IDI OIL PRESSURE TO START

[BeastMaster]

Oh, incidentally, where are some good places to plumb something like this in for a startup oil pump?

Wonder if I can use some sort of banjo fitting on the oil pan drain so I can also get this thing to neatly put my old oil back into the 2.5 gallon jugs my Chevron Deli comes in?

 

[79jasper]

I would put a bung in the side of the pan.

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[Macrobb]

Honestly, don't worry about it. 15W40 oil, change it every 3K or so(very dirty engine), and the engine's not going to wear out the bearings any time soon.
I'm not convinced at all about "dry starts" ever since I took apart an engine that threw a rod... 18 months later. I found the rod bearings(and everything else inside) still had a nice film of oil on them, and there was no metal to metal contact or anything else. Oil stays adhered in a thin layer for a *very* long time. And it's that film strength that protects the metal parts when moving.

 

[PROFG]

Was not sure on oil used but found partial jug, 15-40 Rotella T so will change to 10-30 tomorrow and retry. And I have a different place to put the oil in (and take it from). Will check out the Alliexpress pump, thanks for link. Not sure, Macrobb, what you mean. Threw rod after dry start or making noise for 18mos? Going to closest available IDI F350 tomorrow (65 miles) to get headlights, and maybe IP, injectors, and ?? Next closest NJ

 

[Macrobb]

Was not sure on oil used but found partial jug, 15-40 Rotella T so will change to 10-30 today and retry. G

I'm still going to disagree with using thinner oil. These motors were designed for 30W straight oil, OR 15W40 when at lower temps. Thinner oils have a reduced film strength as well.
(oh, and based on research I've seen, the best 5w40 synthetic has less film strength(by a little) than the worst 15W40 oil. Not sure how much it matters, but still...

 

[PROFG]

Oh, I get it, must be sleepy. You tore it down 18 months after it threw the rod and it sat idle for 18 months. Says more about the oil than IDI construction but good anyway.

 

[Macrobb]

Oh, I get it, must be sleepy. You tore it down 18 months after it threw the rod and it sat idle for 18 months. Says more about the oil than IDI construction but good anyway.

Yup. I will point out that this motor had been recently rebuilt(<10K miles), had valve clearance issues, and the rod snapped in the middle. Both ends of the broken rod were completely intact and rode on their bearings freely. So, I'm chocking it up to improper building and stress due to piston to valve contact for those last 10K miles.

 

[PROFG]

I believe film strength data wins. Have less than 100 miles on last oil change, 15W-40, and no need for thinner oil if using pump (accumulator 3qts doubtful enough) so will press on with 15W-40, limited winter use (planned), block or lower hose heater (planned) and battery warmer (like on MB).

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Honestly, don't worry about it. 15W40 oil, change it every 3K or so(very dirty engine), and the engine's not going to wear out the bearings any time soon.
I'm not convinced at all about "dry starts" ever since I took apart an engine that threw a rod... 18 months later. I found the rod bearings(and everything else inside) still had a nice film of oil on them, and there was no metal to metal contact or anything else. Oil stays adhered in a thin layer for a *very* long time. And it's that film strength that protects the metal parts when moving.

I agree with this. 18 months is a long time for there to still be an oil film. I'm not going to try to talk anybody out of doing this, but it seems like a waste of time and money to me. These engines will go for several hundred thousand miles without an type of preluber with proper service.

 

[Kizer]

I'm not convinced at all about "dry starts"

I don't have the data or personal experience to clam "convinced".
I can say, however; I like the idea of the pump for "post shut-down" oil flow (put it on a timer) ... If I did that I'd also wire a momentary switch so that I could pre-lube ... why not?

where are some good places to plumb something like this in for a startup oil pump?

I'm not sure on this ... maybe pan to oil cooler? The idea being that you're drawing out of the pan and pushing through the filter into the crank case:

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[Thewespaul]

CAT, who knows a thing or two about building an engine to last millions of miles, requires that their techs install EVERY filter dry. They have found that it’s better for the engine to run on the existing oil film for awhile until pressure is built up than for the engine to see unfiltered oil. I also, would not worry about it in these engines.

 

[Kizer]

They have found that it’s better for the engine to run on the existing oil film for awhile until pressure is built up than for the engine to see unfiltered oil.

That's interesting ... never would have guessed that.

For the record: I thought that the plumbing plan that I proposed would go through the filter before entering the crankcase ... that's what I intended.

 

[Philip1]

CAT, who knows a thing or two about building an engine to last millions of miles, requires that their techs install EVERY filter dry. They have found that it’s better for the engine to run on the existing oil film for awhile until pressure is built up than for the engine to see unfiltered oil. I also, would not worry about it in these engines.

Cat also has a prelude system at least on their large earthmoving equipment as well

 

[BeastMaster]

Maybe CAT is considering probabilities of contamination of the fresh oil during the change. How many times have we tried to change oil in the field under adverse conditions. Wind and wind driven stuff, leaves, sand, water, etc. Or that carelessly forgotten piece of foil bottle seal?

The filter would have caught that before it got lodged up in an oil passage.