velacreations
Full Access Member
well, because with international shipping and delayed mail service, I'm out the core charge.
Also, I'd like to know for sure that is the issue before dropping another $800 on it.
94 Turbo won't start when hot, this is after the IP rebuld!
- Thread starter velacreations
- Start date
Also, I'd like to know for sure that is the issue before dropping another $800 on it.
Black dawg
Registered User
THe pump will go on a long time, if it is just a head and rotor tolerance issue.
riotwarrior
Full Access Member
I bet if you worked with MEL you could maybe work a deal on core. Or have a member here provide a core for you on your behalf.
Just sayin...
Lots of ways to skin a cat...Or get an IP that is from an extremely reputable shop.
velacreations
Full Access Member
yeah, I've emailed Mel, and we'll see what we can work out. I'll look for a core around here, too.
I thought I was, but I guess it wasn't.
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One thing to consider is that hot start issues are caused usually by dirt damaging the head and rotor. There is a possibility that your fuel system is passing trash into the IP. It would be a REALLY good idea, to completely flush all your fuel lines, filter head, replace your filter, all your olives and possibly even drop and clean your tanks. If you had access to a second IDI, you could always do a pump swap between the two, and see if the perfectly good pump gets ruined on your truck. Not the best idea, but it would confirm your truck is the problem.
Black dawg
Registered User
I guess that I assumed that the problem was immediate after pump replacement? Is that not the case?
velacreations
Full Access Member
We did flush the system and even put in new fuel lines, filters, etc when we were changing things out. The hot start problem started immediately, and each pump showed the signs right away when we tested in the truck. Every pump tested fine in the lab.
You might be right, it could be dirt and stuff, in which case, it will be in my tanks (the only part not cleaned). But, it seems weird that it would show right away. And won't the filter help keep that kinda of debris out of the the IP?
You might be right, it could be dirt and stuff, in which case, it will be in my tanks (the only part not cleaned). But, it seems weird that it would show right away. And won't the filter help keep that kinda of debris out of the the IP?
riotwarrior
Full Access Member
I'm not saying your shops are not reputable, I'm saying that MEL is known as a premiere builder of pumps, thus knowing what you have gone through and such would no doubt make absolutely sure that what you got was a great pump!
The objective is here to resolve this issue you have nothing more, we want to see you with a good working truck regardless of where parts come from.
Seems to me with what you have said about new lines, filters, and such and not dropping tanks, that before anything more take place you should check your tanks for contamination prior to any further diagnostic steps.
Start at the starting place and move forward
I surely hope you get your unit running well and soon cause I know what a pain in the backside hard hot starts can be as I get them NOW and then.
Good luck
Oh and DON"T use FRAM filters get some Motorcraft fuel filters if possible, what kind are you using btw?
Al
velacreations
Full Access Member
No, I hear ya, and I appreciate the help. I had assumed the shop and suppliers were reputable, because I was referred to them by lots of people in my area. Not only that, but we tried multiple suppliers/rebuilders. I know Mel is a great guy and a great builder of pumps, I don't dispute that at all.
I do have my doubts that so many shops are bad, though. There are many of the IDIs on the road down here, still, and I just find it hard to believe that going through so many pumps and suppliers, that none of them can get it right. But, it sure does appear that may be the case! I just keep thinking that there must be something else going on here.
We did drop the tanks, but we didn't clean them out, cause there were no signs of contamination (plugged filters, dirty fuel, starting problems, etc)
I should also mention that my old IP did not have this issue, and it was on the truck since it rolled out of the factory! It was showing signs of wear, and my injectors were overdue for a change, that's why we changed everything. But the old IP never had a hot starting issue. And I've never had any other indication of dirty tanks/fuel. I'm not saying the tanks are clean, but I don't have any other symptoms of dirty tanks.
I think it would take some time with an IP running in the truck for the heat soak issue to be cause by a dirty system. We literally would drop a IP into the truck, run the truck until it was warm, then turned it off, let it set for 30 minutes, and then it wouldn't start. I'm no expert, but I would think that it would take more than 15-20 minutes of running the truck before dirt was an issue with the IP. And really, if the filters are never dirty and I'm not having any other symptoms of that, how likely is it that dirt caused this problem on 6 different pumps (most of them in the truck for less than an hour)?
yeah, me too. I really am at a loss as to what to try next.
I've got a wix in there right now.
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velacreations
Full Access Member
ok, someone told me to try and put 12v to the cold advance and see if that helps it start when hot.
It didn't help me, but something I noticed was that the voltage at the FSS was only about 11.6, but the batteries read 12.5 (after cranking for a while). At the fuse box under the hood, all the fuses read around 12.4 volts. So, I've got some resistance to the FSS, would this affect the hot starts?
My cranking speed seems strong, but I have no way to actually test it. To me, it seems like the same speed hot or cold, and if the truck has only been sitting for 20 minutes, it starts right away (1-2 second rotation)
It didn't help me, but something I noticed was that the voltage at the FSS was only about 11.6, but the batteries read 12.5 (after cranking for a while). At the fuse box under the hood, all the fuses read around 12.4 volts. So, I've got some resistance to the FSS, would this affect the hot starts?
My cranking speed seems strong, but I have no way to actually test it. To me, it seems like the same speed hot or cold, and if the truck has only been sitting for 20 minutes, it starts right away (1-2 second rotation)
icanfixall
Official GMM hand model
I'm still wondering if all the rebuilders are getting their parts from the same person or supplier. If so that might be the problems. Seeing that you have tried several diffeant builders on these pumps. If they are all getting the parts from the same place maybe the place is not really selling new or good parts. I really only know one person that can look at the pump internals and tell you if they are shot. Thats Mel and his builder. Once the pump rotor is worn what you end up with is the heat soak hard starts like your having. This is why I continue to go back to the builders and their parts. I know I could never determine if the parts are worn or not and I used micrometers for a living. We are talking about much less than 1 thousands clearance. I really hope you find out why this issue is plagueing you. Its a tuff diagnosis for sure.
velacreations
Full Access Member
I don't know where they are all getting their parts. I do know that 2 of the pumps came from the US, so it is unlikely that those pumps had the same suppliers as the others.
riotwarrior
Full Access Member
Just off top of my head...have a gander in the HALL of SHAME, see if any of the vendors there where suppliers of any of your pumps.
velacreations
Full Access Member
I am running #2, but I haven't checked the viscosity. I've gone through several tanks with it acting like this.
I need to figure out how to keep it going, though, I hate to depend on the water trick, cause I'm afraid it may cause damage. Any bandaid method to keep the truck on the road?
I need to figure out how to keep it going, though, I hate to depend on the water trick, cause I'm afraid it may cause damage. Any bandaid method to keep the truck on the road?
yeah, I will look at that and see
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