New (to me) PSD Made it Home - More questions.

[apextrans]

Well I flew into Dallas Friday morning & picked up the truck. It was a little rougher than the pictures showed but all in all, a nice truck. Just some dings & scratches that weren't apparent in the pics. Few things that I noticed when I got there. Back of oil pan ,Starter, Tranny lines & front lower half of trans were wet with oil at one time but no drips on the ground....at first( I'll get to that). Steering is a bit hard with a dead spot in the middle & window switches on the drivers door didn't work. The dealer took me down to the Ford dealer & he bought a new switch cluster, new steering stabalizer & drag link, & a new 6 cd Changer radio 'cause the volume on the other radio was not working. I was happy with all this. I drove the truck around downtown Dallas for about 45 min & it seemed to run very well. I never found my way out to the freeway on the test drive & really wished I had. Went back to his shop & did the paperwork, swapped the switch cluster & radio & I hit the road around rush hour. I drove for about an hour & 35-45 MPH and then the road opened up so I accelerated....... This truck was shaking like a poodle *&%@ a peach pit sideways. EVERY tire was out of round. Screw out of balance, I drove it this way to Mt. Vernon Texas, to a little tire shop that was getting ready to close & asked them to balance the tires. First one we tried took 9.25oz on the outside & 8.50 on the inside, but it balanced. The next three all called for 86.0oz at least per side. Obviously that wasn't happening. So I had to buy tires 150 miles into the trip. Didn't have the 315's so I got stuck with 305's (for sale by the way only 1200 miles on em'). Called the dealer & asked him if he every drove the truck on the highway & he said no so maybe he didn't know about this. Anyway he said he will work with me on the bill. Next problem along the way: driving at night the lights would dim & then come back up, did this on & off four about 3 hours. It was the end of the first day & I was beat so I just hit a motel & decided to deal with it in the morning. Got up Sat. & forgot to check the batteries & alt connections b4 I left & going down I-40 Gauges, radio, & windows died. Truck kept running & everything else worked so I rolled that way to the rest area where I popped the hood to find 3 of 4 battery terminals lose enough to take of with 2 fingers. Tightened everthing & problem gone. Called the dealer & told him his final inspection guy sucks. Now, on the second fuel stop I look under the truck 'cause I dropped the key & there's 2 oil spots quickly forming right under where the tranny meets the back of the motor. I kept an eye on the oil level the whole way & it didn't seem to move. Where is this oil coming from? I was thinking rear main seal. Is that a likely culprit? Also, on the same fuel stop, I found a rear wheel with a crack completely thru . Didn't see it before. And finally, the steering didn't improve with the smaller tires. I think it has a steering box problem. The dealer blamed it on the big tires. I told him that was crap. I have to call the dealer monday to tell him the other things that happened on the way & see what he does about it all. He said to let him know everything went when I got home, so I will.

I'm gonna take it to the Stealership this week & have them go thru it & see what it really needs then call the dealer in TX & try to settle some of the issues. I don't expect him to foot the whole bill for what it needs but I expect a bit more than what I got down in TX. I asked specifically about oil leaks & wheels/tires. On a whole though, I'm happy with it. Came half way across the country with little trouble at all & made home in 2 days.

Any thoughts on what might be leaking or the steering deal?

 

[jharvey]

Scott, glad you made back home safe and sound with just a few issues.

The leak sounds like a rear seal, but you may want to check in the vally and around the back of the motor to make sure you don't have a HP line leaking or a galley plug loose.

Not sure on the steering but I'd guess the steering box gearing is worn pretty bad.

John

 

[trackspeeder]

Check the tubo pedestal

 

[Mike]

Anything that drips into the valley will eventually find its way out the back on onto the front of the tranny. It could be turbo pedistal as speeder mentioned, it could be a leaky EBPV actuator, it could be fuel leaking from the filter cannister drain, it could be a high pressure oil leak somewhere on a head.

Get the valley cleaned up if you dont see anything blatently obvious, then wait for it to re-appear. These 7.3 PSD's dont toss a rear main very often.

 

[towcat]

Check the tubo pedestal

+1 on that call. seen many with loose bolts and oil ******* past the o-rings.
time consuming and messy fix tho.
oh yea, if you do find the oil leaking from the front part of the motor valley, you will learn new words when you find out what high pressure oil pump costs.

 

[apextrans]

you will learn new words .

I appreciate all the suggetions but I have no idea what this stuff is or means. I know valley pan & I got turbo pedistal but the rest is korean to me. I need a chilton's manual I guess.

95, since you said that I went out & looked at that small opening on the cover directly under the bell housing & the oils isn't coming from there, it's coming down the side & blowing all over. Too freakin cold out to keep messing with it tonite. Guess I'll start looking around the turbo tommorrow. If that's dry, where should I look next?

 

[pafixitman]

EBP - Exhaust back pressure:
At the turbo exhaust outlet is a butterfly that when actuated will restrict the exhaust flow, this causes the engine to work harder in cold ambients and generate engine coolant temperature quicker for cab heat. The actuation of this device is controlled by the PCM and the EBP regulator located in the turbo pedestal. The EBP regulator restricts lube oil flow out of the turbo (center housing) and directs oil to the turbo pedestal which pushes the EBP actuator arm outward causing the butterfly to close or restrict exhaust flow. The PCM uses the EBP sensor to monitor the exhaust restriction. The EBP sensor is connected to the right exhaust manifold using a pipe and fitting. The exhaust back pressure device will open when the accelerator pedal is depressed and the exhaust back pressure increases. When the exhaust back pressure decreases or the vehicle is in a steady state, exhaust back pressure decreases per the EBP sensor, the EBP regulator can and will activate the EBP device again even while going down the highway as long as the EOT temperature is below the specifications.

The HPOP is the high pressure oil used for the injectors. If a leak occurs at the high pressure oil gallery plug, a service plug for the high pressure oil rail that places the sealing o-rings deeper into the gallery is now available. The new plug can be identified by a circular groove cut into the face of the plug. The new plug went into production prior to 1999.5 MY on engine S/N 751869


You ain't in IDI land anymore Scott.
I feel so dirty for actually posting answers to a darkside issue.

 

[apextrans]

EBP - Exhaust back pressure:
At the turbo exhaust outlet is a butterfly that when actuated will restrict the exhaust flow, this causes the engine to work harder in cold ambients and generate engine coolant temperature quicker for cab heat. The actuation of this device is controlled by the PCM and the EBP regulator located in the turbo pedestal. The EBP regulator restricts lube oil flow out of the turbo (center housing) and directs oil to the turbo pedestal which pushes the EBP actuator arm outward causing the butterfly to close or restrict exhaust flow. The PCM uses the EBP sensor to monitor the exhaust restriction. The EBP sensor is connected to the right exhaust manifold using a pipe and fitting. The exhaust back pressure device will open when the accelerator pedal is depressed and the exhaust back pressure increases. When the exhaust back pressure decreases or the vehicle is in a steady state, exhaust back pressure decreases per the EBP sensor, the EBP regulator can and will activate the EBP device again even while going down the highway as long as the EOT temperature is below the specifications.

The HPOP is the high pressure oil used for the injectors. If a leak occurs at the high pressure oil gallery plug, a service plug for the high pressure oil rail that places the sealing o-rings deeper into the gallery is now available. The new plug can be identified by a circular groove cut into the face of the plug. The new plug went into production prior to 1999.5 MY on engine S/N 751869


You ain't in IDI land anymore Scott.
I feel so dirty for actually posting answers to a darkside issue.

How in the hell did you know that?!?!?!?!? I don't want to here any crap from you about "converting" You obviously know more than you let on to Lord Vader. I know a bit more than I was aware of myself. All my tow trucks had T444E's in them. I never got that deep into 'em but I understand the HEUI Injectors somewhat. Didn't know about the valve you mentioned. Toto, we're not in Kansas anymore!!!


How much stuff do I need to pull off to inspect for these problems? I am short on time too. A certain member works at the local Ferd shop. Should I just let them evaluate the problems being that I'm a newbie of sorts?

 

[towcat]

1) look under the turbo and you will find the mount. look for signs of oil leakage.
2) the HPOP is mounted under the feul filter assy. look directly down behind the feul filter for signs of oil leakage.
If you do find oil in the valley area, look to see if you have oil coming from the side of the HPOP where the braided lines are coming out. If so, the fix is cheap.
If you find oil coming out the back of the HPOP, you will need to replace the whole enchilada. Do some homework for the best rebuild for your $$$. If you spend a little more for a "hotter" unit, you can chip the truck to handle higher feul flow.

 

[94f450sd]

while i would like to see the PSD section here grow but,run over to www.superdutydiesel.com .more information than you can handle over there and it is our sister site.

 

[apextrans]

1) look under the turbo and you will find the mount. look for signs of oil leakage.
2) the HPOP is mounted under the feul filter assy. look directly down behind the feul filter for signs of oil leakage.
If you do find oil in the valley area, look to see if you have oil coming from the side of the HPOP where the braided lines are coming out. If so, the fix is cheap.
If you find oil coming out the back of the HPOP, you will need to replace the whole enchilada. Do some homework for the best rebuild for your $$$. If you spend a little more for a "hotter" unit, you can chip the truck to handle higher feul flow.

Got old oil buildup in the valley pan front to back & the inside sides of the valve covers. There is also a puddle just below the fuel filter assy. @ the front of the valley pan. Can't tell where it's coming from though. I didn't see any braided lines. Could also be water left over from the dealer cleaning the engine bay but I doubt it. Do I have to (or can I )pull the filter housing to get at the HPOP?

The turbo pedistal looks to be dry all the way around from what I can see.

There is old oil buildup on the IC tubes also. Just on the bottom sides cause they washed the motor I'm guessing. What does the HPOP cost to replace if I need one?

 

[apextrans]

Scratch that. Found the braided lines (wrapped in wire loom, duh). Both fittings are dry at the pump. Passenger side line has alot of build up where it goes into the valve cover but isn't wet. Back of the pump is dry but the bottom of the pump is wet. Not dripping but definatley wet. If this pump was bad wouldn't it effect the way the truck ran? It seems to run pretty good, but maybe I don't know enough to make that determination yet. I'm used to my IDI which does run very well but this is a different animal.

 

[pafixitman]

Yes, the pump going out will effect how it runs, but the pressure the pump is capable of versus what is required allows the pump to run a very small duty cycle.

When the engine is cranked over, crankcase oil pressure builds. In addition to lubricating all of the engine's internal moving parts, the oil has one more path to follow. It travels through the timing cover to a high-pressure injection reservoir mounted on top of it, used to supply oil to the high-pressure oil pump. This pump then increases the pressure to the high levels needed to pop open the injectors, and to increase the pressure of the diesel fuel entering the cylinders for complete combustion.

The oil pressure increase is accomplished by a solenoid similar in function to an idle air control valve. This solenoid, the injection pressure regulator (IPR), is duty cycle controlled by the powertrain control module (PCM) to boost the oil pressure to the levels needed for good performance.

The oil then flows from the pump through braided steel lines to the center of each cylinder head where it runs through a central galley next to the injectors. When the PCM determines which cylinder needs to fire, it electrically energizes a solenoid in the injector to allow the high-pressure oil to enter, intensifying the pressure of the diesel fuel and injecting it into the cylinder. The PCM uses an injection control pressure sensor (ICP) to determine the oil pressure. The sensor is mounted in the inside face on the driver's side head. The more ground time applied to the IPR, the higher the pressure rises. The minimum amount of pressure needed to open the injectors is 400 psi. With a pump designed to put out well over 3,000 psi, the PCM should be able to achieve that pressure with no more than a 12 percent duty cycle on the IPR. If the ICP indicates pressure fails to reach the minimum value, the PCM continues to increase the duty cycle on the IPR until it reaches the maximum of around 60 percent. Somewhere around 50 percent, even if adequate pressure is achieved and the engine runs, the PCM sets a code for ICP above/below normal.

The first step in diagnosing a fault in this system simply requires checking the oil level in the crankcase. If the oil level drops three quarts or more, it lowers the level in the high-pressure reservoir, reducing pressure in the injection oil system. Once oil level is verified, watch the engine oil pressure gauge on the dashboard while cranking to verify that it jumps to the middle in a short amount of time. In real life, this "gauge" is an idiot light with a needle. It uses a normally open switch instead of a true sender. When engine oil pressure exceeds 5 psi, the switch closes, completing a path to ground for a voltage applied through a dropping resistor in the gauge, causing the needle to jump up. This switch is located in the top of the high-pressure reservoir. If engine oil pressure for any reason is low, it will need to be addressed first, as insufficient high pressure will result. If it is OK, monitor the rpm, ICP and rpm PIDS in the datastream with a scanner. Upon cranking, at least 150 rpm should be noted. The PCM then activates the IPR to build pressure. If the IPR reaches the max and under 400 psi is showing on ICP, or you see a reading of 2,000 to 2,500 psi (a default reading generated by the PCM when it believes the sensor is in error) and the engine doesn't start, there is a fault in the high pressure system.

To isolate the heads as a potential large leak: 1) Remove the line from the right head and cap with a suitable plug. 2) Remove the left-hand line and connect an oil pressure gauge capable of reading 3,000 psi or greater to it. 3) Crank the engine while watching the gauge for actual pressure. If the reading is low, the problem lies in the high-pressure pump or the IPR. But to determine which is the guilty culprit, you first need to replace the IPR to evaluate. If that doesn't correct it, the pump will need replacing.

Has it kicked a code (P1211 and/or P1212) or just wet?

IIRC, the HPOP is about $200 list $140 cost.

 

[apextrans]

Just an update. Took the truck into the dealership to have it checked over. One of the guys from the "basement" works there. Has a few problems.

1. Oil leak is definitely coming from the front crank seal. Still not sure about the HPOP but doesn't seem that it is leaking from what I'm being told.

2. Got a dead miss on 2 injectors when it's cold. Runs fine when warm.

3. Need alignment & maybe a steering box adjustment. Is that possible?

4. It DID have a fifth wheel in it because there is still a gapping hole in the bed under the new bed liner!!

I think I have to let them do the crank seal 'cause that's not something I can handle right now, or ever really. I'll let them align it & play with the steering box too. Can I get a recommendation on what to do about the injectors? The dealership says it might need 2 injectors. Is it worth/time to do 'em all @ 146000? How involved is an injector swap on a PSD. I know the valve covers gotta come off but that's it.

 

[94f450sd]

what do you plan on doing with the truck?do you plan on adding a chip or leaving it stock?are you gonna tow with it?the auto tranny is also a factor in the injector choices.

check out www.beansdieselperformance.com .you may be happy with a set of his tranny savers or stage1 injectors.i believe he also does stock rebuilds.

heres an article on injector replacement.its not hard,i can replace mine in about an hour if needed. http://superdutydiesel.com/wiki2/tiki-read_article.php?articleId=9