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My build thread.

Discussion in '6.9L IH & 7.3L IDI Diesels' started by Selahdoor, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. The_Josh_Bear

    The_Josh_Bear Full Access Member

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    I built a cheap bottle jack one that ended up leaking badly enough I used it enough for 8 injectors, tried to fix it better then gave up on it.

    Then I spent the $50 for an Ebay special Chinese porta-power replacement(pump and hose only). Add the hydraulic fittings from mcmaster-carr and I think it's around $85 if you already have the gauge. WAY BETTER IN EVERY WAY. I will say that it still leaks down a little so the best thing is to get a check valve of sorts between the outlet of the pump and the injector. This is how the porta power units do it anyway if I'm not mistaken.

    That's great news about 7 of 8! Hopefully it is just some sort of contaminant on the last one and they run right in no time.
     
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  2. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    Well, some good news.

    As I said, I needed to make my tester more solid, then try again.

    Got it all bolted down today, and tried again.

    This time, it is pumping up, and staying mostly pumped up, so it doesn't take much to get to that 1800 point.

    Also able now to concentrate on watching the gauge, and catching the injector out of the corner of my eye to see when it pops.

    Started with the one injector out of 8 that was leaking from the get go.

    It almost didn't leak at all the first time. Then leaked less and less each time until it was firing on the right pressure, and no leak otherwise.

    The spray pattern was strange the first few times. Then straightened right out. So I think whatever was in it got worked out because I just kept firing it. I'm thinking whatever it was soaked in the diesel fuel that was left in the injector overnight. That softened it up, and that's why it washed out today.

    Last thing I do is to pump it to just below 1800, and close the ball valve that I have in line. So far, ten minutes or so, and that injector is still holding the same pressure.



    Now I'll go back out and test the rest of them all over again, in the same way, now that it is steady and I can be sure of the results.

    I'll report back later about the results. But it looks like I have a full good set to replace my old ones with.
     
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  3. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    Ok, they ALL tested good. The shortest was just barely short of 1800. The longest was right on 1900. That's good enough for me.

    Here is the tester with the last injector on it.
    test6.JPG

    Tomorrow I'll change all the injectors on the engine.

    Gotta find a suitable box to poke holes i the bottom of, to stick the old injectors into, to keep them in order.

    Also went ahead and got a cheapo installation kit with the caps and the copper washers.

    Can't wait to get them installed and see if there is any difference.
     
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  4. YJMike92

    YJMike92 Full Access Member

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    Sound and looks like progress is being made.
     
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  5. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    For now, this tester is working good enough, that I'll use it again, on the old injectors.

    But I AM going to be on the lookout for a garage sale priced porta-power. :)
     
  6. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    Yesterday, it rained, so I sorted tools, instead.

    Found out I didn't even have the right size socket for the injectors anyway. I was sure I did.

    So I went and got the socket.



    Today, I replaced the injectors. New copper washers, new caps, etc. No leaks. No air intrusion. Still runs exactly the same.

    Only difference that I saw, was that the smoke appeared darker today. At limes it was like streams of black smoke mixed into the white.

    Still a very heavy lope when cool. Lope mostly goes away when well warmed up. But there is this loping rumble/shudder that you can feel if you run it at higher revolutions. Kind of like the lope has turned instead into a much longer lope.


    The old injectors are "E" injectors. I'll test them tomorrow.

    All of them were very easy to remove. Took quite a crack to break them loose, but once loose, they all could be spun by fingers.

    Came right out. None stuck. All had their copper washers on them.

    3 had carbon. But ALL of them were wet. Meaning the entire body of the injector was wet. The carbon was also wet and wiped right off.




    So now I know that the problem is not air intrusion.

    It is not injectors.

    It is not compression.



    As I said, tomorrow I am going to test the old injectors anyway. I just want to know what kind of shape they are in.


    Then I'll try to get the old truck started, so I can get it out of the way.

    Then I'll load up plenty of coolant, oil, and atf, and drive this one to a level spot, so I can check all the fluid levels and make them right.

    If it doesn't show difficulty in the trans, and the brakes work right, then I might take it for a drive up the highway a few miles and see what happens.


    If all that goes well, I'll have some more data. HOW it runs and drives. What kind of power does it have? Does it stumble? Does the tranny shift right? Etc.


    All other things being equal, on monday I may try changing the timing on the injection pump and see what happens.

    I can't start driving it to town and such, though, until I finally figure out that smoke. Can't be driving around leaving a cloud of smoke everywhere.
     
  7. Macrobb

    Macrobb Full Access Member

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    Changing the timing is always worth a shot ; even if you end up really advanced or retarded, it will tell you quite a bit in how it runs at these extremes.
     
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  8. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    I think that when I do the timing, I am going to do it with the engine cold.

    That really bad lope is there when it is cold. The most smoke is there when it is cold.

    If I adjust it, then, I'm thinking it will be easier to see the change. Or improvement.

    I'll get the pump ready to be moved, but still locked in place enough to keep it from moving on it's own. Start the truck. Let it have a minute at least, then start adjusting.
     
  9. bbjordan

    bbjordan Snow Monkey

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    IMHO, you are placing more concern than is warranted on the way the engine runs cold. That engine needs to go for a good run and get warm. Go ahead and do the ATF fuel treatment, and put a can of Seafoam in the crankcase. Advance the timing a bit like Macrobb said, when the engine is cold (easier of the hands :) ). High idle when cold should be about 850 to 900 according to spec. I prefer mine to idle on the high side, but I have a manual transmission.

    Is your cold advance solenoid working? When the engine is cold it advances the timing about 3 degrees.

    Take it for a good run and check the timing when the engine is warm. Don't worry about running it a little advanced. My 1992 7.3 NA ran like a scalded dog @ 11.5 degrees advanced! I backed it off to 9.5 just to be cautious.
     
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  10. YJMike92

    YJMike92 Full Access Member

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    I think it would be a really good idea to run a couple of tanks of fuel through it. Get some miles on it and see what it does.
     
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  11. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    This is kind of what I am coming to, myself. So I'll agree... with a caveat. That caveat being that this thing is SO rough at first, I don't think anyone on here would NOT be concerned, if they were right there with the truck during that time.

    I'll be adjusting the timing as soon as I can. Today turned into a day of rest. I was just way too tired to get anything at all done. Took a 3 hour nap, and then there wasn't enough of a day left to drag all the tools out to the truck, do some work, and drag all the tools back.

    I sometimes wish I had a garage or shop to work in. As it is, the weather has an affect on whether I work. And I can't just leave my tools out, but covered... tweakers would steal them before I got my front door closed behind me, when I come in at night. I only have just so much energy, and the tools are heavy. Especially when dragging them over uneven, steep, sometimes muddy and slippery ground. Everything affects everything else. But I AM working on building myself at least a crude, "defensible" workshop out front that I could pull the nose of the truck into.

    So what I said I would get done today, I'll try to get done tomorrow. Then maybe the IP timing on tuesday. We'll see.



    I AM going to try to get the IP timing up, and see if that makes a difference. THEN... I won't be getting the seafoam, but... I will fill the fuel filter with atf. Move the truck to a level area. Check all the fluids. Then take it down the highway for a good blast.



    Cold advance. Never quite sure what people mean when they ask that. The solenoid on the back end of the IP does seem to work. The solenoid that sits on top of the front of the IP, and pushes against the throttle linkage, does work.

    And as for the flat lever on the bottom front, driver's side of the IP... Well, it does push in, with a finger. And it does go in and out, when the throttle linkage is worked. So the lever works. But again, I have no idea whether what is inside the pump is stuck or not.



    Advancing the IP some, and trying to get the problem worked out that way, then making that highway run, is the last thing I want to try, as far as the top of the engine, and fuel delivery is concerned. I feel like at that point I will have had due diligence to try everything I could other than replace or rebuild the IP. It will take a long time for me to save up enough to do that, so it would be time to just drive it with problems and/or check into other possible problems

    If I keep having problems after that, I intend to take off the valve covers and check out all the rockers.

    I am not getting any "chuffing" out the exhaust that would indicate a problem with the valve openings, but you never know.



    I do still have other things to work on.

    Got to replace the wiper motor.

    Got to rebuild the support behind the headlights on the driver's side. (Apparently there was an accident or something in this trucks past, that someone tried to repair with fiberglass and it was too thin. I'll cut a piece of tin, and make a repair plate instead.)

    Got to run new circuits with relays, for the headlights.

    Got a lot of minor electrical faults to trace out and fix.

    Got a lot of cleaning to do.

    Got a whole army of mice and/or rats to get rid of.

    And more. So there will be no dearth of projects on this truck for a while.
    Yep.

    Time. Gonna take some. I don't have a budget to just get out there and drive off a few tankfuls with no other purpose. :) And will have neither the budget nor the purpose for at least a while.

    It'll get done, eventually.
     
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  12. The_Josh_Bear

    The_Josh_Bear Full Access Member

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    I can't tell if you mean you'll adjust the pump timing with the engine running or not, but I just wanted to chime in and say that timing adjustments need to be made with the engine OFF. Ford/Stanadyne says that IP damage can occur if you rotate the IP with the engine running.

    Hope you get the timing figured out soon. Also you can do the ATF before the timing(like on rainy days or if you run out of time), might clear the lope and ease your concerns a bit. I've had crazy retarded timing and it never caused a lope at all.
     
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  13. Selahdoor

    Selahdoor Full Access Member

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    Thank you.

    Yeah, I meant with the engine off. But I'm glad you made the distinction before I had it running and decided to give it another quick adjustment. LOL


    The lope is going to drive me crazy if I never get it figured out.
     
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  14. chillman88

    chillman88 Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    A word on the ATF. Fill the filter and then start it, listen carefully and you'll hear the pitch change when the ATF reaches the injectors. When this happens, shut it off and let it sit all night and soak. Then in the morning it would be best to drive it agressivley. In your case, just run it for a while if you must but the key is in letting it soak overnight with the ATF in the fuel system.
     
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  15. G. Mann

    G. Mann Full Access Member

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    ATF is loaded with carbon and sludge dissolving materials. It's the secret that makes automatic transmissions survive incredible working loads and temperatures. Those same sludge dissolving materials just happen to work "pretty well" in our injector pump and injectors, doing the same thing.
     

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