Opinions/experiences with the "typefour" ZF mod

[Ford F834]

Hi, new to oil burners, some of you may recognize me from FTE. I understand that some of you here have done the "Typefour" ZF mod, i.e., re-drilled the bellhousing bolt holes to fit a 460 ZF to an IDI or vice versa. I am a little shy of this modification because of structural integrity, so I'm curious how they are holding up for those folks who have done it. Also interested in opinions from those who did (or did not) do it and why.

Just so everyone knows, I am interested in this mod for the wide gear ratio. I bought two narrow range diesel ZF's for my project already (second one the price was too good to pass up, and was nicer than the first). Now I have the opportunity to buy a 460 ZF at a good price, and would much prefer it's gear spread. I know there exists a wide range, diesel ZF but I'm not going to the trouble to hunt one down and pay whatever it costs. Also interested in opinions on the gear spread, keeping in mind that my set up will have stock tires, 4.10 axle gears, AND a gear vendor's under-over drive gear splitter. The truck is a 1986 F350 4x4 crew cab. Thanks.
Jonathan

 

[79jasper]

I haven't seen anyone speak of any structural failures from the redrill.

Also as long as it's the same model trans, you can swap all the gasser internals to the diesel case.

I really don't think you could possibly have any gearing problems with either trans. Not to mention your gear splitter...

 

[Ford F834]

Also as long as it's the same model trans, you can swap all the gasser internals to the diesel case.

Case swap? No bearing tolerance issues with the main shaft bearing in the front case? A direct bolt on switch is much more attractive than a re-drill, especially since I would have both. Thanks for that tip!

 

[laserjock]

Hopefully not speaking out of turn here, but if it were me, and I had decided to do a case swap, I would consider it a rebuild with new bearings and seals and all the shimming and etc. that goes with that. There is an awesome article in the tech sticky on whats involved. If I had it apart, I sure wouldn't put it back to gether with used "consumeable" parts.

My $0.02

 

[Ford F834]

Hopefully not speaking out of turn here, but if it were me, and I had decided to do a case swap, I would consider it a rebuild with new bearings and seals and all the shimming and etc. that goes with that. There is an awesome article in the tech sticky on whats involved. If I had it apart, I sure wouldn't put it back to gether with used "consumeable" parts.

My $0.02

Thanks. I'll check out that tech article for sure. I have most of that stuff because the nicer of the ZF's was actually in the junkyard on account of an exploded throw out bearing that destroyed the clutch. Only real damage to the ZF was a chewed up input shaft quil tube, so I bought all the requisite parts for that repair. Since its an earlier ZF the quil tube is pressed in from the inside, therefore case removal is going to happen regardless. Thanks for the tip on the whole rebuild though. Didn't know that was a DIY type of thing for the inclined home mechanic.

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[laserjock]

I would say its a job for an advanced DIY'er just based on the tech article. I've never done one personally. I'm pretty good, but it would make me nervous. It does require a couple measurement tools and a few other things. Like I said, read the article and decide for yourself.

 

[icanfixall]

Wow.. Thats a sad looking quill right there.. Welcome to the forum first off. As for weakening the case I don't think so. Both typ4 and Hsutten have done this mod to the gasser ZF's without any issues. Sad to see abuse like that too on the quill. Looks like it will be a tuff job getting that off the trans and it surely melted the trans front seal. Might want to replace the bearing too.

 

[PackRat239]

Is that a big crack in the front of the case just above the input shaft?

 

[riotwarrior]

Is that a big crack in the front of the case just above the input shaft?

Oddly enough my ZF case has all kinds of those "marks" on it, seems that the castings are NOT all that good, seem to be the case 9(pun intended) for the most part anyway with the ones I've seen!

JM2CW

 

[79jasper]

I would do new bearings and seals also.
You'll just need to acquire some new tools. But it's not too bad.

 

[Jake_IN]

Oddly enough my ZF case has all kinds of those "marks" on it, seems that the castings are NOT all that good, seem to be the case 9(pun intended) for the most part anyway with the ones I've seen!

JM2CW

I would guess thats caused by high metal velocity in that part of the die during the die casting process. Due to the nature of the shape of the case (lots of area but not much thickness) it would be really hard to completely eliminate those "lines". I can't think of the term off the top of my head. But anyway you could slow down the slow,intermediate, and fast shot velocities but then you can run into other problems like, poor fill, or porosity.

That would be my uneducated guess (only been in die casting for a year now so i'm still very "green").

 

[Popspuller6.9]

I believe my son borrowed a template tool from typefour that really worked good for the redrilling after we drilled it slipped right in no problems at all

 

[dancrowley]

Hi Jonathan; If you like I can email you a ZF manual. Dan

 

[subway]

I would guess thats caused by high metal velocity in that part of the die during the die casting process. Due to the nature of the shape of the case (lots of area but not much thickness) it would be really hard to completely eliminate those "lines". I can't think of the term off the top of my head. But anyway you could slow down the slow,intermediate, and fast shot velocities but then you can run into other problems like, poor fill, or porosity.

That would be my uneducated guess (only been in die casting for a year now so i'm still very "green").

you mean knit lines?

 

[Jake_IN]

you mean knit lines?

Nah i dont think it's that. I think you'd get that more from cold flow. I think its more like heat checking. Although where those lines run parallel with the gussets I'm wondering if the die wasn't washed out right there.

Use to be a lot better at this but after I switched over to the maintenance department it appears my brain dumped most of the stuff i use to know