Drilling a 460 ZF5

[riotwarrior]

Take your end mill chuck in a hand drill and tell me how much it pulls to the side. Also a cheap press with side to side play doesn't make a round hole.
There is a lot of sidways force from that cutter. Its a lot different than a drill bit.

Hand drill...*** u talking bout and smokin willis?

Now that's something completely different. It is not desgined for that. Same goes for using a tapered ream I'd only use that for this purpose in a good quality benchtop drill press or as the one I'm looking at buying a nice Radial arm floor standing press. Then with moderate pressure and correct speed things happen nicely.

Using a hand drill for an end mill well that's just W R O N G by any standard...there are tools for the job and hand drills are not one of them. However this procedure is not one for a hand drill really anyway to be accurate and square! That is unless you are using a MAG drill on a big plate bolted to the case! That's different ....

just saying!

 

[Wicked97]

You completely over read what I was saying.

As I said before use a press or mag drill ATTACHED to the case.

The hand drill was just as a example of how different a mill is than a bit.

 

[icanfixall]

Guys.. Were drilling soft aluminum. Not carbon steel. The good dr has a great pic when he used a nice lagre mag base drill and a heavy piece of metal to mag to. then he used a end mill and made some holes. No walking either. Remember its aluminum. I radial arm drill press is designed to drill huge holes.. Or at least the one I used in the machine shop. It had a 4 or 5 ft bed on it and was able to handle about 6 ft tall parts. I saw it drilling out 2 1/2 inch holes in a piece of carbon steel plate. Its amazing seeing metal act like that. A Bridgeport mill is a completely other machine designed for end milling too. I have used them in all fachions of milling and shaping of aluminum, cast iron and hard steels. Knowing your machines is paramont to knowing what you can do... Safely.. Please lets not start name calling. We are all grownups helping others.

 

[Wicked97]

A radial arm press and a Bridgeport mill are on my ifiwinthelotteryiwillbuyone list.

 

[Bashby]

Well it just so happens my Bridgeport AND my radial arm press are in the shop, so I'm going with a drill and drill bits. I think if I use the 2 holes halfway down that intersect with the existing holes as a guide I can get them even, tighten the adapter plate up and drill away. The adapter is pretty thick and should keep the bits from walking... it is just aluminum, and the dowel holes only need to be so deep.

 

[franklin2]

It's been my experience a FACTORY sharpened drill is going to stay pretty centered anyway. especially if it's a good quality bit. Absolutely the best way to do this is to have a plate that was mentioned before, that was already machined to fit tightly over the 460 dowels, and had hardened bushings in the correct places for the new holes. You could drill them with a hand drill then, the hardened bushing would guide the drill bit right where it needed to be.

Using those two upper holes is always going to be risky, even with a milling machine. The bolt holes are clearance holes, the dowel pins are what really line it up. Too bad we can't mathematically figure out from the old dowels to the new dowels. I can't even believe why we are even having this problem. I have said it before and I will say it again, why in the world didn't they go ahead and make the diesel adapter match the 460 pattern. I would like to ask a Ford engineer that question.

 

[Wicked97]

Ford really ****** me off with the different pattern on every motor crap.

Chevy did it right. One bell all motors.

 

[Bashby]

Ford has done a lot of things that make no sense, just to be different it appears.

The bottom 4 bell housing bolt holes on the idi go through the adapter plate and thread into the block, so those 4 bolts and the dowels in relation to the crank centerline make the big block pattern impossible. Hope that makes sense... beers are goin down good.

 

[Mike-M]

Im starting this swap right now. Is it possible to use the front case from the idi zf5 over the tail and internals from the 460 zf5?
I have my idi one apart already, and it was pretty easy. Seems a lot easier than drilling, oddly.

 

[riotwarrior]

Im starting this swap right now. Is it possible to use the front case from the idi zf5 over the tail and internals from the 460 zf5?
I have my idi one apart already, and it was pretty easy. Seems a lot easier than drilling, oddly.

Short answer YES...

BEST ANSWER!!!

Read the tech article on how to rebuild a ZF 5sp, then you know how to set the bearings preloads etc and then it should work alright...otherwise you could wipe out a bearing or have a noisy transmission.

Whilt it's apart rebuild it and be done!

 

[Bashby]

Got mine drilled the other day, those dewalt pilot point bits are the bomb. It did try to walk when drilling those holes that intersected the existing ones, but with the adapter plate as a guide it wasn't too hard to keep it straight. I had to use a 3/8" bolt through the dowel holes as well as two 1/2" bolts through the top holes to hold the adapter... It was flexing allowing the bit to wobble. Now I just need to put it in and hope it works.

 

[seawalkersee]

Holy crap...that got ugly and I quit reading. So, I will chime in here and say, I guess I am an idiot. I used the adaptor plate AND a hand drill. I did the top holes and bolted it together. Then the dowels. Lastly the rest of the holes. Been driving it for a few weeks now, and it lined up perfectly. Now it WAS out of a salt truck...so a lot of the holes are gone, as well as the tranny mount. Wonder what I am gonna do next?

SWS

 

[Knuckledragger]

If you have an empty case, I would suggest talking to a local machine shop to see about getting the holes drilled or reamed in the right places. Spending a few bucks to have it done right the first time is way cheaper than rebuilding a trans that had a bearing failure because of misalignment.

I'm sorry the dowels are in different locations, but eyeballing it is a really dangerous method to use.

 

[icanfixall]

The alignment dowels are there for one reason. to align the trans with the crank no matter what type trns you have. There are specs of how this is to be done. If the trans id up or down or side to side off center that trans is going to vibrate. Even the torque converter has a pilot bushing fit so its driving on center and driving an oliptical rotation.

 

[BigRigTech]

I drilled my 460 ZF case exactly as he described 3+ years ago, always has and still works fine. I took out the IDI and installed the new 7.3PSD last night with a 13" LUK SMF and clutch. It really wasn't that hard I just sat down on the trucks crossmember and had at it, ten minutes later she was done. You would have to be off a bunch to have issues and using the steel IDI adapter as a drill guide makes it easy. It lines up so close to the outside of the trans case it's easy to see if you are off much. Just my two cents, worked for me....The critical part is the drill bit size, the top two holes should be snug on the 1/2" bolts to line it up for you.