Burning up fuel shut off solenoids.

Jesus Freak

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There was a discussion about this about a year ago, in my opinion the mechanical part should be fairly simple.

I'm just not sure exactly how to seal the shaft without either casting a new cover with more material where the shaft would go for a place to install a seal. Or machining a new cover with the same extra material around the shaft area for a seal.

Depending on the composition of the cover it could be possible to weld some aluminum round stock large enough for a seal where the shaft goes through.

I am definitely interested in the idea of a manual kill.

James
I'll figure it out. I'm crazy.
 

Rdnck84_03

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If I thought I could find enough time I would have a go at it myself. At the moment I am working a full-time job plus some overtime, and I'm still putting in around 25hrs a week for the weld shop I worked at for the last 14 years. I can't even keep up with the " has to be done stuff " at the moment, but a couple more months and we should have everything paid off except for the land loan on one of our pastures. Then hopefully I can get back to tinkering with things.

James
 

Jesus Freak

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If I thought I could find enough time I would have a go at it myself. At the moment I am working a full-time job plus some overtime, and I'm still putting in around 25hrs a week for the weld shop I worked at for the last 14 years. I can't even keep up with the " has to be done stuff " at the moment, but a couple more months and we should have everything paid off except for the land loan on one of our pastures. Then hopefully I can get back to tinkering with things.

James
I have one disassembled and have studied it. I got a couple ideas in my head that I'm going to sketch on paper and post tomorrow on my thread. As soon as Im really moving with it I'll make an official thread. Here's a picture of the cap in pieces. My idea is to use the steel frame on the solenoid to give the aluminum strength and not have to invest much. I can't weld aluminum like you postulated. The other thing is that you want to imagine the rod coming in the side, thus drilling a hole. My idea is to come through the top where a hole is already and the solenoid frame is there too. Also to use the plunger out of the solenoid since it's already there and designed for it.
 

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Clb

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what about some form of marine bulkhead fitting to pass a transducer wire thru the hull just with a shorter reach?
 

Jesus Freak

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what about some form of marine bulkhead fitting to pass a transducer wire thru the hull just with a shorter reach?
I'd be all over it, if I had any idea what you were talking about. I don't know anything about boats.

Edit: I looked, all that appears to be electronics stuff, we're on the "mechanical cable/lever" kick..... like in the 1900's. We're done with the 21st century.
 

Rdnck84_03

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With the electrical connectors removed that gives me an idea. Make a "U" shaped piece to protrude through the electrical holes on top and connect to the solenoid armature under the cap. Still not exactly sure how to seal it but the functional part should be fairly easy.

James
 

Jesus Freak

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Well my chinanoid came in today and I installed it and I've got key initiated shut down again.

I'm not done with a manual shut off idea though. It would take too many words and more thinking than I'm up to right now to describe my idea. I'll draw a picture sometimes soon and maybe go get some stuff at the hardware store this weekend. Tomorrow I'm married to a project I've been wanting to do for my wife before it gets too hot round these parts.

Anyway, here's a picture of a real authentic cheap chinanoid!
 

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franklin2

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I have seen this problem many times in my work through the years. Hydraulic solenoids will burn up. I had a safety interlock solenoid burn up on a skid steer. I have had many different relays and contactors burn up.

They all get hot and burn up if they are energized and the metal core is not in the middle of the windings. If you are testing a coil on the bench, and you do not have the metal plunger up inside the core, it will burn up for sure.

On various hydraulic solenoids I have worked on in factory automation, the spool would occasionally stick and if it was energized long enough, it would smoke the coil and then blow the control fuse.

On the skid steer they had a mechanical interlock on the levers that would lock them from being accidentally moved. One of them got bent, the plunger could not pull it'self all the way up in the middle of the coil, it fried the coil and kept blowing the main harness fuse and it would not run. That was a difficult one to find.

Many many times we have lost a single phase on the 3 phase electrical system. This would sometimes present about 60-70 volts A/C on a 120v ac control. This would not be enough voltage to pull the guts of the contactor into the coil, but would be enough voltage over time to smoke the coil because the coil was empty inside with no metal in it. Would smoke many machine contactors.

I would check and see if there is a problem with your IP, not letting the metal plunger fully insert inside the coil.
 

hacked89

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I have seen this problem many times in my work through the years. Hydraulic solenoids will burn up. I had a safety interlock solenoid burn up on a skid steer. I have had many different relays and contactors burn up.

They all get hot and burn up if they are energized and the metal core is not in the middle of the windings. If you are testing a coil on the bench, and you do not have the metal plunger up inside the core, it will burn up for sure.

On various hydraulic solenoids I have worked on in factory automation, the spool would occasionally stick and if it was energized long enough, it would smoke the coil and then blow the control fuse.

On the skid steer they had a mechanical interlock on the levers that would lock them from being accidentally moved. One of them got bent, the plunger could not pull it'self all the way up in the middle of the coil, it fried the coil and kept blowing the main harness fuse and it would not run. That was a difficult one to find.

Many many times we have lost a single phase on the 3 phase electrical system. This would sometimes present about 60-70 volts A/C on a 120v ac control. This would not be enough voltage to pull the guts of the contactor into the coil, but would be enough voltage over time to smoke the coil because the coil was empty inside with no metal in it. Would smoke many machine contactors.

I would check and see if there is a problem with your IP, not letting the metal plunger fully insert inside the coil.
In a db2 if there isn’t correct internal fuel pressure will the plunger fully insert inside the coil? It gets warm when the solenoid is energized but the pump isn’t turned “pumping” fuel, but otherwise it’s fine. Key on ignition / to use electronics for extended periods is easy way to kill db2 fuel shutoff solenoids.

Just a thought from left field but maybe the internal pressure inside jesusfreaks pump is lower / worn out or something along those lines. Might not even make sense im no pump expert.
 

Jesus Freak

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I have seen this problem many times in my work through the years. Hydraulic solenoids will burn up. I had a safety interlock solenoid burn up on a skid steer. I have had many different relays and contactors burn up.

They all get hot and burn up if they are energized and the metal core is not in the middle of the windings. If you are testing a coil on the bench, and you do not have the metal plunger up inside the core, it will burn up for sure.

On various hydraulic solenoids I have worked on in factory automation, the spool would occasionally stick and if it was energized long enough, it would smoke the coil and then blow the control fuse.

On the skid steer they had a mechanical interlock on the levers that would lock them from being accidentally moved. One of them got bent, the plunger could not pull it'self all the way up in the middle of the coil, it fried the coil and kept blowing the main harness fuse and it would not run. That was a difficult one to find.

Many many times we have lost a single phase on the 3 phase electrical system. This would sometimes present about 60-70 volts A/C on a 120v ac control. This would not be enough voltage to pull the guts of the contactor into the coil, but would be enough voltage over time to smoke the coil because the coil was empty inside with no metal in it. Would smoke many machine contactors.

I would check and see if there is a problem with your IP, not letting the metal plunger fully insert inside the coil.
It would be crazy tracking down something like that.
 

Jesus Freak

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In a db2 if there isn’t correct internal fuel pressure will the plunger fully insert inside the coil? It gets warm when the solenoid is energized but the pump isn’t turned “pumping” fuel, but otherwise it’s fine. Key on ignition / to use electronics for extended periods is easy way to kill db2 fuel shutoff solenoids.

Just a thought from left field but maybe the internal pressure inside jesusfreaks pump is lower / worn out or something along those lines. Might not even make sense im no pump expert
Now that's a thought right there. My key switch has been janky for a bit and if I jump out of my truck in a hurry without checking, my stereo will still be on when I get back to it. It's only happened a couple times but it was on for 6-8hrs.......I bet that's our culprit! Good job @hacked89 !!!

I started to actually adjust the key switch earlier but I had to cook dinner, so I didn't want to marry a project.
 

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