Fan clutch and thermostat info?

[jrad235]

Hey guys, just got back from a short run up the mountain with a GCVW of around 12k #'s. My new gauges are telling me the truck is working too hard.

At the top of a 9% grade(1500'), in 3rd gear, at 3000 RPM, my temp gauge was hovering right around 230 degrees. EGT's at 1100. I thought these things were supposed to be able to run at the governor all day? It was running around 220 most of the way up the grade.

I also didn't hear my fan lock up and "take off like a jet engine", are these engines too loud to hear it? I replaced the fan clutch a couple years ago. In other news, it sounds awesome with the new exhaust at 3k rpm.

looking for a little advice, thanks guys.

 

[icanfixall]

Well please answer what fan clutch you installed. Also can you tell us what radiater you are running. If you can tell us the fins per inch count and the number of rows it will really help. also whats the timing set at. Knowing your non turbo helps too so your pyro temps are going to be higher than a turbo engine. As for the fan locking up sound.. Yes, you will know when it happens. There is a sound like a slipping standard clutch. It sounds like your rpm is climbing but watch the tach to actually see if it climbs. Being an auto it wont. At 242 degrees the dash gauge wil peg over past the "L" in normal because the over temp lite sender is designed to close which grounds the dash gauge causin this. Sounds like you worked the engine nicely and did not hurt anything. Only the factory thermostat is recommended here. That or the international thremostat. Others like the Stant will fit but they cannot pass enough coolant to keep the engines cool. The factory thermostat begins to open at 192 degrees and is fully open at 212 degrees. The water pump flows 70 gpm at 300 rpm and is geared to 1.08:1 ratio.

 

[gatorman21218]

My truck is too loud to hear it but I can watch the needle go from 230 to 200 in about 10 seconds when it kicks on at idle.

Those temps dont sound too bad for a natural. I dont think anything is really wrong and I dont think any harm is being done. thats about what you can expect hauling 12k up a 9% grade IMO.

 

[kc0stp]

So whats the bad part? EGTs are right about where you want them (maybe a tad lower) and 210-225 is about where you want the coolant....

 

[riotwarrior]

You know...it's all been covered...nothing more to see...move along move along

 

[jrad235]

Lots of questions, awesome. Hopefully I can answer some.

Well please answer what fan clutch you installed. Also can you tell us what radiater you are running. If you can tell us the fins per inch count and the number of rows it will really help.

A Hayden Clutch #2833 Was installed back in Oct of '10. As far as I know, it is the stock radiator for the vehicle.

also whats the timing set at. Knowing your non turbo helps too so your pyro temps are going to be higher than a turbo engine. As for the fan locking up sound.. Yes, you will know when it happens. There is a sound like a slipping standard clutch. It sounds like your rpm is climbing but watch the tach to actually see if it climbs. Being an auto it wont. At 242 degrees the dash gauge will peg over past the "L" in normal because the over temp lite sender is designed to close which grounds the dash gauge causing this. Sounds like you worked the engine nicely and did not hurt anything.

Definitely haven't ever heard the fan kick on, even before I switched the exhaust, but I never saw the temp drop radically while towing. At idle it pretty much sits at 190-200. The gauge was just past the "L" briefly(Not pegged on hot) until I backed it way down and arrived at the summit shortly thereafter. I removed the factory over-temp to install the aftermarket gauge.

I know you'll hate this answer, but I have no idea what the timing is. The performance is acceptable, but a little sluggish off idle until about 1400RPM. Anyone want to sell a timing meter?

Only the factory thermostat is recommended here. That or the international thermostat. Others like the Stant will fit but they cannot pass enough coolant to keep the engines cool. The factory thermostat begins to open at 192 degrees and is fully open at 212 degrees. The water pump flows 70 gpm at 300rpm and is geared to 1.08:1 ratio.

I haven't ever changed the T-Stat, so I have no idea what's in it, although I am well aware of the recommendation. I'm guessing you meant 70 GPM at 3k? That is quite a lot, and should have no problems cooling this monster. The range of 192-212 is what I was looking for, Sounds like I MAY want to go ahead and take care of that. So I take it the fan should kick on hard at 230 degrees?

 

[kc0stp]

If your truly worried about it (IMO anything below 205 is to cold for these engines) put a motorcraft fan clutch and IH t-stat in and you should be good to go (Hayden are infamous for being bad out of the box) the stock fan clutch kicks in anywhere from 220-250.

 

[icanfixall]

Yes.. The stock fan clutch operates from those temps. Nothing is the same between differant fan clutches even from ford. About the only clutch that works well is the Magtech from New York company. Someone here will post about it. I have used three of them on my engines over the last 10 or 12 years. They modify the springs so they lock up at a set temp around 210 I think. Can't recall because its been working so well. Never worry bout it. Coupled with the huge aluminum Rodney Red radiater things have a tuff time seeing 100 degrees no matter what I do. I probably will see some change when I install the hypermax intercooler. Still need to design a differant intake hat for that. Sure would like to use a tig torch or find a capable person that can use one. Aluminum is a material you need to know what your doing. Or it will fail horribly. Cleaness and preheat is the secret to a good weld when doing aluminum. Then welding only military grade 6061T6 will get it done. It will look like butta.....

 

[jrad235]

So what is the danger zone for this engine? I can keep the EGT's down, but what is my DO NOT EXCEED engine temp?

 

[icanfixall]

I wont go over 230 but many can tempt 245 and get away with it. If you running Evans waterless coolant you can run even hotter but I'm not going to find that limit either. Evans will run as zero pressure cooling system and not boil till some ungody hot temps. Knowing you can does not mean you should either. One has to remember these are simple gauges and the actual temps may vary. So leaving some temp on the table is a good insurance policy in my oppinnion. Same with the pyros. Why tempt fake till you find... Oh hell.. That was too hot. The damages done because you were wondering what my ego limit is here can lead to some expensive repairs. When I lost a freeze plug pulling the Grape Vine here in cali I saw nothing wrong with my coolant temps because there was no coolant touching the sender. It was the oil temp that told me I had a problem. That and the lifter knocking because the oil temp was passing 330 degrees and the oil thinned out. I lost that engine because the pistons swelled up. Scuffed the skirts plus the engine stopped dead locked up. Two cracked heads. Ruined pistons and rings. I replaced all the internal parts with only 5200 miles on that engine.. What a waste it was. My rods and mains were ok looking with no problems but why chance it. They miced ok but hell.. Its way too deep to make a mistake and run them. cheap insurance installing new ones.

 

[whiteboyslo]

Where do you have the temp sensor installed for the coolant? As I've been told, it makes a difference on the temps you'll see. Same with EGTs for that matter (even more so, actually). Banks' literature recommends 1050-1100°F as a safe limit for EGTs, but their pyro is installed in the turbo pedestal, not the manifold (where the temps would be a bit hotter).

Mike

 

[IDIDieselJohn]

I have a Magtech fan clutch on the motorhome! LOVE it, locks in around 200-210, and it's NEVER EVER let the engine get over 210* according to me real gauge. Even climbing hills in the Rockies, screaming on the governor in 1st gear doing 25mph, or long hills in the desert of Arizona in 110*+ weather.


I CLEARLY hear my fan lock in as well.

 

[jrad235]

Ok, well, it sounds like I may need to buy a new fan clutch again, can someone please link to this magical "Magtech" clutch since it doesn't seem to exist online? I do still have my old one that is locked up pretty good, maybe I should switch it back in. Of course, I hate doing things twice...

 

[kc0stp]

Ford specs a safe max of 237 at the upper hose.

 

[jrad235]

Where do you have the temp sensor installed for the coolant? As I've been told, it makes a difference on the temps you'll see. Same with EGTs for that matter (even more so, actually). Banks' literature recommends 1050-1100°F as a safe limit for EGTs, but their pyro is installed in the turbo pedestal, not the manifold (where the temps would be a bit hotter).

Mike

The sender is installed at the front of the DS head, in place of the factory Over-Temp.

Ford specs a safe max of 237 at the upper hose.

Thank you.