Help! I'm throughly confused about pump timing.

[chris142]

Well now that I have the tool I can play around with it. As I said earlier when I got the truck it was a real Dog. I don't know where the timing was but I had a hard time merging onto the fwy, With it @5* I can merge as fast as traffic is flowing. Fuel milage has not changed. 13.2 in town and 15.3 hwy @ 70mph.

I'll drive it a few days and see how it feels. My timing light does not do 1/2 degrees so getting exactly 9.7degrees wont be possible. Whats spec for the stock timing for an 87 with a 6.9L?

 

[Trying my best]

Hahahaha......Bon bons

 

[Trying my best]

Prolly the same 8.5 or as previously states 9.7ish with the new diesel

 

[chris142]

I found the timing spec. it's supposed to be 1.5A. I've got it at 7A. do you guys still recomend I advance it more?

 

[GOOSE]

I found the timing spec. it's supposed to be 1.5A. I've got it at 7A. do you guys still recomend I advance it more?

I believe the 1.5A is using the Lumy method, I would try to aim for the 9* mark, they do like it

 

[G. Mann]

Just found this hand held tach, thought I would pass it along.

Seems it would be handy for timing our trucks.

http://blog.makezine.com/2012/11/07/tool-review-dt-2234c-digital-laser-tachometer/

Made in China , so you know it's a quality product...... but it's cheap....

 

[chris142]

Ok I got it loosened up and cranked as far to the passenger side as possible! The oblong holes the studs go through the pump are preventing any more advance. The studs are hitting the body of the pump...Ain't gunna move any more unless I pull the pump and grind the holes longer. Timing is set @9BTDC.

Thats all I can get.

 

[riotwarrior]

Ok I got it loosened up and cranked as far to the passenger side as possible! The oblong holes the studs go through the pump are preventing any more advance. The studs are hitting the body of the pump...Ain't gunna move any more unless I pull the pump and grind the holes longer. Timing is set @9BTDC.

Thats all I can get.

Well the timing sounds about right....hmm.....

....sure sounds like you moved it a very long ways. I'm wondering if someone previously replaced the IP via the lift the cover off (WHICH IS A NO NO NO NO) method and subsequently put it back one tooth out? I dunno if it would run or not...but I"m guessing it would and not well at that....

I'm sure that our resident timing guru will chime in soon... Oh Gary...

 

[icanfixall]

I'm reading this the same way you are Al... Its not supposed to require the pump be turned all the way towards the passenger side fender and meet the stops. That clearly tells me two things... The pump, gear cover and gear were removed at one time and the gears never got timing properly... Or it tells me the injection pump is shot causing the timing to float and not react properly. Now telling you what the problem is could be costly like replacing the injection pump of unknown miles and condition. I reread the complete post from start to finish and nowhere did I read what condition or miles are on this pump or did someone before you remove the pump with the gear and cover still attached. So thats where we are now...

 

[chris142]

. Now telling you what the problem is could be costly like replacing the injection pump of unknown miles and condition. I reread the complete post from start to finish and nowhere did I read what condition or miles are on this pump or did someone before you remove the pump with the gear and cover still attached. So thats where we are now...

I bought the truck used last February. At that time it had only 59,000 miles on it. All the belts, hoses etc were the original Ford parts so I replaced all the important stuff at that time.

The truck came from Alaska(Carfax and the license plates that were on it were AK plates) and the pump has a tag from a rebuilder in Fairbanks, AK.

No idea how long ago it was rebuilt or how well of a job they did. I'm ASSUMING they know what they are doing. I sure would not want customers breaking down 300 miles from nowhere and freezing to death.

The truck was more gutless than it should be and the engine was very quiet but boy would it smoke! So I started reading this board and others. Found out that I can play with the pump to get more power.

So I started messing with the timing. Last week I bought the Pulse timing box.

Fast forward... I had the timing set @5BTDC@2000 rpm and it ran pretty good with little smoke. You guys said I should have it @ 9.7BTDC.

So I moved the pump but it was only @7BTDC@2000rpm. So I drove it home and power seemed down.

This morning I loosened it up and with help I got the pump cranked all the way to the Left. Now the timing is @9BTDC@2000 rpm.

I took it to lunch and now it does not sound right. It's really loud, almost sounds like when a Gasser is pinging on low octain gas. After It warmed up I got on it and Acceleration is down. It seems to be laboring and it smokes black.

So I think I'm going to put it back to 5BTDC and leave it there as thats where it ran the best.

 

[FORDF250HDXLT]

you can't set your timing at 9.5-10 BTDC like the boys running good grade fuel at sea level and expect the same results,up there in the clouds.it's of little surprise when you say retarded timing makes your engine run stronger up there.

oem settings was not such low (advanced) ATDC numbers like many on here incorrectly claim.
it was roughly 5 ATDC and for you,it would be even more retarded at 7 ATDC since your up high,and most likely running on what most of the US diesel fuel is,of just 40ish cetane.
so by timing via the "newer" method after 7.3l's came out,you would want to shoot more towards the lower number (retarded direction when talking BTDC) of 6 degrees BTDC.
your 5 was probably a degree too retarded,but 5 is probably just fine for up there.id shoot for 6 personally first.

lumy timing,and how it translates to pulse timing is so misunderstood.
just plain lumy timing in general was (and still is) for that matter lol.

 

[chris142]

This is my first Diesel powered pickup. I know about older cars with Carbs and Distributers. What I was tought was to add 2 degrees of ignition timing for every 1000 gain in Elevation.

So if a car was spek'd for say 0TDC @ sea level we would run the timing up to 6BTDC @my 3000ft elevation to get performance back.

Are you saying that with a diesel you retard the injection timing as you go up in elevation?

 

[icanfixall]

Well the more you explain about this rig the more I feel someone removed the pump, cover and the gear all as one piece. Then they didn't get the gear timing correct when they put it back togehter. There is no reason for an injection pump to go bad with just 59,000 miles on it. Seems like maybe the previous owner got screwed or he ran some messy fuel that destroyed the injection pump. Water or alge could do that. Then removing the pump the wrong way will mess up the gear timing. I use this analgy because you posted that you have the pump turned all the way to the stop. Thats never necessary with a properly gear timed engine. Sadly this is my feeling on this. Now asking questions here will get you plenty of help. Just me asking you the questions I asked has lead me to this conclusion. Others will chime in so see what else others may have to add to this. What part of Ca are you located. Might be someone near you willing to lend a hand too..

 

[Black dawg]

your pump is getting worn or calibrated funky. set timing at idle back to about 12-12.5, and then adjust the cam on the side of the pump to give it 8.5 at 2k. This should make it sound right to you and get 8.5 at 2k without the pump cranked as far as it will go.

 

[chris142]

I did not know that the advance can be adjusted externally. can you explain more ?