1987 6.9 c6 to e4od questions

[mavericke350]

Hello,

Over the summer I purchased a nonrunning '87 ford van with a 6.9 banks c6 and what has to be 4.11 gears (she's screaming at 55)

After throwing some parts at it, and concluding it has internal issues that I will play with at a later date, I found a 6.9 with a stud kit, and serpentine, and which appeared to be somewhat rebuilt.

I rewired the glow plugs to momentary push button, added an electric lift pump, and three toggles for the fuel pump.. fuel on, high idle, and the fuel pressure thingamadoohickey. It seems to run well, has a fair amount of blowby though.

Anyhow, after swapping it into the van, I am getting a very loud rattle when there is no load on the trans. I pulled the cover plate off the flywheel to see if it moved at all, thinking I might have left a bolt loose,.. it's solid. Rattle sounds tinny,.. and while I am used to a auto flex plate being, well, a flex plate,.. this thing is a full size flywheel imo.

driving gently, I am getting 14-16 mpg. I would normally be thinking of changing the gears in the rear end to get better milage, but the rattle has me worried.

How much involved in an E4od swap? From what I have read, I need a stand alone controller, but will that flywheel bolt up to the E4od TC? Seems like my cheapest way out,.. Any thoughts from people that have been down this road? I like this van, it's just an old windowless cargo box, but it's wicked handy. I would really like to see 20-22 on the interstate though.

 

[Wyreth]

personally I would get an OD unit for the c6 before messing with an e4od. The c6 is stone reliable, and simple as a hammer. Plus you really can expect to get a good used c6 for reasonable money. Any used e4od is highly suspect. I think for the money, a c6 + an OD unit will end up being much cheaper, and much less headache. I am currently going that rout for those reasons. (altho a ZF WILL be going into my truck eventually)

If you're stuck on the e4od, they can be bulletproof when built correctly. There will be alot of fun electrical work to get it in, and some sensors that you will then have to maintain. However if you have the cash and the will, you can get one built, and it will be the last trans you ever need for that van. (but so long as you keep it cool, the c6 is already built like that)



Also, welcome to OB!

 

[Hydro-idi]

^^^What he said. In my opinion, the c6 is a way better transmission than the E4OD transmission will ever be. Also, the c6 is a very inexpensive transmission to rebuild if the time comes. I would look into putting 3.55 rear diff gears or a gearvendors unit if you want to lower rpm's.
When I'm going 55, my rpm's stick right around 2,400 which seems to be normal for a truck with a c6 trans and 3.55 diff gears. Running your truck at high rpm's won't hurt anything. These engines are tough enough to handle you mashing your foot to the floor for hours at a time at maximum rpm if you please to.
I am not sure what that rattle is, but it may be your flywheel. I would separate the trans and engine and make sure your bolts were put on properly and nothing is cracked. Good luck

 

[icanfixall]

Welcome to the forum. The above posting makes some great points about what to do in your case. I would be looking at the bolts and the steel torque converter thin metal plate too. I feel you have the older style heavy cast iron flywheel that has the thin metal converter plate to it. If you removed and installed the heavy cast iron flywheel from one engine to another then the bolts need some thread sealant on then or oil will leak out past the threads and wet the back of the engine badly. Also the torque on those bolts is 47 lbs. Hopefully you will not have to remove the trans but expect the unexpected. Then your ahead of the repair game. A Gear Venders is a very nice addition to the C6 trans. Truth be siad the E4OD can be built tuff enough to be the last trans you wil ever need if its kept cool but thats mostly what any auto trans needs.

 

[Wyreth]

Can you get a vid of the rattle?

It could be your flexplate is cracked... but that's just a WAG.

 

[trackspeeder]

Cracked flexplate will rattle with no load.

If you convert to an E4OD. You can use the C6 flex flywheel. You will need a TPS, VSS, and a tach signal.
If you use a 92 and up E4. You will need a pre 92 tailshaft. This will cover your VSS and speedo cable.

 

[maverick350]

Thank you all for the replies. Much appreciated! My computer decided to update overnight with all my newly made and unsaved accounts and passwords on wordpad,.. so this is take two.


Tonight I cleared out a hole in the garage big enough to roll the van in, so if all goes well tomorrow night I can check and inspect the flex plate.

I had no idea there was a tin plate built into the flywheel... that makes sense that it could indeed be cracked and causing my rattle.

I did indeed swap the flywheel over from my old engine, as the flywheel that came on the new engine was an ordinary flexplate that I believe came off of a 7.3 idi e4od application with a collar that extended the crankshaft instead of the large heavy flywheel that was originally mated to my c6. I tried to keep the same parts working together, flywheel-c6 although, if the flywheel has a cracked plate, I suppose the lighter flexplate should work,..

It never occurred to me that the flywheel bolts were through bolts,... I should have realized that. And yes, it is wet down there. So at the very least, the bolts need to come out, brake cleaned, and lock tight applied.

I might not need to look into a transmission swap after all! Eventually I would like to see what a double overdrive of gv and e4od would be like on the highway with an engine that according to graphs gets its peak torque at 1400,.. but that's sometime down the road with more time and money.

As for now, on with I will update when I fix the rattle.

Thanks again,... much appreciated.

 

[maverick350]

Flexplate was indeed cracked. Luckily there was one on ebay for 40 bucks shipped. finally got it fired up again today.

Interesting side note,.. the flywheel bolts were stretched. the pitch changed about 3/4 way up the bolt. I don't know if this is normal, or if it was overtorqued. I inspected another set I had kicking around from another engine, and they were stretched the same way. locktight, 47 ft lbs,.. the rattle is gone. Well,.. THAT rattle is gone. the van still rattles,.. but at least now you can't hear it through multiple concrete walls.

I might have located an overdrive unit,.. you'all talked me out of the e40d for the time being.

Thanks for the help!

 

[Revelstoke]

Bauman computer, E40D built to 97 specs, VSS, TPS, correct flexplate, Triple disk torque converter. I spent a bit of time researching this. Realistic cost for correctly built tranny and equipment would be about $6500. I also figure there has to be a fudge factor with anything like that, so I'd add something to that. David from Canada has done it, and he's built these trannys too. I believe you'll see his string with a search, and I think he's in the Tech Section. Anyway you look at it..........lots and lots of work and $. I think it would be worth it, but lots and lots of work.