3 days to go and she is dead!

[pafixitman]

2 days to go and she is alive!

Went to get sand this morning and the truck would not start. Does not even try to turn over. Check the batts and I have 12.35 V on each. Cables are good, connections are clean and tight. Ran the Haynes test on the starter relay (black thing on pass fender) and it failed. Just go one from Ford and I have the same thing. The GP relay just clicks rapidly. I have lights etc, but my volt gauge pegs zero when I turn the key. No WTS, nothing. My nerves are shot and I am at my wits end worrying about this upcoming 3 week trip. I do not need this. I'm going back out and pulling the intake to look at the GP controller. Any help and direction is appreciated!

 

[pafixitman]

I used the Haynes test procedures and I fail the iginition test. Using the terminal @ the one o'clock position and ground, iginition in run, I get .34 volts. I'll start tracing fusible links.

Would this keep the truck from even trying to start?

 

[tonkadoctor]

Check the batts and I have 12.35 V on each I have lights etc, but my volt gauge pegs zero when I turn the key. No WTS, nothing.

1. Batteries can have voltage but amperage is more important I'd check to see if the batteries pass a load test first before tearing into everything first.
2. May also be a bad ignition switch.
3. Bad fusable link
4. bad fuse
5. bad nuetral start switch etc......

Start with the simple stuff first before tearing into stuff

 

[tuckerd1]

Joe, that's a real bummer! The glow plug solenoid also supplies the start power during start to the starter solenoid doesn't it? Maybe the solenoid is bad. Jump from batt to starter side of solenoid and see if it trys to start.

 

[pafixitman]

With the ignition on, I get the .34 at the ignition term of the gpc. If I remove the wire and test, I get 12.5 volts on the wire. I'm thinking my gpc is bad. Does this make sense?

 

[tonkadoctor]

There should be at least 8 volts at the ignition terminal of the GPC with the ignition on and all accessories off.

The Haynes manual (#10330)troubleshooting guide (pg3-36) I have says to "check the fusable link, recharge the battery or repair the wiring"

 

[pafixitman]

Yeah, I saw that also. What has me stumped though is while tracing down a faulty fusable link, I ended up removing the wire from the gpc. With the wire unattached, ignition in run, I get 12 and change on the end of the wire. As soon as I attach it to the gpc, I get the real low reading. The ground test passes and I have 12 and change from the battery on the other terminal. I also have continuity (if that is the correct term) on the wire from the starter relay, thru the fusable link to the terminal end at the gpc so... I think the link, wire and batteries are ok.

Being a bit proactive, I called my dealer and he will have one for me Monday @ 11 am. This is coming out of the vacation budget so any ideas to save me some coin...

Is there any way to bypass the controller to see if that is the problem? (With out burning down the truck etc)

BTW Tonka, what is your handle on WFM? I have a 1970 Model 70 and hopefully before the summer is over a 111.

 

[tonkadoctor]

I don't know how to bypass the controller, fortunatly I havn't had the displeasure of messing with that stuff. Hopefully somebody else will chime in here. Have you tried jumping the starter solenoid to see if it would at least crank to make sure you don't have a bad starter. Unfortunatly there's not much more I can do for you on this.

I don't even know if I ever registered on WFM. I don't visit the site much other than to look up model information and lurk a little. I just finished completely ripping apart the 420 model last night every last nut and bolt. This is the one I picked up on monday. I unloaded it tuesday and star ted dismantling it on wednessday. Needless to say that the air wrenches have been singing the last couple days.


Been busy photographing parts and writing ads to list on ebay tonight....Hope to make about $2k+ off of these parts this week.

CHA CHING $$$$$$ It's my favorite word....It's a jewish word that sounds chineese

 

[pafixitman]

Yeah, I tried jumping to see if it was the starter. Right now I'm about 85% sure it's the gpc. (That and a quarter won't get you squat though!)


I just figured you would be a regular on WFM. Sounds like you are part of a JD Mafia. We have a couple in the IDI Mafia in these parts. They dismantle trucks in no time!

 

[suv7734]

How old are the batteries? As mentioned the load test on the batteries will tell you a bunch. The batteries showing 12V tells you nothing until you put a load on them. Since the glow plug circuit puts a large load on them that may be why you are only seeing the .34V at the GPC when the key is on. Might also be worth checking to see if you are seeing the .34V at the batteries with the key on.

 

[pafixitman]

Batteries are about 4 months old. Both are Sears Diehard "SUV" batteries. I guees it would be worth the time to pull them and have Sears load test 'em. IIRC, I did check the pass side battery with the ignition on. I want to say it was high 10's. I can double check that tomorrow. I'm guessing if the battery reading is "normal" under load then that would rule them out, or at least place them lower on the list!

 

[suv7734]

How long was the truck sitting before you tried to start it again? Might be worthwhile to see what happens if you hook a battery charger to it for a few hours since you don't have a load tester. The load test would take them out of the list of potential problems. The other thing to consider is one may be a 'bad' one. If one was defective from the factory it will draw the other one down and if they sat for a while...

 

[tonkadoctor]

Yep get those batteries load tested. Not uncommon for 1 to go bad and kill the second.

Sounds like you are part of a JD Mafia.

That's funny. Never been called that before but I have sent 7 of them to their graves in the last few months. :draw

• 1 - 216
• 1 - 314
• 2 - 316 with Onan engines ( one was a good running complete tractor)
• 1 - 420 in progress of getting rid of the evidence
• 2 - 430 models with diesel engines (both were good complete running machines)

Alot of people are parting JD garden tractors on ebay but I'm one of the few that part the big 430 models. It guess it gets a little too scary or risky for most to spend $3k on a good running 430 diesel to part it. Good money in it if you can stomach the risk. I'll probably get another 430 in here hopefully by August.

 

[pafixitman]

Ran 100 miles in her on Wednesday and no problems or indication of a problem. Had the charger on it for a couple hrs. this morning. Dead batteries was my initial thought, so I threw it on with out even checking voltage etc. I also tried jump starting her. I'll pull 'em in the morning and have them load tested after church. Gotta thank the Lord this did not happen Tuesday or later!

I have had a cold start issue and the gp's passed the light test. I was going to see how she acted this weekend and debate replacing all of the gp's for s&g.

 

[TLBREWER]

Yeah, I tried jumping to see if it was the starter. Right now I'm about 85% sure it's the gpc. (That and a quarter won't get you squat though!)


I just figured you would be a regular on WFM. Sounds like you are part of a JD Mafia. We have a couple in the IDI Mafia in these parts. They dismantle trucks in no time!

Joe sorry to hear about your last minute problems. That sucks! Unfortuantely I have nothing to add that hasn't already been said.

However, I do have a non-related question. What's WFM? I have a passive interest in old JD and Cub Cadet tractors and like to read about and research them. Possibly a future winter project.

Tom