Lost Power- where to start

Easton

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I have a 94 turbo with the E4OD with 210,000 miles. Over the last year or so I've steadily lost power. In addition I've started to have hard shifts and gear searching. Driving up our mountain with a trailer a few weeks ago I lost all torque but maintained RPMS. I put it into first gear, nothing. Put it in 4 Lo and had enough torque to get up the hill and to the house. after that I had it into the shop to check the transmission and they found "large chunks" of metal in the pan and burnt fluid- ok, needs tranny work.

I've deleted the factory air filter and have added a larger one, added an electric fuel pump, it has the upgraded downpipe and a non-restrictive exhaust yet in looking at gauges I can't exceed about 6psi of boost regardless of the load (down from about 10 psi in the past). I've attempted to adjust the IP, but the set screw is seized.

My initial thought was that if I'm having tranny issues then the likely original torque converter may be nearing end-of-life as well which would cause a loss. But it also could very likely be injectors and/or bad IP. I guess my question is... where is the right place to start?
 

Philip1

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I would start by making sure you are having steady fuel pressure and that the fuel filter is good. After that, if you are using the old torque converter out of the failed transmission, I would recommend changing it because the torque converter life would be somewhat similar to the transmission plus the contaminants from the failed transmission would likely damage the t/c.
 

Fredrickson

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So the RPMS stay up.. but it just doesn't get power to the wheels?
Is it just slipping real bad?

When you dropped the pan, what did the filter look like?
Does it move in reverse?

Can you pull any codes?
 

Big Bart

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Food for thought.

I would get your tranny and torque converter repaired and in tip top shape first. (Cleary you have chunks of metal and burnt fluid so time for a rebuild.) Sounds like clutches or torque converter where slipping. (Otherwise you should have lost RPM's too.) Also you will want to clean out the tranny cooler lines, tranny cooler in the radiator, and the secondary tranny cooler if you have one before putting your tranny back in. If that does not fix your issue then you can move on to the fuel system.

Some thoughts on loss of power due to a fuel issue. Start with looking at the less expensive and more commone issues first.

1) Clogged fuel filter.
2) Lift pump is going out, pumping some fuel but not enough for higher RPMS or under load. You mentioned a electric fuel pump. Did this lack of power issue start around the same time?
3) Injector pump timing. Not clear if you are trying to turn up your fuel mixture, or set your injector pump timing. They are two very different things. I would check the IP timing, as injectors and IP's wear out, the opening timing of the injector changes. (Less IP fuel volume to injector, less pressure to the the injector, or worn injector pintle spring can change the injector opening timing.) This is why when you change injectors you should always check your timing. Your timing may have been set with older injectors. Your new injectors may have a different opening PSI.
4) Restricted exhaust. Perhaps you squished part of your exhaust system, now its restricting your exhaust.
5) See if your turbo is spinning freely. You seem to be loosing power, a turbo can be part of the issue. A turbo with bearing or housing issues will not add as much boost or it can restrict the exhaust flow if not freely spinning. (The turbo blocks the exhaust from getting by easily.)

So after all that then perhaps you tackle a rebuilt IP and new injectors if they are over 100,000mi old. You will also want to put on a new fuel line return kit with the injectors.

Let us know what you find out!
 
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IDIBRONCO

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I'll agree with Bradd about the transmission being the #1 thing to get fixed. Then I'd get the timing checked and reset if needed.
 

Easton

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Thanks for the info. I'm looking at replacing the tranny, torque converter and replacing all the lines in the near future, its just a matter of cost at this point. about 75% of the time the tranny works great with no issues, then on occasion it jumps between gears, which is why I'm torn on the first place to start.

I'll check the turbo and make sure its spinning freely.

I was trying to turn up the fuel mixture in the IP, not adjust the timing. Which is something I'll need to do soon it sounds like. So i'll be looking up that process.

fuel filter is new and I added an electronic pump about two months ago, so the lack of power happened prior to that addition.

As far as the tranny pan, the dealership pulled it and they were fairly non-specific about what they found, other than chunks and it needs to be replaced. The only codes I've pulled were for the speed sensor, which I've pulled, cleaned off and reinstalled.

The challenge I'm having is the inconsistent shifting issue. Because it happens with no real recurring frequency its hard to really narrow it down to a specific cause.
 

Big Bart

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First just note the E40D was a disappointment over the C6 in regard to reliability. Its future grand kid the 4R75W is still dying too early and disappointing folks like me! So many, likely most, of the members on this site have taken issue with their E40D. It did however give these trucks the ability to go faster on the HWY and lower the RPM which is a win-win of sorts. (I am doing 2,700RPM at 63MPH with a C6, since I mainly use this truck for towing and Home Depot runs that works for me. However, I wish I had a 4th gear to drop the RPM's to say 2,100 at 65mph.) So, know rebuilding the tranny is big bucks but it will bring back tens of thousands of miles of no tranny issues. (Not to mention a new diesel Ford F250 Super Crew is $65,000.)


The part that suggests start with the tranny is you say you lose torque (Now that can be debated what everyone defines torque as when driving.) but keep RPM's. You mention you are told you have large chunks of something in the pan and burnt tranny fluid. That your truck is batting 75% working, 25% not working. The tranny is hunting/shifting erratically at times. All sound like tranny issues, not an engine losing power/torque. If it was engine torque the tranny would downshift, but not shift erratically in my opinion. (Just keep downshifting.) The chunks could be clutch material/clutch band material or metal from something gone wrong. But common when something is wrong is the clutches slip, the fluid burns, and you lose power/torque to the axle, but your engine torque is still the same. (The tranny thus is not delivering the torque/power from the engine as torque/power to the driveshaft and axle, it is wasting the engine torque/power from letting the clutches slip and burn.) In this case the vehicle slows down but your RPM's stay up or increase. In this scenario it is not an engine issue rather a tranny issue. Just know in this case you are likely running up your rebuild bill as you can now start to damage the metal parts (Heat warp, cracks, contamination, and bluing.) due to the slipping and polluting of the tranny fluid.


Perhaps you can quickly determine if your tranny, torque converter, or engine seem to be the actual culprit. Some food for thought on how to determine.


1) Tranny - You may notice the RPM's do not decrease or possibly increase upon noticing less torque/power to the wheels. A very common cause is the tranny clutches are slipping. (Truck goes slower, but engine maintains or increases RPM.) This would also confuse the E40D as RPM's are high, wheel speed is low, and gas pedal is perhaps done far or all the way. Telling the tranny to change gears or hunting trying to get within the parameters it is set for. When you went to 4wd low, the clutches had to work far less to move the vehicle as it was now geared down and reducing the amount of work the tranny needed to do.

2) Torque converter - As I recall one advantage of a E40D over a C6 is the lock up torque converter. So perhaps what you are experiencing is a lack of lock up. (But does not explain why you could not get up a hill at slower speeds.) So at HWY speeds your noticing less power or a downshift. This still is a tranny related issue. If you have chunks of material and burnt fluid you still want to do both. If your torque converter had bitten the dust it would also bend or perhaps break off fins and perhaps that is part of the "Chunks" in the tranny pan. Giving you less torque/power to the axle at all times.

3) Engine - My experience when a IDI is ailing you feel a lot of uneven or dramatic power/torque changes. (Truck making clear changes via surging from power and accelleration. To slowing and lower RPM's.) It seems as if these engines are either charging forward, or they are slowing the vehicle. (Maybe not slowing as much with a E40D, perhaps you go into a neutral state like many overdrive vehicles do when releasing the gas pedal, I have not been in a IDI with a E40D.) When having a fuel issue if you keep your foot in one position the truck cuts some/all power, then comes back, then cuts and comes back. Then often just cuts out because of the fuel starvation problem. Clog, air in the lines, or failure of the lines, IP, the tank is empty (Many fuel level gauges no longer work on these old beasts! :) or lift pump. My point is you should be able to tell because of a drop off in engine power/torque is immediate and resulting in changing RPM's and a surge to slow down or a surge to speed up. VS a tranny or torque converter that would be more Suttle/softer change of power/torque. (More on loosing, less on surging back to power.)

Two thoughts why I still think you start with the tranny. 1) You did not explain any of the above engine symptoms. 2) As mentioned earlier check your turbo, it could dramatically change the engine performance if your bearings or something is impeding the turbo from spinning. But doubt it would cripple the engine so much you needed 4wd low to move the truck. Check the fan for side-to-side play. (It will have a little but not much.) Does it spin freely with your finger or do you have to turn with a socket. (It should turn freely.) Do you see any broken fins or a cracked housing?


Then you should know if you should spend say $3,000 (Less if you pull and replace it.) on a tranny or say $1,700 on a rebuilt IP and new injectors. (After you confirm it’s not a fuel supply issue to the IP.) I would hate for you to spend $1,700 then find out that did not fix your truck and now have your truck down waiting to do the $3,000 tranny.


All the best and be sure to follow up with what you did to fix it.
 

71 Highboy

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good info Bradd! I would have pulled it out as soon as the chunks fell out, instead of running it more. He's got bad symptoms going on. Regarding the 4th gear problem with a C6, I fixed that with a GV unit. In front of a remote 205. Just don't use it for slowing down, and always shift up or down under lite throttle, just like the C6.

You must be registered for see images attach
 

Big Bart

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71 Highboy,

Ditto.

My son smoked my other trucks 4R75W. There was an issue where the clutches started slipping. Trying to get to his friends house a couple of blocks further VS pulling over and getting towed. Well it ended up in him costing us another couple hundred for a used clutch housing/input shaft he burned up. (He was doing say 3,000rpm so he could drive at 2-3MPH to his buddies house.)

I like your set up! If this was a daily driver (Not the occasional tow vehicle.) I would be searching vs writing this. (Although my 16 year old keeps steeling my daily driver till we get his 67 Ford Galaxie running.)

I saw this or something like this on Hot Rod Garage not too long ago. Looks like GV is about 1.5 hours south of me in El Cajon east of San Diego. Great way to get more gears, higher speeds, and fix the high RPM issues. I will keep it in mind for the future as a fun project! Let me know if you come accross any cheap, complete, and good used ones. They are very pricey new.

However I am looking at some point in the near future buying a new diesel truck for family trips and towing. I will keep my current one for those Home Depot runs and rainy days.

Thank you for the heads up and the pic!
 

IDIBRONCO

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As far as the tranny pan, the dealership pulled it and they were fairly non-specific about what they found, other than chunks and it needs to be replaced.
Be careful with this. They're called "stealerships" for a reason.
 

Easton

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Thanks for the info and guidance. Sounds like I need to bite the bullet and do the tranny first. It may be a month or two, but I'll update the post when I'm able to get that done.
 

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