What's hurting you is being a crewcab. Your truck is heavy before it's even being loaded.
Just how important is GVWR in these old trucks..?
- Thread starter AcIdBuRn02ZTS
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What's hurting you is being a crewcab. Your truck is heavy before it's even being loaded.
I can't agree with him more.Time to sell the F350 imo.Say your goodbyes and tell her you love her.It's time to move on.Life changes and so have your needs in a truck.
It's time for an F-Super Duty! AKA F-450!
It's the correct and real foundation you now require!
The F-Super Duty 1987-97 (the original super duty prior to '99 pickups) was Fords introduction of the class 4 medium duty truck. It was a commercial cab & chassis 2WD dually only optioned truck.They came with 460 gas engines all through the production run, with the optional 7.3l idi diesel engine from introduction through '94,then the optional 7.3l di (power stroke) diesel from '94.5 - '97.
Known at the time as the "One Ton Plus." It sports a HD frame,the hydroboost brake system w/ 4 wheel disc brakes.Though they are 2WD trucks,they are equipped with 4WD transmissions but,rather than a transfer case,they come with a drive line parking brake. A HD dana 80 rear axle that came from ford with gear ratio options intended for two purposes; heavy hauling & towing.They came in various wheelbase lengths with up to a 15,000 LB GVWR.It's widely known as the F-450 equivalent with many auto stores listing parts under either name.
These trucks are easy to spot with their pickup size cabs,yet unique F-Super Duty fender emblems & 10 lug wheels.
axle code 72 = 4.63
axle code 73 = 5.13 (most common and what log truck has)
axle code G3 = 4.30LS (rare)
That's what you need.Then you can build your camper and haul her around safe,sound and what's most important when your trying to get away?
Relaxation! You don't want concerns that you don't have enough truck.You want to be worry free knowing you have more than enough.
You get your 4 wheel disc brakes.
You get your hydroboost brakes.
You get your DRW to take the load with ease.
You get your payload worry free with some to spare.
You get to stay with an IDI you have come to love.
You get the low gears your after.
It's F450 time baby!
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But.......be on the hunt for the " unicorn ".
The above F450 but with the Marmon-Herrington 4wd conversion and in crewcab form.
They do exist. fire depts were the only ones who could afford these monsters.
good luck
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
You can get a cab and chassis f350. They are 11k gvwr. If I had a big camper on their id definitely want the stability of the dual rear wheels. My 93 idi turbo crew cab 2wd with a service body weighed 8700lb that same bed on my cab and chassis psd single cab 4wd dually is 9200lb.
Yeah I never really understood how these things are rated. My F350 is rated 10k but weighs 7k. Thats no big deal, that's a 3k payload capacity.
But I've seen some like my old Chevy. Rated at 6600 but weighs like 5800. Get my fat self in it and you can "legally" haul a whopping 500#. I can do that in a ranger, it just never made sense to me.
But I've seen some like my old Chevy. Rated at 6600 but weighs like 5800. Get my fat self in it and you can "legally" haul a whopping 500#. I can do that in a ranger, it just never made sense to me.
AcIdBuRn02ZTS
Full Access Member
Stepping up to a 450 is kinda out of the question at this point.
The owner of Idacamper runs his on an OBS 250.
http://www.idacamper.com/
His first build is pretty similar to what I'm planning... but mine is going to be a hardside popup. His scales at 2200 dry and from talking to him on pirate4x4 and expedition portal, he doesn't seem to have any issues from the dozens of trips he's made in it thus far.
I'm going to TRY to get dry weight under 2k which would keep me in the GVWR... but otherwise, it doesn't sound like I've got much to worry about.
The owner of Idacamper runs his on an OBS 250.
http://www.idacamper.com/
His first build is pretty similar to what I'm planning... but mine is going to be a hardside popup. His scales at 2200 dry and from talking to him on pirate4x4 and expedition portal, he doesn't seem to have any issues from the dozens of trips he's made in it thus far.
I'm going to TRY to get dry weight under 2k which would keep me in the GVWR... but otherwise, it doesn't sound like I've got much to worry about.
I can't agree with him more.
But.......be on the hunt for the " unicorn ".
The above F450 but with the Marmon-Herrington 4wd conversion and in crewcab form.
They do exist. fire depts were the only ones who could afford these monsters.
good luck
There's a Quigley 4x4 conversion,crew cab,PSD, on ebay right now.
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/1997-Ford-F-450-QUIGLEY-/322425519126
Like a brand spanking new '97.A feller could sell off a lot of that firetruck stuff while converting it over to his personal needs.What a truck that would make!
Down in the description,it states; Make offer.Must sell.
I bet 18k buys this truck!......or like you say; unicorn for sure.
Few additional notes;
Late '97 was the very best of the best for the E4OD trans.
'97 is the only year I've seen f450 sport axle code indicating 4:30 LS gears.This one doesn't show the regular door jam sticker to know.Edit; oh well,with the 4wd conversion I suppose that's anyone's guess now.One would need to call Quigley with the vin maybe to know it's gearing now or pull a diff cover.
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burt
Full Access Member
Picking springs that are right for camper on and off will be tough. If you are on the overloads it will ride like crap off road. I can't ever keep air bags from failing in off road rigs. I haven't tried long travel ones tho just a variety of ways to leave them loose on the spring but stay in place enough. Off road with that kinda weight I'd want the right spring rate
Why not both? tis a slippery slope you are on...
FordGuy100
Registered User
Legality wise its no bueno.
In reality its fine. It will cause more stress on components but it should be fine as long as you keep up with maintenance. Make sure the braking system is up to par. Helper springs or airbags will help a lot with leveling it back out once the load was on.
For reference, my parents OBS PSD CC 4x4 use to haul a 10' Camper, Class V hitch with a 60" stinger to haul a 21' boat. It did burn through a E4OD after awhile, but it also had 150k miles on it (we all know stock E4OD's aren't anything to brag about).
On a side note, I met a farmer the other day with a stock OBS PSD CC 4x4, 108K miles on it. It was in pristine condition but he used it only to haul heavy loads. He was on his 5th E4OD. I gave him the contact for a shop that will build him a tranny instead of putting stock rebuilds in. He was happy about that.
In reality its fine. It will cause more stress on components but it should be fine as long as you keep up with maintenance. Make sure the braking system is up to par. Helper springs or airbags will help a lot with leveling it back out once the load was on.
For reference, my parents OBS PSD CC 4x4 use to haul a 10' Camper, Class V hitch with a 60" stinger to haul a 21' boat. It did burn through a E4OD after awhile, but it also had 150k miles on it (we all know stock E4OD's aren't anything to brag about).
On a side note, I met a farmer the other day with a stock OBS PSD CC 4x4, 108K miles on it. It was in pristine condition but he used it only to haul heavy loads. He was on his 5th E4OD. I gave him the contact for a shop that will build him a tranny instead of putting stock rebuilds in. He was happy about that.
AcIdBuRn02ZTS
Full Access Member
Like I said before, I'm going to shoot for keeping weight under gvwr... I just don't think it'll happen.
As far as why I'm not worried about legality as much as longevity... for lack of better words, i don't drive like an ****** and draw unwanted attention to myself... and if something does happen.. such as an accident... I've never personally seen them bring out portable scales for a non commercial vehicle to see if I'm 200# over gvwr.
Then I see guys on here talking about grossing 25k+ with their trailer and never having an issue with law enforcement although they are wwaayy over the legal limit for the truck.
Anyways.. I'm pretty certain at this point that the truck will be fine. I'll still be shooting for 2k or under dry. That will keep me in the limits or darn close to them.
I'm building the truck accordingly. Regearing it to a point where it will drive like its on stock rubber with 4.10s.. quality clutch.. everything rebuilt and good brakes.
As far as why I'm not worried about legality as much as longevity... for lack of better words, i don't drive like an ****** and draw unwanted attention to myself... and if something does happen.. such as an accident... I've never personally seen them bring out portable scales for a non commercial vehicle to see if I'm 200# over gvwr.
Then I see guys on here talking about grossing 25k+ with their trailer and never having an issue with law enforcement although they are wwaayy over the legal limit for the truck.
Anyways.. I'm pretty certain at this point that the truck will be fine. I'll still be shooting for 2k or under dry. That will keep me in the limits or darn close to them.
I'm building the truck accordingly. Regearing it to a point where it will drive like its on stock rubber with 4.10s.. quality clutch.. everything rebuilt and good brakes.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
A trailer weight has nothing to do with the gvwr of the truck so long as your trailer tongue weight (2,000lb for. 20,000lb trailer or so) doesn't exceed your hitches rating or add enough weight for your trucks axle to weigh greater than your trucks gvwr. The gvwr is about stopping power not moving power. A 20k trailer will have its own braking system. So you can legally gross 25k+ so long as you're not adding more than a couple thousand lbs to your chassis. You can't legally add 3klb to a truck that's only allowed to hold 2klb. They will weigh axles individually. That's why there are weight ratings for each on the door tag.
AcIdBuRn02ZTS
Full Access Member
Correct... but trucks do have a GCWR meaning total maximum weight of truck and trailer combined weight.
Grossing 25k is well over the published maximum GCWR... so why would it be that GCWR doesnt matter... but GVWR does?
Such as... 7.3 w/ auto and 4.10s is rated for 17k GCWR.
With manual trans.. it drops to 14k. These are frame hitch ratings.
Those are published ratings... meaning technically.. my 7200lb 1 ton truck can't legally pull a loaded car trailer (rated at 7k) because it would gross over 14k.
Grossing 25k is well over the published maximum GCWR... so why would it be that GCWR doesnt matter... but GVWR does?
Such as... 7.3 w/ auto and 4.10s is rated for 17k GCWR.
With manual trans.. it drops to 14k. These are frame hitch ratings.
Those are published ratings... meaning technically.. my 7200lb 1 ton truck can't legally pull a loaded car trailer (rated at 7k) because it would gross over 14k.
Shawn MacAnanny
Full Access Member
As far as I know the obs trucks do not have a gcwr listed on the door tag.
They are cracking down on that stuff where I live (Virginia) but if it looks like a camper they won't bother you. Make it look good(commercially bought camper) and even if you are in a accident they won't bother you. Rver's and u-haul rental people can pretty much do what they want(farmers also).
AcIdBuRn02ZTS
Full Access Member
Not on the door tag.. but it is in the manual. Hell... if that's all they are worried about, I'll scratch off my door tag and throw some 450 badges on it... or just find a 450 or super door in the junkyard with the sticker still on it.
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