I Gots to know turbo expectations

[Guntherx]

OK I need to know some honest definitive answers about turbo expectations. I have heard mixed reviews about what a turbo can actually do on an IDI. I have heard that it will run as well as a stock PS, but not if they are chipped. Will I be able to pull 15,000-25,000 at 70 over the HILLS?

With that, I have a few questions. As far as I know, the only real difference is one is DI vs. IDI and that the IDI has a higher compression ratio. So then why is it that the PS can make more HP and FT/LBS?

I am at the pointt of either making the big change or looking for something else. I was pulling 2 horses in a 3 horse slant with 7 people down 83 and going up reeser's summit. I was down to 40. If I had a turbo on it, would it pull it at 70?

I know all of you think that our trucks are the best thing since sliced bread, but I want hoest answers without hype. Real world experience is appreciated in comparable vehicles and loads.

 

[Exekiel69]

OK I need to know some honest definitive answers about turbo expectations. I have heard mixed reviews about what a turbo can actually do on an IDI. I have heard that it will run as well as a stock PS, but not if they are chipped. Will I be able to pull 15,000-25,000 at 70 over the HILLS?

You sure can, but you'll need some serious change on the cooling system and anything you can come up to keep egt's down. If I go up on a hill and step on the go pedal it will increase the speed but egt's go up too and it is something you want to watch for.

 

[tractorman86]

You sure can, but you'll need some serious change on the cooling system and anything you can come up to keep egt's down. If I go up on a hill and step on the go pedal it will increase the speed but egt's go up too and it is something you want to watch for.

definately get a pyrometer installed!!!putting on a turbo is not going to solve all ur problems though, u need to set the inj pump up in conjunction with the turbo's output. u might look at getting an inter-cooler out of a psd fabbing up some mounts and having ur local exhaust shop bend up some tubing for the instal look on ebay (for example here is one http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/6-0L...QQcategoryZ33602QQitemZ8063689612QQrdZ1),this will produce more power and lower egts u will have to take some measurements to know wat will fit infront of your radiator,it will be alot of work but it would be worthwile. also there is water/methenol injection, again better power and lower egts. not sure if propaine or nitrous inj. lowers egts but i hear they can make a hell of a lot of power. all of these mods will also result in better fuel economy which is pretty important these days! a lot of the reason for more power is a lot more efficient fuel delivery due to the computer working to peak the performence according to the conditions(it is all technology really, not sure i like a comp. controlling something worth so much money). there is also a lot more mods available for the psd's. but the moral of the story is, dont think an idi cant keep up! :draw

 

[Russ]

PSD have lower compression and rely on the turbo to make make up for it. Look at the boost numbers. IDI max turbo boost is about 12 lbs. PSD make boost in the 30 lbs range. Also the PSD is DI so the computer injects the fuel right to the pistons, not into a precup as in the IDI. Will a turbo'd IDI run with a stock PSD? In all reality ,no. My dads stock 95 put whoopin' on my Banks turbo'd 93. We were both hauling truck campers (mine a 9'er, his a 11 1/2'er and I was towing a small pop up camper behind me). we were pulling a small hill and I joked with him on the radio "Ok, lets see what that PSD can do". next thing I know is he was blowing by me, toping the hill and running out of sight. The IDI is not a major power house, but a very reliable engine. IF you want to run over mountains at 70 mph, I don't think a stock PSD will even do what your asking.

 

[Exekiel69]

The IDI is not a major power house, but a very reliable engine. IF you want to run over mountains at 70 mph, I don't think a stock PSD will even do what your asking.

Provably will, I have seen many on the road going up hill with a 3-5 horse trailer runing at 70mph or more, but again, Major cooling system modifications and mods, only this time more money cause it's a psd . Are you in such a hurry? Loaded or not I don't usually pass 65mph.

 

[argve]

Having never pulled a horse trailer but looking at them they seem to shed more air than our TT (which is dang near as tall as a 5th wheel) I could not pull it up a hill at 70 - but could yank it up at around 60ish (9500lbs). I would say that to get an IDI to do what your asking will be taking the same path I did which sadly kills engines. As said I don't think a stock PSD would do as your asking (94-98 model year). I'm pretty sure that even a stock cummins or later gen PSD would have trouble with 70 up a grade.

 

[Diesel JD]

Just FYI, Hypermax does make an intercooler specifically designed for the IDI, but if you wnata fast engine, listen to Travis, he had a real strong IDI but it didn't make enough power to make him happy. The PSD has a compression ratio around 17.5:1, so you can stuff way more air in there without blowing the heads off, if you boost more than 13PSI with stock bolts you are asking for trouble. Much more than that and you're talking ARP studs and serious engine mods, which can reduce the reliability of an IDI, especially cold weather starting.

 

[Agnem]

Greg, I know Reesers summit, and you know that just going 70 up that hill without a trailer is asking a lot! A turbo will make a big difference, but for the kind of speed and power your looking for, no it's not going to give it to you, and to be honest, I'm not sure a PSD will either. The faster you go, the more wind resistance, and the more HP you need to move it at those speeds. Will a turbo let you comfortably pull a combined weight of 16,000 over that hill at 45 or 50? Probably. Will it at 70? Yes, but the EGT's will force you to back out of it, and you'll top the hill at something under 60. I know you've been disapointed with the performance of your truck for some time, and have not been willing to try a turbo yet. I'd say get the turbo and try it. If you don't like it, you'll get more for your rig that you will selling it without it. The turbo will be a heck of a lot cheaper than anything else you throw at this problem.

 

[93turbo_animal]

I have both and I can tell you my IDI will out pull my PSD hands down its not even close but I also think my PSD is a **** so with that said my brother had a 96 PSd and I could leave him when we towed and now he has a 97 PSD that is the 225HP version while I have never tried to leave him towing but I can run right with him also we did a little stop light drag racing empty both trucks are 5spd 4.10 geared and by 3rd gear he was at my bumper and by 4th I had a truck length on him my truck weighs in about 7000lbs and my loads weigh in between 10,000 and 12,000 lbs

 

[Guntherx]

thanks

Greg, I know Reesers summit, and you know that just going 70 up that hill without a trailer is asking a lot!

I have pulled it with semi's of various types and loads and have been in all 3 lanes depending. I pulled it without much of a run because of traffic and pulled it over at i guess 45, maybe 40. The engine will pull almost anything, over anhything, but just noe with speed. It also kills my mialeage because my foot was on the floor all the way up 83. I did let up to go around the turn when you get to Harrisburg to go onto 83. My friend says his Duramax will pull his 31 5'er over Sidling Mountain at over 70. It is chipped and he is not running it at the top setting. Do you believe him? I haven't actuallyh seen this happen.

Will a turbo let you comfortably pull a combined weight of 16,000 over that hill at 45 or 50? Probably. Will it at 70? Yes, but the EGT's will force you to back out of it, and you'll top the hill at something under 60.
Even that would be OK. I do have the 4" exhaust on it. Would I need more cooling to keep the EGT down?

I know you've been disapointed with the performance of your truck for some time, and have not been willing to try a turbo yet. I'd say get the turbo and try it. If you don't like it, you'll get more for your rig that you will selling it without it. The turbo will be a heck of a lot cheaper than anything else you throw at this problem.

I like the sound of that. I do have the turno sitting here. I need to order the exhaust Y from Banks to put it together and because it is $300, I am just a little leary that I might be throwing good after bad. I am also a little concerned about the turbo itself. It does have a little play in the bearings, bujt I don't know how much is aceptable. I have wanted to get a ride with Joe's to see how much improvement it made for him. The last I alked with him I got the impression he didn't get quite as much improvement as he
expected. I may and hope that I am wrong.

I do not really want to sell the truck as I have added so many things that I don't want to do it over again. I have the big tank, done most of the mods, painted it, big exhaust, lights, and more lights, and now I have 30"air horns to mount. Oh I just made and installed diamond plate over rubber mud flaps to keep mhy new trailer from getting destroyed. I even want to install a pop up gooseneck hitch to get away from the rails in the back.

As yuo can see the responses are copmletly opposing, so it is hard to know what to really expect. Will the older style Banks with no wastegate make more boost in the end and therefore be a better choice? I want to turbo what I have, I just don't want to waste money. Is a propane or water setup expensive, and how much maintenance and refilling afre required?

BTW, Thanks so much for taking time, your Knowledege and opinions are very much appreciated.

 

[apextrans]

I installed a newer Banks system & expected alot more than the system delivered. It's is much improved over stock but more mods were required. I initially followed the install instructions with regard to the fuel screw adjustments & wasn't happy with the results. Beretzs told me to open the wastegate & bottom out the fuel screw which made a huge difference. It still isn't a PSD but it's pretty good. I make about 12 PSI of boost & it moves out pretty well. I don't tow like you do but I just moved my buddies skid loader & some attachments on my trailer (total weight of about 6000lbs) from Finksburg to Fallston & had no problem holding 60mph on the highway. I had to keep backing out of it due to a coolant temp problem. Again, not the weight your talking about moving, but the turbo makes these trucks a different animal. I don't think it's a bad investment, just be aware it's not a "PSD in a box" kind of upgrade.

 

[Guntherx]

MAybe I should see how your truck runs. I should hook up your truck to one of my trailers and see how it pulls some of the hills going up to York. I was also thinking of a 3208 change.
Another possibility is to buy my friends 2001 W900 KW 475 CAT Aero 13 speed. I think it could pull my trailers. I don't know how it would be pulling around some of these tighter areas, but I had it down in the bayou many times and we managed. I have seen some of these registered as RV's. I wonder how I could do that?

 

[apextrans]

MAybe I should see how your truck runs. I should hook up your truck to one of my trailers and see how it pulls some of the hills going up to York. I was also thinking of a 3208 change.
Another possibility is to buy my friends 2001 W900 KW 475 CAT Aero 13 speed. I think it could pull my trailers. I don't know how it would be pulling around some of these tighter areas, but I had it down in the bayou many times and we managed. I have seen some of these registered as RV's. I wonder how I could do that?

With the weight your talking, I don't think you'd be impressed. There was no doubt I had that skid loader back there. I'm not sure about the registration issue on the W900. Something is ringing a bell about being "not for hire" , but I'll ask my insurance agent tommorrow. Renewal is due & meeting with him in the AM. He's pretty good with stuff like that. If he doesn't know, he'll know who does. I'll get back to you on that.

 

[Agnem]

That is always a big part of the equation, going to a bigger/newer truck. I remember David Sink telling me what the insurance was going to be for an F-650, and why he didn't get one.

 

[pafixitman]

I have wanted to get a ride with Joe's to see how much improvement it made for him. The last I alked with him I got the impression he didn't get quite as much improvement as he
expected. I may and hope that I am wrong.

Greg,
Part of my problem is I have only towed twice since I installed the turbo and both are fairly local - Gifford Pinchoet State Park and Gettysburg Campground. My third trip with the 5'r will be this weekend to GC again. I also did not turn up the fuel when the turbo went on. I got that done New Years Eve. There was a big difference after the fuel (I was already turned up, but not enough for the turbo). I have stage 1 injectors on order. Let me get them on and then I will stop by one eve.

At the rally last year, Eric was a bit impressed at my truck for (at the time) being NA. Eric runs an ATS turbo also.

I have not adjusted the wastegate (yet) so I top out at 6.5 lbs.

For what it is worth, my truck has only been over 70 mph 2 or 3 times in the two years I have owned her. I tow at 60 - 65 max.