Shudder in Transmission

[dnoellsch]

I am new to automatic transmissions so bear with me...

I have a 94 F-250 that I was pulling a 5th wheel camper with over the weekend when some strange things started happening in my transmission.

Whenever a the truck was under load, or I tried to accelerate up a hill or even a slight incline, the truck would start shuddering. I could get it to stop by letting off of the throttle but if I tried to accelerate again it would shudder. This would usually result in my downshifting from O/D, but even then if I added too much throttle it would shudder even when not in overdrive. The engine is plenty powerful but whenever this shudder would occur, it seemed like there was no power and it wouldn't accelerate the shuddering would just get louder.

Once I got the the camper off, the problem was much less extreme but was definately still there.

If you guys have any ideas as to what the problem may be I would really appreciate hearing what you think.

Thanks,
David

P.S. I forgot to add that the O/D light is flashing, but was flashing before this problem was noticed. When I first got it checked out, the techs told me there was no problem and to reset it. But I have a feeling that they had no idea what they were talking about now...
Also, I checked the tranny fluid and it is clean and full.

 

[Agnem]

The blinking OD light is the first thing to go after. The shudder may be a side effect. I'm not much of an E40D expert, so someone who is will chime in. Can we assume you've done the obvious and properly maintained the fluids in this transmission? My guess is the FIPL sensor should be replaced/Adjusted.

BTW, for everyone interested, I learned that the FIPL sensor on our E40D trucks is a common part with a TPS sensor used in certain model years of the Ford Ranger. Go figure!

 

[pafixitman]

As Mel stated, there are 4 main things to go after. Fluid, FIPL, tach sensor, speed sensor. After that you can check the MLPS and all connections. Also, get a code reader from your favorite store so you will know what the tranny is telling you.

The E4OD gets signals from the FIPL (or TPS) Fuel Injection Pump Lever, the tach sensor and the rear anti lock brake (RABS) / speed sensor on the rear diff housing. Check the FIPL first.

The TP (FIPL) sensor is incorporated to provide an electrical signal, which is proportional to the amount of fuel being delivered, as an input to the Transmission Electronic Control Assembly (TECA) Based on this information, the TP (FIPL) provides the proper shift scheduling and torque capacity.

Should a malfunction occur in the TP (FIPL) sensor circuit, the electrical signal sent to the TECA will be recognized as erroneous. When this out-of-specification signal is detected, the TECA will provide a high-capacity operating mode that protects the transmission from potential damage. This operating mode includes maximum TV pressure, resulting in harsh upshifts and engagements and a singular shift schedule regardless of accelerator pedal position, resulting in the 1-2, 2-3 and 3-4 shifts occurring at a speed commensurate with a heavy (but not wide open) throttle setting.

The Ford shop manual has a procedure to set the FIPL sensor. It's fairly long and required a special guage block and the use of the Super Star Tester ( early scan tool ). I decided that this was not what the "field" needed so I called the Ford Hotline and they gave me plain and simple voltage readings at closed throttle and WOT. MUCH easier.

Closed throttle voltage = 1.1V
WOT min 0f 3.8V not to exceed 4.3V

You definitely don't want 5V at WOT. PCM would read this as a short between Reference Voltage ( 5V ) and FIPL signal and go into failure mode.

Next, does your tach work? Bounce? If it does not work, or bounces, then replace it.
The dead tach sender should/would send the automatic trans into a "failure management mode" (limp mode) with harsh engagements and firm shift feel, and an abnormal shift schedule. It has no effect on a manual trans only the Tach readings.

Replace the tach sender on the oil fill housing a big 1" nut with 2 wires. Ford only part Engine RPM sensor E5TZ-17B384-A about $50. You can remove and clean it but usually changed later too. You can test it too, hold it in the air away from ferrous metal, using an ohm meter lead on each wire you need DC resistance between 2000-3000 ohms.

Does your speedo bounce? If so replace the sensor on the rear diff.

If all of this "passes" then check all of the electrical connections at the tranny it self. Remember to replace the heat sheild on the pass side of the tranny when checking the connector.

Now, after all of this is done, replaced and good, remove both negative batt cables for about 15 minutes, this will reset the computer.

If you have not already done so, invest in some nice plate style coolers (I run two), a temp gauge and go to the local dealer and get a trans pan, gasket and filter for the 2001 F250 4X4 with a 4R100 trans. This will give you an extra 1 1/2 qts of capacity and a drain plug. Magna Fine makes a nice disposable in line filter, or you can add an external filter of choice. As another member says "a clean, cool fluid is a happy fluid."

 

[dnoellsch]

Thank you for the replies. I am going to check the FIPL first thing. The speedo or tach bouncing has never been a problem, although they do move just a bit during a violent shudder but I don't think that they are bad.....the shudder will rattle your teeth let alone the gauges.

The transmission has been properly maintained and fluid changed on proper intervals. I am planning on getting some coolers for the transmission as well.

Is it possible that the clutch paks in the torque converter are not locking right and causing the shudder or could the FIPL/speedo/tach cause it to not lock properly?

Thanks,
David

 

[pafixitman]

My personal experience is the tranny slips, kicks a code 62 and then you are done. The OD light will flash indicating you are in limp mode. Line pressure will max out and she will bang gears hard. They do not take kindly to getting hot and the tolerance level for low fluid is a qt max. The bands could very well be going out. Like others here though, I feel the rate of rebuilds is because people don't take the time to check everything else. Replacing hard parts will not fix the other problems. Okie ****** and Mr. Roboto are two members well versed in the E4OD.

We have a 3 week vacation starting next week. My truck had a leaking extension housing seal and cooler lines for over 2 years. I just replaced all rubber lines, added a second cooler, the new trans pan, replaced the extension housing busing and seal, new speed sensor and adjusted the FIPL. Well worth the effort in my book. She is running 20 degrees cooler in every day driving and no leaks!

 

[93turbo_animal]

sounds to me more like you have a bad U-joint and between the trailer making the truck squat a little changing the drive line angle and more toque to get things moving is causing the shudder or vibration I just had this happen to me this weekend truck drove great till I hooked up to the trailer and loaded the tractors then tearible vibration when I tried to accellerate ended up changing the u-joint at the tractor show

 

[yARIC008]

I don't think we can say anything for sure until you get that light to stop blinking. Towing and pulling a camper with that light blinking is a bad idea. Mine was blinking a while back and i was kinda ignoring it, i accelerated not too hard, but not super easy from a light one day and it sheared the center support it shifted so hard.

With your tranny shifting hard and being at max line pressure it's not very good for things. GET THAT BLINKING LIGHT FIXED!

A code reader from walmart is about 30 bucks. 30 bucks would have saved me 1,500 bucks a while back... All that was wrong with mine was bad TPS wires.

 

[dnoellsch]

I reset the tranny computer today and it does seem much better now that it is not running full pressure. However, the problem still seems to be lingering. I am going to check my TPS for proper calibration. One thing I did notice when I was under the truck doing an inspection was that there seemed to be an oil spray on the rear of the front tank and on the underside of the bed which I think was coming from the front of the rear axle. I have not checked the fluid level in it yet, but I will not be driving it again until I do.

I do not think that it is a u-joint because it only vibrates during medium acceleration, acceleration under load, or right after a shift during acceleration. It is not constantly vibrating. Also the fact that clearing the code made it much better leads me to believe that the problem is either with my TPS not telling the TC when to lock/unlock correctly or the TC is just bad...

I plan on picking one of those code readers up ASAP so I can figure this out and at $30 it is much better then paying the dealership $75 and I get to keep the tool!

David

 

[93turbo_animal]

well it definately sounds like you got a tranny problem but I still wouldn't rule out a u-joint mine didn't vibrate except while accelerating or pulling a grade otherwise flat ground or coasting it was smooth as always plus that spray on the bed and tank could be the grease from the u-joint

 

[dnoellsch]

well it definately sounds like you got a tranny problem but I still wouldn't rule out a u-joint mine didn't vibrate except while accelerating or pulling a grade otherwise flat ground or coasting it was smooth as always plus that spray on the bed and tank could be the grease from the u-joint

Well, that is exactly what it does, it only vibrates when accelerating or pulling grade. Also, we did just grease the u-joints before I left, but it sure looked like an oil to me unless it got hot enough to melt the grease. I guess I won't know until I check the oil tomorrow. I wonder if greasing a bad u-joint could force something out of place that wasn't noticable before. But it makes sense for a u-joint problem now that I think about it because that is the only thing that I have done different on this trip.

But.. that doesn't explain why the light was flashing does it?

Thanks,
David

 

[93turbo_animal]

nope that don't explain the light which could be a very simple fix just figuring the fix out is the hard part and if your you joint is shot it will get hot enough to liquify the grease I stopped to check mine wanted to make sure all the bolts were tight in the drive shaft read to many stories about loose bolts so you may also want to check that too but I grabbed hold of the rear u-joint and it was hot really hot cause when I got up my wife asked me what smelled like burning oil lol

 

[pafixitman]

When the seal / bushing in my extension housing was leaking I would notice it parked, but I also had tranny fluid dripping off the rear diff because it sprayed back.

 

[92 F-350CC]

Mine did the same thing, torque converter was toast.