9 or 10 speed Trans?

[Diesel JD]

I know when I install the brownie, around town I'll probably just run throgh the gears in high range and split 3rd and 4th. A common problem I have is that I'm in traffic and 3rd gear is all wound out at 30-35 and 4th is lugging and I'm just trying not to rear end somebody. 3rd over would be perfect here.

 

[gonecrazyi]

Thats interesting id, with 410s im doing 35 in 5 gear with no lugging until i try to accelerate quickly, then i just drop and gear and let her role.

 

[91fummins]

I just want one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[timothyr1014]

most people miss the point of multi-speed transmissions that are used in med/heavy duty trucks....its a pretty rare occasion that will you go through all the gears in sequence. Its all about being able to match your road speed to a desired engine speed.

As an example in one of the old 10 speed trucks when running full my shift pattern was generall 1-2-3-5-7-8-10, however empty I would generally start out in 3rd, wind it out and grab 7....litterally driving it like a 3 or 4 speed

 

[GOOSE]

That is an RTO 610 or 6610, the latter being a newer unit. I do believe our engines are a SAE #3 bell. This would be an easy setup although I believe they use a divorced t-case to make the set up work. I am not sure what the 610's od ratio is but do not believe it would match a brownie behind a zf5 speed and the double over that you would get from that .

 

[franklin2]

That is an RTO 610 or 6610, the latter being a newer unit. I do believe our engines are a SAE #3 bell. This would be an easy setup although I believe they use a divorced t-case to make the set up work. I am not sure what the 610's od ratio is but do not believe it would match a brownie behind a zf5 speed and the double over that you would get from that .

I thought the engine block casting would be a SAE type also, but someone corrected me and said the holes in the block are some weird International Harvester bellhousing pattern, and you have to get a adapter to change it to SAE.

 

[Diesel JD]

I had always heard without the Ford adapter they used an SAE3 bellhousing.

 

[RLDSL]

If you need air, I got a real nice constant duty 12v 150 psi compressor from an outfit that sells on ebay that goes by Hornblasters that I use for the automatic leveling system on my air suspension. These compressors are nice they can be mounted in a dirty location and come with a snorkle with a remote air filter intake so you can mount the intake in a tool box or what have you and that's the only thing taking up space. I have it plumbed into a storage tank that came off a semi trailer. It's also just the right size to be able to run my air tools in a jam Very easy to rig up a setup like that.

 

[Diesel_brad]

I do not understand the need for 10 speeds in a pickup. 5- or 6 is enough. If you need more gear than that you are towing to much. Big trucks use them because they haul 80,000. As someone stated earlier, you drive a big truck like a 3 or 4 speed empty. So in a pick up it is just unnessary. On top of the trans weighing close to 1000lbs and being almost twice the size

 

[timothyr1014]

Brad, it was my remark about running empty and only using 3~4 gears, and I agree with you to a point, but there is another side...I will openly admit that my t-19 does get the job done, it also labors the engine in the process. On just about any decent grade if I have anything close to 10k behind her I am taking every gear up to the govenor to get up to speed; not because I am getting any more power, but because the ratios are so widely spaced that if I dont I end up totally out of the power band (2nd to 3rd is a great example with a nearly 1800rpm drop). This also becomes an issue when pulling grades at freeway speeds....If I can sit right at 62~65 she pulls along no problem, but if traffic drops below about 55~57 mph I have no way to hold speed and am stuck grabbing 3rd and dropping to 45 mph (and then winding it totally out if I need to get back up to speed.

My point is that even now my truck has no issues pulling 10~12k on a fairly routine basis, where I have the issue is that with the factory setup what you get is 2 "get it moving" gears (1st and 2nd), and 2 "road speed" gears. Essentially there are only 2 fairly narrow ranges where the motor will be working most effeciently. Adding gears gives you more area to work with.

The same argument could be made for not needing 4 lo....rarely do you actually NEED it, but its alot easier on everything when you dont have to hold your foot to the floor.

Unfortuantly our trucks are not powerhouses that do well outside their powerband, personally I have found my truck is happy flat-landing in the 1700~2k range, and pulling grades in the 2400~2800 range. The tranny setup that is going into mine is geared to have a ~500 rpm between each cog. Granted I will probably never see the need to run sequencially through all the gears, it will be very nice to have a sweet spot gear for just about any road speed up to 70....and total weight is 732lbs (admittidly not totally light, but for the advantages I think well worth it)

 

[Diesel_brad]

Brad, it was my remark about running empty and only using 3~4 gears, and I agree with you to a point, but there is another side...I will openly admit that my t-19 does get the job done, it also labors the engine in the process. On just about any decent grade if I have anything close to 10k behind her I am taking every gear up to the govenor to get up to speed; not because I am getting any more power, but because the ratios are so widely spaced that if I dont I end up totally out of the power band (2nd to 3rd is a great example with a nearly 1800rpm drop). This also becomes an issue when pulling grades at freeway speeds....If I can sit right at 62~65 she pulls along no problem, but if traffic drops below about 55~57 mph I have no way to hold speed and am stuck grabbing 3rd and dropping to 45 mph (and then winding it totally out if I need to get back up to speed.

My point is that even now my truck has no issues pulling 10~12k on a fairly routine basis, where I have the issue is that with the factory setup what you get is 2 "get it moving" gears (1st and 2nd), and 2 "road speed" gears. Essentially there are only 2 fairly narrow ranges where the motor will be working most effeciently. Adding gears gives you more area to work with.

The same argument could be made for not needing 4 lo....rarely do you actually NEED it, but its alot easier on everything when you dont have to hold your foot to the floor.

Unfortuantly our trucks are not powerhouses that do well outside their powerband, personally I have found my truck is happy flat-landing in the 1700~2k range, and pulling grades in the 2400~2800 range. The tranny setup that is going into mine is geared to have a ~500 rpm between each cog. Granted I will probably never see the need to run sequencially through all the gears, it will be very nice to have a sweet spot gear for just about any road speed up to 70....and total weight is 732lbs (admittidly not totally light, but for the advantages I think well worth it)

I agree, thats why a 5 or 6 speed works so good. Tightens the gap up between the gears.

 

[RLDSL]

I do not understand the need for 10 speeds in a pickup. 5- or 6 is enough. If you need more gear than that you are towing to much. Big trucks use them because they haul 80,000. As someone stated earlier, you drive a big truck like a 3 or 4 speed empty. So in a pick up it is just unnessary. On top of the trans weighing close to 1000lbs and being almost twice the size

You don't quite understand how a diesel works yet. They have a VERY limited RPM range where they are truely effective, below or above and power and fuel mileage go in the toilet. Sticking 5 speed boxes behind the things and trying to pull any kind of weight is a stretch. BEing able to split gears I went from a max of 11.5 mpg towing to 13.1 , and with the added benefit of running in 4 over I don't constantly have to shift on the interstate, I can just sing along at a steady boost rate, and my empty mileage has gone from a best of 14 mpg up to the 18.5-20 mpg range. All an auxiliary box or a 10 speed does is allow you to operate the engine where it was designed to be run.

 

[trapper]

id like to put a 10 speed in my setup with a Div Tcase for my 4x4

 

[timothyr1014]

I think the way Robert put it is simple and accurate...on most diesels (and ours is no exception) there is about a 500 RPM window where you will get both the best milage and the most power....even with a 6-speed you can only find that point 6 times, the more gears, the more oppertunities you have to find that window....not totally critical, but does make hauling alot more comfortable.

 

[Diesel_brad]

And how much extra mass would we be moving with a 10 speed. Those gears are not light.

Gaining 1-2mpg doesn't not seem to benificial when the trans and adapters would cost in the upwards of 5k+

Also. How low would a 10 speed hang. It is at least 36" round. For it to fit a serious body lift would be needed or it would hang 12" below the frame.

I dunno. I dont think anyone one here could convince me that it would be worth while. The cool factor does not cut it for me. But then again no one one here really convinced me to keep my idi either