First Diesel, Where to Begin

[Oelmensch]

Hi All,

Earlier this week I brought home an '89 F350 Crew cab Dually E4OD XLT Lariat with an ATS turbo kit and X89k miles (189k+). I was told by the previous owner that it had been a dairy truck before he bought it; he had only had it a couple months and said he stopped driving it when it 'made noise from the transmission when it was hot'. He said he changed the transmission fluid, I've driven it about 30 miles total and haven't heard any noises from the transmission, but it does have trans-related problem(s). Best I can tell it was parked at some point in 2015 and sat for a good while (spiders, bees nest in the door jam of the driver's door), with signs of receiving decent maintenance before that (new radiator, radiator hose, reman alternator, etc.). Aside from the shifting issues it seemed to start/drive well, but I don't have a good reference for comparison and I didn't push it since I needed to make it home.

Known issues:

• Trans hunts between gears above 48mph or heavy throttle around that speed. No blinking OD light, and it seems to properly engage/disengage OD when I push the button on the dash.
• Tachometer is dead until higher rpms, when it comes to life under heavier throttle (downshift, etc.) is when the trans starts getting hyperactive.
• Needs all major fluids changed (oil, etc.), for piece of mind I am inclined to do the transmission fluid as well since the previous owner didn't flush things or specify what he put in. Fluids levels looked good during pre-purchase checking, but that was just glancing to make sure they were near the level.
• EGT and boost gauges aren't connected. No clue about the turbo condition.
• Drivers rear door won't open/unlock, driver's door doesn't lock.
• Front seats are shredded (junkyard pull fix), interior of cab was clearly a farm truck (needs cleaning, smells like farm).
• Brakes and bearings are relatively unknown; brake booster felt like it sucked the pedal towards the floor when braking.
• Right front tire was a bit low, all tires have a lot of tread, but unknown date of manufacture.

My thoughts are that I want to start with a thorough cleaning and a compression test; maybe see if cleaning the tach sensor (wires look fine, but I'll give them a shake as well) resolves the tach/shifting issue (long shot, but if it saves me $70...). I'll likely inspect the TPS output as well just to be safe. Assuming compression is good then I suppose I start on fluids/filters and more involved inspection/maintenance work (brakes, etc.) that start costing me $.

If the transmission can't be resolved relatively cheaply I'd prefer to convert it to manual anyways; a few listings in the local area for a complete setup to make the swap for a reasonable price.

Thoughts/Advice from those with more experience?

 

[Clb]

First thought when I saw the title was hit the stickies first out.
tranny uses tach for shift reference!

 

[Oelmensch]

Yeah, my title might not have been the best choice.

I've been lurking here for a while, the stickies and tech articles were a big part in my decision to go with an IDI over the other options. I'm hoping the trans shifting is just the tach signal being weird or maybe wiring related, but am prepared to pull the whole setup in favor of a stick if required. In the end that's what I'll do anyways, but if I can have the auto working as intended for a while it'll let me wait until a more comfortable period to do so.

 

[Clb]

Hit in searchbox,,, e4od, shifting issues,trans issues,wont shift.
For starters.
The harness connector can be a prob.
I sold my slushbox.

 

[FORDF250HDXLT]

no need to do anything drastic.the tach needs to be 100%.that will likely solve all issues.the FIPL/TPS should be changed as they are a ware item rated for 50k miles.so a new to you e4 truck should get one.every 50k and after every reman.
so start with both of these sensors and should be good.no need to downgrade to a manual stick if it's not necessary.;p
shoot,i don't even see a need to get grease under your nails for this easy fix.

 

[Oelmensch]

Initial progress

I ponied up the cash and got the bigger/more-expensive Harbor Freight compression tester kit, not the affordable one that various sources say doesn't work with the IDI. Looking at the clearances (with the injector lines in place) and the tester it's looking like I am going to need to pull the injector lines to test this though. IF I have to pull the lines I feel like I should build or find a pop-tester and go through the injectors while I have everything apart this far, which I see spiraling into doing the entire fuel system... While I do want to get it done in the next year, I'd rather not put a grand into an injection pump and good injectors at this time; I'm hoping to get away with just adjusting the pump timing for the short term.

I got half the glow plugs out (driver's side) last night and was happy to see they weren't Autolites, Champions so far and they all look about the same; I'll be putting Motorcraft back in since I've seen numerous posts at this point suggesting that is the best option for these engines if you intend to keep driving them and don't like pulling cylinder heads. I know a warm engine is the ideal/proper way to run a compression test, but with a 3-year old and narrow windows to get anything done, I accepted this would be a multi-day process from the get go and thus a cold engine when I finally get to run the compression test (hopefully by Thursday). Whoever said to use a crevice connection with the shop-vac before starting this process, huge thanks! Would have been a major pain after the fact.

Unfortunately/unsurprisingly I have to remove the turbo to access the rear-most passenger side, which isn't so bad since I wanted to inspect the turbo more thoroughly. Judging by the pics I'm seeing online it looks to be an 088 (ATS) unit, which I understand to be something of a nuisance to install/remove, but nothing I can't handle. Spinning it by hand everything rotates as smoothly as you'd expect, but since I don't have any history on it I want to give it a more thorough once-over to feel comfortable. I know the 088 isn't the most popular kit anymore, but I'd rather have that than no turbo at all, so barring it being 'tatered I'm planning on putting it back when the testing is done.
Boost gauge tubing was disconnected at the brass fittings on the back and the EGT wiring looked like someone had butchered it previously and failed to Frankenstein it back together afterwards (exposed wiring, not connected) which explains why neither gauge does anything while running. Assuming everything tests well and goes back together without issue, I'm looking forward to seeing those work for more insight into the health/performance of the engine.

I tested the tach sensor while I was under the hood. I seem to recall a thread here or elsewhere saying it should test at 3-4k ohms across the terminals, not the open circuit results I'm getting, so no surprise that it's bad given the tach's behavior. Now I have to decide between $70 for the ford part or $20 for the DIY Chevy Cavalier version. My gut says spend the money and get the part intended for the application.

Finally, I came across two electrical harness connections on the driver's side near the upper radiator hose outlet that appeared to have been disconnected that I need to ask about. One is a 2-wire connection that seemed to have a 2-prong connector coming out of the top of the block, searching online suggests it might be some sort of sensor for a cold-idle/temp indicator? The other is a 90-degree boot 1-wire terminal that I can't find a home for. I'm attaching pics for reference in case anyone knows what I'm seeing there.

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[79jasper]

Single wire one should go to the fuel filter somewhere.
The two wire one is the cold timing advance and high idle.

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[icanfixall]

In the first pic that sender controls the fast idle and cold advance. When the coolant reaches 120 degrees it will open and stop power to the fast idle and the cold advance. The second pic is the wire to the fuel filter dash light. The sender is found on the fuel filter head outlet area. The sender looks very much like an oil pressure sender.

 

[79jasper]

Gary I'm thinking that one is the WIF. Looks a little small for the FRS.

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[Oelmensch]

More progress

Got the passenger side's glow plugs out, 4 more champions, intact and as even looking as the driver's side.

Cold (sitting parked a couple days now, temps have been 40-60 deg F the last couple days/nights) compression test on 5 of the 8 cylinders, gonna have to pull the injector lines to get at a couple of the remaining ones with the tester I have.

#1 385
#2 395
#3 under injector lines, adapter currently installed
#4 under injector lines
#5 315
#6 430
#7 removed turbo heat shield, possible tester access, but it looks evil...
#8 420

Obviously #5 is concerning both for tested result and relative to the rest (73.3% of #6), so a rebuild may be in the works in the future. I know the test spec calls for a warm engine, but it simply isn't an option with my schedule. For those who have done both warm and cold tests for comparison, how well do the cold numbers relate? Either way, I have 3 left to do, but cannot work on it again until Thursday evening at the earliest. Barring problematic readings on the remaining 3 cylinders, I'm gonna likely leave the engine together until after the round trip to Reno I need to make in late July (hauling furniture and shop equipment back up from my parents' storage unit) so I can amass parts and funds to do it right. Ideally I'll grab another engine on craigslist to rebuild to minimize the downtime when it is a possibility.

If I have to remove the injector lines to attach the tester to the adapter (which is absolutely the case with #3), can I get away with loosening the pump side of the line and unhooking the injector side to pivot them out of the way? If the tester were just 1/4-1/2" shorter I'm certain this wouldn't be necessary on #3, but #4 looks to be as bad or worse anyways. I'd consider just pulling the pump assembly with all the injector lines attached, but I don't have a means of timing the setup afterwards (assuming that needs to be done, I'm still pretty green when it comes to these). As it is I tried removing the grouping clamps holding the odd numbered lines together to see if I got any freedom of movement to connect the tester, but I'd be bending the lines more than I am comfortable with to make that happen. Removing the lines isn't that big of a deal since the next step in the process is to test the injectors themselves while I'm this far into things.

With regard to the wiring I posted earlier, the 90-deg round terminal appears to go to the round terminal on the bottom of the fuel filter, which definitely feels a lot like an old oil pressure sensor terminal. Guessing that is the WIF 79Jasper and icanfixall referenced previously. The cold idle being disconnected explains why it never seemed like the idle changed speed after warming up.

 

[riotwarrior]

Got the passenger side's glow plugs out, 4 more champions, intact and as even looking as the driver's side.

Cold (sitting parked a couple days now, temps have been 40-60 deg F the last couple days/nights) compression test on 5 of the 8 cylinders, gonna have to pull the injector lines to get at a couple of the remaining ones with the tester I have.

#1 385
#2 395
#3 under injector lines, adapter currently installed
#4 under injector lines
#5 315
#6 430
#7 removed turbo heat shield, possible tester access, but it looks evil...
#8 420

Obviously #5 is concerning both for tested result and relative to the rest (73.3% of #6), so a rebuild may be in the works in the future. I know the test spec calls for a warm engine, but it simply isn't an option with my schedule. For those who have done both warm and cold tests for comparison, how well do the cold numbers relate? Either way, I have 3 left to do, but cannot work on it again until Thursday evening at the earliest. Barring problematic readings on the remaining 3 cylinders, I'm gonna likely leave the engine together until after the round trip to Reno I need to make in late July (hauling furniture and shop equipment back up from my parents' storage unit) so I can amass parts and funds to do it right. Ideally I'll grab another engine on craigslist to rebuild to minimize the downtime when it is a possibility.

If I have to remove the injector lines to attach the tester to the adapter (which is absolutely the case with #3), can I get away with loosening the pump side of the line and unhooking the injector side to pivot them out of the way? If the tester were just 1/4-1/2" shorter I'm certain this wouldn't be necessary on #3, but #4 looks to be as bad or worse anyways. I'd consider just pulling the pump assembly with all the injector lines attached, but I don't have a means of timing the setup afterwards (assuming that needs to be done, I'm still pretty green when it comes to these). As it is I tried removing the grouping clamps holding the odd numbered lines together to see if I got any freedom of movement to connect the tester, but I'd be bending the lines more than I am comfortable with to make that happen. Removing the lines isn't that big of a deal since the next step in the process is to test the injectors themselves while I'm this far into things.

With regard to the wiring I posted earlier, the 90-deg round terminal appears to go to the round terminal on the bottom of the fuel filter, which definitely feels a lot like an old oil pressure sensor terminal. Guessing that is the WIF 79Jasper and icanfixall referenced previously. The cold idle being disconnected explains why it never seemed like the idle changed speed after warming up.

Did I read.....EXCUSES.....I think so...

No seriously so far quite good...and look forward to more...injector line clamps removed temporarily helps make thins tad easier to swallow....or more $$$ comp kit that fits....

Keep 411 comin

Thanks for sharing

 

[Oelmensch]

Compression tests are done

Well tonight's plans changed and I was able to finish up the remaining tests, the final (cold test) numbers are:

#1 385
#2 395
#3 460
#4 425
#5 315
#6 430
#7 340
#8 420

For cold-test numbers I'm pretty happy for the most part.

I was able to get by unhooking the injector lines at the injectors, but leaving them attached at the pump. #7 was a very snug fit to connect the tester to the adapter, I had a moment of panic when it didn't want to come out from under the turbo housing, but it rotated and wiggled back out. I had to operate the key by myself (and didn't setup a remote start circuit), so I didn't have any reference about initial crank gains during the testing, but I understand that to be more useful on a warm engine anyways.

While #3 puts #5 well outside of the 75% range, I'd prefer to put my head in the sand on this one and ignore it for the short term; I can save up the cash to craigslist a spare motor to rebuild over the winter and drop it into the truck in the spring. Aside from the 1200 mile round trip to Reno this July, I don't have any significant demand for the truck, so this should work out well enough and the Reno trip is just highway with about ~1000-1500lbs in the bed on the way back.


Unless anyone can see reason in those numbers to be overly concerned I figured I'll order up the motorcraft (ZD9) glow plugs, a motorcraft FL1995 oil filter in case my truck is one willing to let it fit, find an air filter that fits the 088 housing on the forums to order and get the routine maintenance to a solid baseline before I put some miles on it and identify the next items to address. I found the tach sensor online (new on ebay, looks like a dealership account) so I'll nab that too, but I'd like to find one with relatively quick shipping since I don't want to wait too long to get to testing.
I've got plenty of reading on oil preferences ahead of me to figure out what I'll be pouring into this thing. I know that can be a potentially hot topic between owners, I'm sure there is plenty of discussion on the boards.

Next up after fluids and filters is IP timing. I cleaned the base of the pump and housing to see the timing marks are lined up dead center and I've got no way of knowing when that was last set. I've read these lose some timing as things wear, so I suppose the responsible thing to do is either buy a ferret timing adapter or take it to a shop. I'm more inclined to track down an adapter to rent or buy; if there are any members in the Portland (OR) area willing to rent one out or that I can pay for their services, please let me know. If not, I'll likely wait until the fun-budget allows and order one in a couple weeks.

 

[79jasper]

Look in the timing meter registry. (It's a thread here)
Otherwise icanfixall rents them.

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[riotwarrior]

A leakdown test would give u there where for whats wrong....thos #"s are decent.

Grab zd 9s gitterdun.

Oil...pick yer poison.

Test your tach with a multimeter shoukd be low AC current that shows steady rise as throttle is increased.

Pull the small wire on fender relar for starter and jump it to the main power feed into relay...this bumps engine over.....

JM7.3CW

 

[Oelmensch]

New (Motorcraft ZD9) glow plugs are installed and torqued, wiring connectors reattached.

Fuel filter removed, drained, new unit assembled and filled. I noticed the old diesel was red in color, new stuff (bought a gallon) was definitely not. I got the truck from a farm so am I seeing non-road diesel or an additive?

Air filter is waiting for a couple minor pieces to go back in; cleaning up the cabling/fuel return lines to make sure everything is clear from problem areas before I put that thing back in place.

I've decided to pour dino into the engine when I change the oil; it's likely not had synthetic before now and I'll go full synthetic when I rebuild the engine. I'm gonna hold off on the transmission fluid change until I see if the new tach sensor resolves the hunting issue and if not then I'll start saving for the manual conversion. Good times.