate oil mist circulation throughout the entire system...

Those two reasons are why I picked the propane/isobutane blend. Propane will not carry the oil mist, it just drops out... But with the addition of the isobutane @ 60% Propane/40% Isobutane ratio, it works better than R-12 and my system is designed for R-12.

Btw, this blend I buy does not have the rotten egg (sulfur) smell additive (Mercaptin), it is actually, if you will, a pharmaceutical grade. It is high quality gases and there's nothing in it that would cause corrosive acid to form within the system, which regular propane would do.

So don't get the idea to use just any old propane, it won't carry the oil mist and will corrode your hard lines and the condenser and evaporator, not to mention the compressor...

I'm using the
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Industrial ES-134A Replacement Refrigerant, it used to be called ES-12, but they had to change the name because of a conflict with the EPA Snap rules concerning R-12 drop in replacements. You can get it in 30, 50 and 1000 lb cylinders.

:yell: Carry on, fellow experimenter... :D
 

FoolhardyIDI

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Putting a heater shut off valve would be a great idea. In the spring and fall when I don't use the ac or heater there is always hot air coming from the floor vents. what year should I be looking at for this shut off valve?
 

cpdenton

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Putting a heater shut off valve would be a great idea. In the spring and fall when I don't use the ac or heater there is always hot air coming from the floor vents. what year should I be looking at for this shut off valve?

I found most of them that are in the yards are old and pretty brittle. Mid 90s Rangers and exploders are where you find them.

I went this route.
http://www.amazon.com/Motorcraft-YG...?ie=UTF8&qid=1436149828&sr=8-1&keywords=Yg350

I tee'd it into the ca yum line that goes to the recirculate air door under the hood right by the passenger side hood hinge. That way it she's off the heater core when the air is on max ac.
 

FoolhardyIDI

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Could you show me a pic of how you have it hooked up? Pictures are like gold to me.
 

FoolhardyIDI

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Today I changed out the orifice tube to the orange .057. At idle I got 58 degrees and while driving around I got 48 degrees. I would say that is a great improvement.
 
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cpdenton

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Here is a cutoff plumbed in to the hater lines.

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And the vacuum pins tee'd in.

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BR3

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I'm currently running a well insulated and heater cut offed system with strait camping propane. Blue orifice tube and all, new compressor, accumulator and well insulated, I've managed to pull what my cheapo thermometer said was 28f. That was on a 102 degree day. I realize that's actually too cold, so I've got some toying to do to get the mix right, but the point is, even strait propane can cool super well in our trucks with blue tube and good system
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DaytonaBill

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And the vacuum pins tee'd in.

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What did you insulate your 'junk' with? I want to do the same as well...
 
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DaytonaBill

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I'm currently running a well insulated and heater cut offed system with strait camping propane. Blue orifice tube and all, new compressor, accumulator and well insulated, I've managed to pull what my cheapo thermometer said was 28f. That was on a 102 degree day. I realize that's actually too cold, so I've got some toying to do to get the mix right, but the point is, even strait propane can cool super well in our trucks with blue tube and good system
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What fan speed was that reading taken at?

You did alot of the right stuff, except for the fact that camping propane has Mercaptin in it and it is sulfur-based. Unless you used double-capped PAG oil, the PAG will go out of it's way to draw moisture into the system and when that happens, the sulfur will react to moisture to form an acid.

That will shorten the lifespan of the system, especially the compressor which have five aluminum pistons moving in and out in an aluminum housing with five cylinders for the pistons. There are lots of aluminum for the acids to wreak havoc in the system.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but do some research and see for yourself. I'm not kidding about the Mercaptin... Which is always found in camping propane...

Sorry about that, not trying to be an ******,would you have preferred I kept my mouth shut? :dunno

Also, the propane won't carry the oil mist around the system by itself, so that means that your compressor is dieing a slow death, because all of the oil is being collected at the accumulator with no way to hitch a ride back to the compressor.

So the Teflon starts melting and the black death will go into your condenser, then travel down the liquid line to the orifice valve where the screen of the orifice valve will trap the shreds of Teflon...

But the tar like substance (melted Teflon) with metal particles embedded in it, will flow past that, into the evaporator on down to the accumulator. The black death very rarely makes it's way back through the low pressure or suction line from the accumulator to the compressor.

I would, just for caution, install a good inline filter before the compressor to catch any tar residue left behind from the flush. If that stuff does make it back to the new compressor, the whole cycle will repeat itself all over again, but this time, not from lack of oil...

In black death, or compressor failure, not all cylinders start shredding, most of the time it's all coming from just one cylinder. This why oil recirculation back from the accumulator is so very important.

One symptom of early black death is where your A/C system puts out colder air at lower speeds as opposed to highway speeds. It's the clog at the orifice valve that's causing the system to do that. Or a much too small orifice valve, which you don't have, since you used the blue one, which I believe is .072"...

That being said, if you catch the black death in time, you can just to do a firewall forward replacement and be sure to flush good thoroughly the evaporator and it is always a good idea to use nitrogen instead of regular compressed air to flush out the flushing solvent.
 

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