Two questions that may be related

[ConstantVigilance]

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[ConstantVigilance]

Eh... it doesn't sound as advanced to me as it does to you. It sounds... normal, except for the knock. Like one injector is firing early, or maby it's firing late and the next is trying to pick it up. That blue smoke isn't advanced timing, that's for sure.

I still think you'll find something off when you take the motor apart.

Do I need to take off that round thing? Lol

But really, I've never done this before. Wondering if there is something I should look out for. Or is it pretty straight forword. It seems like I can leave the balancer on it.

Thanks.

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[no mufflers]

nope, has to come off.

 

[ConstantVigilance]

nope, has to come off.

Lima Charlie

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[riotwarrior]

Oh indeed it does...such a shame to tear into it without first checking timing w a meter....gonna suck big if its all ligned up eh?

Just sayin

 

[Macrobb]

Eh... Something has to be wrong here for it to do that. I've run engines pretty wrong on timing both ways and never seen anything like that.
I'm of the opinon that if you /don't/ find anything wrong here, it's probably time to pull a head.
Yes, that's a pain, but... one good part - you'll get to see any damage from all those glow plug ends. You can also see the lifter valley on both sides with one head off, and look for anything obviously wrong.

 

[ConstantVigilance]

Eh... Something has to be wrong here for it to do that. I've run engines pretty wrong on timing both ways and never seen anything like that.
I'm of the opinon that if you /don't/ find anything wrong here, it's probably time to pull a head.
Yes, that's a pain, but... one good part - you'll get to see any damage from all those glow plug ends. You can also see the lifter valley on both sides with one head off, and look for anything obviously wrong.

Looks like this checks out.
But I think we both expected the timing to be right. So I'm going to pull ahead tomorrow.

I have my old 7.3 sitting on the floor, so I started to pull the head on that one just to have a little practice first. I know it'll be more complicated in the truck.

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[no mufflers]

the crank and cam are in time but was the IP gear?

 

[ConstantVigilance]

the crank and cam are in time but was the IP gear?

Funny story: when I first got this motor I had to swap out the injection pump gear housing. The 6.9 gear housing had the filler spout where my crank breather tube connected to for my Turbo setup.

I was having a hard time finding top dead center mark on the cam gear, but using a mirror I saw a white mark, made with something like a paint pen.

I used that as my top dead center, assuming that they did that to find the mark easier once the engine was assembled.

The motor ran just fine other than the symptoms that it's showing now.

Also, originally, I installed my moose pump and my injectors from the 7.3 onto this 6.9. But after all those problems I swapped the original injection pump and injectors back on to this engine to see if that was the problem.

And since I had a very small oil leak coming from the IP gear housing, I figured I would just take the gear housing off and reseal it. But this time I couldn't find that white Mark when I had the engine to top dead center. I just assumed that it was bad lighting or something because using a small pic I found a little indention on the gear. So I marked the two teeth directly above that indention.

The funny story is that when I took the front cover off I found both the white paint mark that I originally used as top dead center, but also, 180 degrees opposite of it, are the white marks I put on the gear teeth.

Now, the idea that I ran this motor for a couple hundred miles with the cam gear 180° off seems pretty unlikely. But, when I pull that front cover off, seeing both those paint marks, I literally stared at that engine for about 20 minutes.

In short, the injection pump and cam gear or lined up. They were at least lined up as best as I could manage. I feel confident that I had it correct the second time around.

I really don't want to pull one of these heads seeing now how much work is involved. And while there are mixed opinions about timing, I'm going to assume something else is causing these glow plugs to burn up or break or do whatever it is they're doing.


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[no mufflers]

that is generally why its best to leave the gear housing in place.

 

[oregon96psd]

For what your going to spend on parts to put that thing back together, you could have bought a new timing meter to check it lol.

https://www.tinytach.com/timing-equipment

FWIW I smoked a set of glow plugs in my 84 in about 30 miles from having it to far advanced, after I timed it the problem went away.

 

[ConstantVigilance]

For what your going to spend on parts to put that thing back together, you could have bought a new timing meter to check it lol.

https://www.tinytach.com/timing-equipment

FWIW I smoked a set of glow plugs in my 84 in about 30 miles from having it to far advanced, after I timed it the problem went away.

This looks like the same one. I think would still need a light

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[oregon96psd]

You don't need the light. It has a line adapter that reads the pulse when it injects fuel and reads the timing from that.

 

[Macrobb]

And it compares to a sensor plugged into the crank damper flange piece

 

[riotwarrior]

Funny story: when I first got this motor I had to swap out the injection pump gear housing. The 6.9 gear housing had the filler spout where my crank breather tube connected to for my Turbo setup.

I was having a hard time finding top dead center mark on the cam gear, but using a mirror I saw a white mark, made with something like a paint pen.

I used that as my top dead center, assuming that they did that to find the mark easier once the engine was assembled.

The motor ran just fine other than the symptoms that it's showing now.

Also, originally, I installed my moose pump and my injectors from the 7.3 onto this 6.9. But after all those problems I swapped the original injection pump and injectors back on to this engine to see if that was the problem.

And since I had a very small oil leak coming from the IP gear housing, I figured I would just take the gear housing off and reseal it. But this time I couldn't find that white Mark when I had the engine to top dead center. I just assumed that it was bad lighting or something because using a small pic I found a little indention on the gear. So I marked the two teeth directly above that indention.

The funny story is that when I took the front cover off I found both the white paint mark that I originally used as top dead center, but also, 180 degrees opposite of it, are the white marks I put on the gear teeth.

Now, the idea that I ran this motor for a couple hundred miles with the cam gear 180° off seems pretty unlikely. But, when I pull that front cover off, seeing both those paint marks, I literally stared at that engine for about 20 minutes.

In short, the injection pump and cam gear or lined up. They were at least lined up as best as I could manage. I feel confident that I had it correct the second time around.

I really don't want to pull one of these heads seeing now how much work is involved. And while there are mixed opinions about timing, I'm going to assume something else is causing these glow plugs to burn up or break or do whatever it is they're doing.


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So in all likely hood and with no way to say for 100% certain.....by removing ip gear cover and teying to line up the marks u could possibly have been out a tooth one way or the other...

This is the very reason we say never remove ip gear cover.

Well now is time to line it up seal it up amd hope for best after heads come off.

Good luck.