starting troubles, but not what you think......

[whiteboyslo]

So, a while back I posted that I thought I needed a new neutral safety switch for the truck. See here: http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?62904-Where-s-the-clutch-switch&highlight=switch

But now I'm thinking that's not the problem. Admittedly, I haven't replaced the switch yet (even though it's sitting on the workbench), but I'm thinking my problem has more to do with the lock and tumbler mechanism, or whatever it is the lock and tumbler plugs into. It's been getting progressively worse, so much so that I just had an episode coming back from lunch where I couldn't get it to try to start. I kept pushing harder and harder on the clutch, but it wasn't helping. So, out of desperation, I CRANKED the key HARD, like two-hands hard. Yep, that did it. Thinking back, whenever it's given me problems, cranking the key harder has been the trick to get it going.

So, what piece needs replaced? Do I need a new lock and tumbler, or the piece that goes into? If so, what's THAT piece called?

Mike

 

[redneckaggie]

I would temp bypass the neutral safety switch by hooking a jumper between the two wires that are the same color and try it to see if that is the problem, if not then you prob need to adjust the ignition switch or replace it, it is mounted on the column down by the firewall. I would try to pull it off and clean the contacts first then put back on adjusted correctly.

 

[TronDD]

I had to tinker with my ignition over the weekend.

The key/tumbler turns a gear that connects to teeth on a rod on the top of the column. The rod has a hook on the other end that moves the ignition switch into the various detents.

Two nuts on the driver's side of the column hold the ignition in place. and the holes are slotted to allow adjustment.

First thing is to take out the two screws under the column close to the dash. Then you can lift up the top piece and you'll see the flat part of the rod. Put the key in and turn it and make sure the rod moves. If not, your problem is likely with the gear or actuator behind the lock. There is a video on youtube showing how to pull the steering wheel and replace the actuator.

If you see it moving, I would put the key in run, loosen the nuts holding the ignition in place and slide it up the column until you feel resistance. Keep your other hand on the key so it doesn't move and you can feel the resistance (you can also work from the other direction and hold the key in accessory and adjust the ignition down until it starts to try to turn the key). There is a spring in there that should keep you out of the start position (might be safe to unhook your batteries if your neutral safety is jumpered or if you don't want to run the glowplugs while mucking around). Tighten the nuts and check the positions of the key. You should feel the spring as you go into start. Make sure you can get into accessory. Try that out. If no good, pulling the switch to look at it is just taking off the nuts, pulling the switch off the studs and unplugging. You can actuate the selector with a screw driver.

When putting the switch back in, make sure you get the hook on the rod into the hole on the ignition and not infront or behind the selector. Also make sure the rod is in the little notch in the metal. Doesn't work so well when you tighten the nuts down and pin the rod to the column. *cough*

Tim.

 

[rhkcommander]

Its easy to test, run a wire from batt pos to ip, then put a switch on starter solenoid and manually glow g lowplugs. Then crank sarter. If it starts and runs, its eother tumbler or wiring to ip. If not then its ip.

 

[Wyreth]

I'm with TronDD on this, sounds like your actuator rod is binding, or you are having a problem with the switch itself.

I would start by pulling the rod assembly apart, cleaning and re-greasing it, then see where you are.

 

[whiteboyslo]

Well, since the parts store is closer to work than home and parts were cheap, I picked up both the ignition cylinder and the switch on the way home. Figured I'd start with the cylinder because the old one was kinda worn anyway. Used to be I could rotate it out of the lock position enough (without the key) that the door chime would go off. That job took 10 minutes, 8 of which was me sticking a screwdriver in the wrong spot on the column to release the old cylinder.

Long story short, looks like it was this cylinder. Just got back from running a bunch of errands and didn't have a single issue. New one feels nice and tight. Guess I didn't realize how much the old one was worn.

If it acts up again, I'll look into adjusting the switch and/or the linkage like you guys suggested.

Thanks!

Mike

 

[icanfixall]

Well that was easier than replacing the switch.. Glad you got it fixed. The ignition switches do wear out too.

 

[whiteboyslo]

I had to tinker with my ignition over the weekend.

The key/tumbler turns a gear that connects to teeth on a rod on the top of the column. The rod has a hook on the other end that moves the ignition switch into the various detents.

Two nuts on the driver's side of the column hold the ignition in place. and the holes are slotted to allow adjustment.

First thing is to take out the two screws under the column close to the dash. Then you can lift up the top piece and you'll see the flat part of the rod. Put the key in and turn it and make sure the rod moves. If not, your problem is likely with the gear or actuator behind the lock. There is a video on youtube showing how to pull the steering wheel and replace the actuator.

If you see it moving, I would put the key in run, loosen the nuts holding the ignition in place and slide it up the column until you feel resistance. Keep your other hand on the key so it doesn't move and you can feel the resistance (you can also work from the other direction and hold the key in accessory and adjust the ignition down until it starts to try to turn the key). There is a spring in there that should keep you out of the start position (might be safe to unhook your batteries if your neutral safety is jumpered or if you don't want to run the glowplugs while mucking around). Tighten the nuts and check the positions of the key. You should feel the spring as you go into start. Make sure you can get into accessory. Try that out. If no good, pulling the switch to look at it is just taking off the nuts, pulling the switch off the studs and unplugging. You can actuate the selector with a screw driver.

When putting the switch back in, make sure you get the hook on the rod into the hole on the ignition and not infront or behind the selector. Also make sure the rod is in the little notch in the metal. Doesn't work so well when you tighten the nuts down and pin the rod to the column. *cough*

Tim.

Dude, you're the man! The new lock and tumbler was only a temp fix. Truck started acting up again yesterday and damn near left me stranded in the grocery store parking lot today. The Ben and Jerry's was just starting to melt when she finally rolled over.

So, brought it home and tore into it. Your instructions fixed it all. All I had to do was move the switch up the column a bit. To add a few more instructions for those who may need to tackle this......

1. The nuts need a 7/16" wrench. If you don't have a ratcheting wrench, you may own a set by the time you get done with this one because those nuts are a pain to get at!

2. To see what you need to get at, you may find it handy to pull the dash bezel where the wipers and lights are. To do this, turn both knobs so that the bottom faces up. You'll see a small slot in them. Insert a small flat screwdriver into the slot, then pull it towards you while pulling the knob off. The bezel itself just pulls off.

Thanks again!

Mike

 

[TronDD]

Cool.

I actually have a set of ratcheting wretches and that's what I used. Good tip, they work well.

Tim.