Knock Knock

[Kalashnikov]

Knock Knock (build thread)

Today is a ****** day. On my way to work on the highway I all of a sudden start loosing power. I switch tanks thinking maybe I got a bad batch of WMO since I had just filled. Strtas getting realy bad so I looked back and there's quite a bit of smoke, check oil pressure gauges and there's NONE. So I got off the highway, it died when I put it in neutral but would start if I tried. Pulled over and there'e oil everywhere and by this point it's knocking decently. Turns out a clamp holding one of the rubber lines on the oil cooler broke so the line popped off. There just happens to be a walmart nearby so I got 3 gallons of oil. Dumped 2 in an it was full. Started it quickly and it sounded pretty bad still. So I got towed home. Afer sitting a few hours I tried again and it started normally but still sounded like there was a slight knock. I'm going to try again tonight when I get home from work. I might try some Lucas that I used once before but I'm not too sure. I have another IDI with 180k miles that I could put in or take a powerstroke out of a 95 I'm getting. I could just keep driving it as is or pull the oil pan but I doubt there is enough room to even do bearings while it's still in? The engine in it has 195k. I just put new injectors and IP back at the end of spring.

 

[icanfixall]

Thats a really bad day staring out for you. I'm not following the line and clamp that caused the oil to dump. Is this a special modification you made to the oil cooler.

 

[Kalashnikov]

The PO did an external oil cooler right behind the vents in the bumper and one of the lines to it popped off.

I also forgot to mention that whatever I put in, IF I swap engines (or even if this needs to be pulled) will not be going back in stock.

Stage 2 if I do the PSD and either a Super Moose or R&D 180cc pump if I do the IDI (with head studs, cam, etc., all that jazz).

 

[NO_SPRK]

sorry for your luck. i would yank it out and check the bottom end. if a diesel is not knocking hard you have a good chance of a cheap(er) fix

 

[hesutton]

There really isn't room to do an "inframe" replacement of the rod and main bearings with these IDI's in a Ford. In an IH medium duty, sure. But, the crossmember under the engine on the Ford's prevents that possibility.

Before I'd start pulling the engine and swapping in another one............ fix the leak, fill'er up with oil. Drive a bit and then check a used oil analysis (Blackstone, CAT, or whoever you like). That should let you know if there is bearing damage without pulling the truck apart.

How's the oil pressure now that she's not leaking all over the place? If it is still terrible, then there may be no hope for the bearings and I'd skip the UOA and start making plans for another engine.

Heath

 

[icanfixall]

Depending if you pull the engine to rebuild or not.. I have a new oem oil pump and not one of those melling pumps. They are expensive and I know its a long ways off if you are rebuilding or not. Wther or not you purchase from me or others please don't attempt to reuse the pump you kave now. They don't like to pump metal at all and thats what may have washed out of the bearings if the knock is as bad as you say. These cranks are fordged and they may not have been damaged. A 10 10 grind with the correct radius will not hurt the strength at all. The wrong radius grind will ruin the crank. Some crank grinders really don't care how they grind the journels and sometimes will push hard burning the material. Then you have a paper weight or boat anchor on your hands. There is a chemical way to determine if the bearing journels have been burned but its a dangerous process I wont talk about here in the open forum...

 

[Kalashnikov]

There really isn't room to do an "inframe" replacement of the rod and main bearings with these IDI's in a Ford. In an IH medium duty, sure. But, the crossmember under the engine on the Ford's prevents that possibility.

Before I'd start pulling the engine and swapping in another one............ fix the leak, fill'er up with oil. Drive a bit and then check a used oil analysis (Blackstone, CAT, or whoever you like). That should let you know if there is bearing damage without pulling the truck apart.

How's the oil pressure now that she's not leaking all over the place? If it is still terrible, then there may be no hope for the bearings and I'd skip the UOA and start making plans for another engine.

Heath

The leak has been fixed and it's been filled with oil. Oil pressure was good. Good idea on an oil sample, didn't even cross my mind.

Depending if you pull the engine to rebuild or not.. I have a new oem oil pump and not one of those melling pumps. They are expensive and I know its a long ways off if you are rebuilding or not. Wther or not you purchase from me or others please don't attempt to reuse the pump you kave now. They don't like to pump metal at all and thats what may have washed out of the bearings if the knock is as bad as you say. These cranks are fordged and they may not have been damaged. A 10 10 grind with the correct radius will not hurt the strength at all. The wrong radius grind will ruin the crank. Some crank grinders really don't care how they grind the journels and sometimes will push hard burning the material. Then you have a paper weight or boat anchor on your hands. There is a chemical way to determine if the bearing journels have been burned but its a dangerous process I wont talk about here in the open forum...

If it was to the point the crank needed to be ground, I would just put another engine in rather than spend more money.

I'm a little dissapointed with the durability. My old I6 you could RUN it on almost no oiland there wasn't any knocking at all. The IDI still had a gallon left although I don't know how far I been been going loosing oil. Wasn't very far into my trip.

 

[The Warden]

Dumb question, but how long did you run her for after refilling the crankcase with oil?

I had something not too dissimilar happen about 11 years ago...the plastic tube feeding my mechanical oil pressure gauge snapped and started pumping oil out of the crankcase. I was on the freeway and started noticing a ticking sound...looked at my oil pressure gauge and it was at 20 psi I got off the freeway and shut the engine down...by this time, that ticking had become a loud knocking noise. I thought I had killed the engine...got the truck towed home the next day, fixed the oil pressure line, filled the crankcase back up, and started the engine. For probably 30 seconds, it sounded awful...but, as the oil circulated and got the lifters filled back up, the unpleasant noises went away and the engine started sounding closer to normal.

That was almost 70K miles ago, and the bottom end of the engine's been fine ever since

If you only ran the engine for a short time, it's something to consider...but, if you ran it for more than 2 or 3 minutes and it was still sounding bad, uh oh...

 

[Black dawg]

These cranks are tuff, the journal surface is very hard. A long time ago, this guy I knew knocked a big hole in the oil pan, lost all of the oil almost immediately. He drove it another mile, wfo, engine screeching the whole way till it finally locked up. I pried the main bearings off of the crankshaft, and polished all the journals. Put it all back together with new bearings, and it lived atleast another 150k that I know about.

 

[icanfixall]

Thats some crank durability right there...

 

[Kalashnikov]

I didn't have time to take her for a spin so it was just a quick start right after I filled it and then when I got it off the flatbed. It could've maybe been 30 seconds, it wasn't very long. That's why I'm hoping it chnages once I go for a quick drive and let it get oilbed back up. But might as well prepare for the worst.

 

[The Warden]

I didn't have time to take her for a spin so it was just a quick start right after I filled it and then when I got it off the flatbed. It could've maybe been 30 seconds, it wasn't very long. That's why I'm hoping it chnages once I go for a quick drive and let it get oilbed back up. But might as well prepare for the worst.

Yep! Prepare for the worst, hope for the best...here's to hoping!

 

[Black dawg]

I'm a little dissapointed with the durability. My old I6 you could RUN it on almost no oiland there wasn't any knocking at all. The IDI still had a gallon left although I don't know how far I been been going loosing oil. Wasn't very far into my trip.

The idi will live with only 4 qts of oil in the pan, it is the fact that when the oil cooler hose came off, there was no oil flow or pressure to the engine.

 

[tanman_2006]

X2 you issue is the lack of flow through the engine. Could have a stuck lifter or something similar in the top end. Once it is running and has been taken for a spin, check for knocking, if the engine still knocks use a mechanics stethoscope to try and pin point if the knock is in the top end or bottom end. The oil sample is a good idea also.

I had a 6.2 w/ bad mains (leaking coolant out the cracks) and a cracked piston. I pulled the oil plug and ran it 5 min and it never quit, there was no load but the point still remains, it takes a lot to kill a diesel.

 

[RLDSL]

When you get things going , get rid of that oil cooler and put one on with AN fittings.. These engines ave too much pressure for a standard worm gear clamp. The only thing that kept it on this long was the hose, once the hose weakened it was a disaster waiting to happen. There are some clamps out there that would hold with the proper high pressure hose, but they dont sell them at parts stores.