clutch chatter

[RLDSL]

You haven't by any chance had any fuel leaks or been bleeding the injectors all over the top of the engine and not cleaning it off, have you?

If you get diesel running off the back of the block it can drain down right over the clutch and soak that turkey down.

When I put my new engine in, I ran a bead of silicone over the cracks where the block, adapter plate and bellhousing join to keep that from happening. I didn't want to take a chance on messing up my nice fresh kevlar clutch

Before I tore mine apart , my old clutch was fuel soaked and did the exact same thing, trying to back up, even without the trailer was chatter central, then one night I was having trouble backing in blind side in a downpour and smoked the poo out of the thing and no more chatter after I burned it all off and worked ok after that, but when I yanked the engine, I put the rebuilt kevlar clutch in and that thing is nice even when backing up the 5er into squirrily camp spots.

I have to agree, the reverse gear is way too tall on these things. I don't know what the heck they were thinking . The zf5 for the gas burners has a much more practical ratio.
That tall reverse is the only thing keeping me apprehensive about going to a 3.73 rear end. With the 4.10 that reverse is tall enough when loaded, 3.73 I would think, would give the poor clutch a workout.
-------Robert

 

[Exekiel69]

If i where to resurface the SMF then replace the clutch and pressure plate where else can I get a clutch/pp/pilot bearing/TO bearing kit? I don't want to send another check for $250 this time to dialAclutch, I baby it too much to be wasting money so is there another 12" kit that would work or anywhere else to order them from?

Thank You.

 

[hesutton]

EZ you could call South Bend Clutch. They have clutch kits for the IDI's and I got a 12 inch clutch from them over a year ago and have been happy.

Heath

 

[ttman4]

resurfacing FW

Something to think about....
Few yr ago I was talking to Automotive Shop Teacher at local JC. He mentioned that if FW's are resurfaced there is a max .000 that they can be resurfaced before shims need to be added between crank & FW to bring it back to original so clutch & PP & clutch pedal can operate correctly. I don't remember what he said about hyd clutch set-up in relation to this subject.
And he did say that shims are available.....where, I don't know. I've seen these shims years ago in a box of tools I bought from a widow, but didn't really know what or why they were for.
Also, when shimming, there is max .000 shims that can be added before starter teeth engagement becomes an issue.

 

[Exekiel69]

Something to think about....
Few yr ago I was talking to Automotive Shop Teacher at local JC. He mentioned that if FW's are resurfaced there is a max .000 that they can be resurfaced before shims need to be added between crank & FW to bring it back to original so clutch & PP & clutch pedal can operate correctly. I don't remember what he said about hyd clutch set-up in relation to this subject.
And he did say that shims are available.....where, I don't know. I've seen these shims years ago in a box of tools I bought from a widow, but didn't really know what or why they were for.
Also, when shimming, there is max .000 shims that can be added before starter teeth engagement becomes an issue.

Now I'm really lost.

 

[ttman4]

EZ, I posted mostly as thoughts, & actually I don't know at what point shims need to be added, nor if it would matter when hyd. clutch/slave cyl set-up is involved vs a manual clutch set-up.
What that shop teacher was referring to is that as FW is resurfaced, let's say .060", then the FW surface that the disc & PP engage on is now .060" closer (farther forward) to crank. This would change the clutch linkage and/or slave cyl. linkage action by .060".
(I had my DMF resurfaced once years ago & IIRC about .060 was milled off.)

If this was done 2-3 times, then the FW, at some point, would become too thin....disc engaging surface would be closer to crankshaft & clutch linkage action would work wrong....like the disc was worn too much, etc.
Thin steel shims of equal .000" added between crank & FW would bring FW face back closer to original position.
If refacing was done lots (& I don't know how much would be too much, but let's say .200") then if .200" of shims was added between crank & FW, then FW would sit .200" farther back toward tranny, but also .200" farther back & away from starter teeth engagement.
I have no idea how much is too much distance for starter teeth mis-engagement.

Also at some point of resurfacing & thinning the FW, I imagine that heat & warpage would become a problem.

Hope I said all this OK, & not talking thru my ears.

 

[Exekiel69]

EZ, I posted mostly as thoughts, & actually I don't know at what point shims need to be added, nor if it would matter when hyd. clutch/slave cyl set-up is involved vs a manual clutch set-up.
What that shop teacher was referring to is that as FW is resurfaced, let's say .060", then the FW surface that the disc & PP engage on is now .060" closer (farther forward) to crank. This would change the clutch linkage and/or slave cyl. linkage action by .060".
(I had my DMF resurfaced once years ago & IIRC about .060 was milled off.)

If this was done 2-3 times, then the FW, at some point, would become too thin....disc engaging surface would be closer to crankshaft & clutch linkage action would work wrong....like the disc was worn too much, etc.
Thin steel shims of equal .000" added between crank & FW would bring FW face back closer to original position.
If refacing was done lots (& I don't know how much would be too much, but let's say .200") then if .200" of shims was added between crank & FW, then FW would sit .200" farther back toward tranny, but also .200" farther back & away from starter teeth engagement.
I have no idea how much is too much distance for starter teeth mis-engagement.

Also at some point of resurfacing & thinning the FW, I imagine that heat & warpage would become a problem.

Hope I said all this OK, & not talking thru my ears.

Got it, so I guess it is a good idea to have it resurfaced once I drop the tranny to have a look see if nothing improves but it is also good not to make it a routine. I hope I never need to drop the tranny so many times.

Thank You.

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

When I had mine resurfaced they took off the minimum amount they could to get it all cleaned up. Around .040" IIRC. Obviously not enough to make a difference with a hydraulic clutch since I didn't shim it and there have been no PP or starter engagement issues....

 

[ttman4]

When I had mine resurfaced they took off the minimum amount they could to get it all cleaned up. Around .040" IIRC. Obviously not enough to make a difference with a hydraulic clutch since I didn't shim it and there have been no PP or starter engagement issues....

I don't remember how much they too off my DMF when I had it done (& that was several yr ago) but couple of other times I had engine out & I cked FW with straight edge. These last times there was about same unevenness/slight warpage that there was when I had it resurfaced. These last times I didn't bother to resurface, and operation seemed to be about same as right after the time I resurfaced.
I remember taking the DMF apart for the machine shop to resurface it.

As far as starter engagement issues this would only be of concern if FW was shimmed back away from Crankshaft several .000"

 

[subway]

I don't remember how much they too off my DMF when I had it done (& that was several yr ago) but couple of other times I had engine out & I cked FW with straight edge. These last times there was about same unevenness/slight warpage that there was when I had it resurfaced.

sure it wasent the straight edge just sounds very odd that they could machine in the same uneveness unless it could possible be how the flywheel is mounted that makes it off.....like if the mounting surface is not parrallel and flat matching the clutch surface.

i dont reccomend it but in a pinch i have just hit a flywheel with a palm sander hanging around the hot spots more heavily. it worked to it was just a get it by clutch job on the cheep though.

 

[towcat]

flywheel shims do exist for our trucks. I haven't had to use one yet, but wished I did when I resurfaced my DMF years ago. Unfortunately the clutch job lasted for a year and the wear pattern on the flywheel really bothered me so I went for a used replacement instead.
check out these two links. I have bought from this company for auto transmission stuff frequently.
www.teckpak.com
here's the part linky...
http://www.teckpak.com/spgm.cfm?id=SF46025-B

 

[subway]

um that first link goes to a foam manufacturer

got the switch the tech - teck