Help with lug nuts and wheels

[u2slow]

Things can even go sideways on acorns... a bulge style is often needed on alum wheels, because the 6 corners of a std acorn can dig in first, and not clamp the wheel properly.

Unless the center bore is a match for hub-piloting, you need tapered nuts to center the wheel on the hub.

 

[Mike327]

If the center bore of the wheel fits tight and centers the wheel on your hub then it is a hub centric wheel and needs lug nuts with a washer of shoulder. If the center bore is loose around your hub it is a lug centric wheel and you will need the tapered lug nuts that will center your wheel up when you tighten the lugs. If the wheel is lug centric and you use the washer style lugs nuts it will waller out the lug holes and I’m sure the truck will not ride good.

 

[franklin2]

If the center bore of the wheel fits tight and centers the wheel on your hub then it is a hub centric wheel and needs lug nuts with a washer of shoulder. If the center bore is loose around your hub it is a lug centric wheel and you will need the tapered lug nuts that will center your wheel up when you tighten the lugs. If the wheel is lug centric and you use the washer style lugs nuts it will waller out the lug holes and I’m sure the truck will not ride good.

Not necessarily. Have any of you guys ever had a set of old Cragers or Keystone wheels? They had the cast centers with the metal outer rim. Those wheels were not hub centric, most aftermarket wheels are not in my experience. Their lug holes were larger than normal, and the lugs had a sleeve that fit tightly in these oversized lug holes and they had a shoulder with a metal washer. That would probably be what the original thread starter would need for his wheels, and possibly what I need for mine, haven't figured it out yet.

But those sleeves on those Crager style lug nuts centered the wheel, but they were not acorns, they were washered.

 

[Mike327]

Not necessarily. Have any of you guys ever had a set of old Cragers or Keystone wheels? They had the cast centers with the metal outer rim. Those wheels were not hub centric, most aftermarket wheels are not in my experience. Their lug holes were larger than normal, and the lugs had a sleeve that fit tightly in these oversized lug holes and they had a shoulder with a metal washer. That would probably be what the original thread starter would need for his wheels, and possibly what I need for mine, haven't figured it out yet.

But those sleeves on those Crager style lug nuts centered the wheel, but they were not acorns, they were washered.

That is very true. I haven’t seen lugs like that lately but I called a friend who owns a shop and they are still available

 

[IDIBRONCO]

I guess I missed it. What happened? You got a link? One reason I'm curious is that I mount my own tires & thinking about beads etc. Got a machine but no balancer.

Honestly, I'm not as happy with them as I was at first. I had to drive 35 miles to fins a smooth highway. They felt great. Now, sometimes they are fine, sometimes, they have a slight vibration, sometimes they have a bad vibration. Now to back up and tell the omttied details. I decided to buy Equal Flexx brand beads. Their chart didn't list 235/85R16 tires. I emailed the company to ask about the application. It took 5 emails to the gal who answered my first one and she didn't know very much (to put it in a forum-friendly form). Then it took 3 emails from her manager to finally come up with the answer of "you need 6 oz. per tire. I wasn't impressed with the company by this point, but I decided to buy from them since they went through so much effort to try to help me. After I put them in and discovered that my truck acts funny vibrationwise, I remembered that the DynaBeads chart said 5 oz. per tire, but if they didn't sell the recommended size, to go down to the next smaller size. So now, I'm wondering why one company says 6 oz., but the other says 4 oz. The only other possibility that I can come up with is the actual mounting of the tires. All four tires have both red and yellow balancing dots. A balancing dot is supposed to go next to the valve stem to help with balancing. I haven't messed with any tires that had balancing dots since December of 1994. At the Goodyear store that I worked at in '06 and '07, nobody there had even heard of balancing dots. I don't recall seeing very many tires with both colors of dots and I don't remember which is supposed to be which. I mounted the red dots by the valve stems, but I'm wondering if the yellow ones are supposed to go there. Either way, I don't think that I'm going to use the Flexx beads again.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Not necessarily. Have any of you guys ever had a set of old Cragers or Keystone wheels? They had the cast centers with the metal outer rim. Those wheels were not hub centric, most aftermarket wheels are not in my experience. Their lug holes were larger than normal, and the lugs had a sleeve that fit tightly in these oversized lug holes and they had a shoulder with a metal washer. That would probably be what the original thread starter would need for his wheels, and possibly what I need for mine, haven't figured it out yet.

But those sleeves on those Crager style lug nuts centered the wheel, but they were not acorns, they were washered.

That is very true. I haven’t seen lugs like that lately but I called a friend who owns a shop and they are still available

Not to mention slotted mags wheels (slots). They didn't have a hole, they actually had slots so that they could fit different bolt patterns. The washers that they used were kind of oval shaped instead of round.

 

[ttman4]

I decided to buy Equal Flexx brand beads. Their chart didn't list 235/85R16 tires.

, I remembered that the DynaBeads chart said 5 oz. per tire, but if they didn't sell the recommended size, to go down to the next smaller size.

All four tires have both red and yellow balancing dots. A balancing dot is supposed to go next to the valve stem to help with balancing.

I mounted the red dots by the valve stems, but I'm wondering if the yellow ones are supposed to go there. Either way, I don't think that I'm going to use the Flexx beads again.

Thanks for reply!

Yeah my DynaBeads charts show 4-5-6 oz depending on tire size (LT 225/75R16 thru say LT285/75R16) as well as Single vs Dual

As far as Dots, somewhere in my oldage foggy memories yellow dots come to my mind, but don't know for sure????
As far as beads I been so busy last few mo (fighting to get this shop built, few outpatient surgeries, etc, etc) I haven't had time to pursue chasing down & researching beads. But I'm gonn'a!
And I want to research more info on beads. Hear of all kind of beads being used, True tire balance beads, various WM beads, BB's, etc, etc

 

[IDIBRONCO]

As far as Dots, somewhere in my oldage foggy memories yellow dots come to my mind, but don't know for sure????

You're welcome. As for the dots, that's what I started thinking after I had the tires mounted. It seems like the ones that only have one color have the yellow ones. That may be my whole issue. I may try changing them around soon, but it will be a cold, crappy weekend and I'll be doing it inside my garage with the wood burner going.

 

[Jason1377]

You're welcome. As for the dots, that's what I started thinking after I had the tires mounted. It seems like the ones that only have one color have the yellow ones. That may be my whole issue. I may try changing them around soon, but it will be a cold, crappy weekend and I'll be doing it inside my garage with the wood burner going.

You both had me curious as to the red/yellow dots I have seen them before according to a Google search here is one result.


Red and Yellow Dots on Trailer Tires Explained
Question:

I purchased 4 of these tires notice they have red and yellow dots on them. Do these mean anything? I had other trailer tires at one time that had white dots and you were supposed to line up the valve stem with them. Thanks

Here is the link to this result sir's

https://www.etrailer.com/question-156025.html
asked by: Dean

Expert Reply:

Typically the yellow dot indicates the point on the tire that SHOULD be mounted next to the valve stem for the best balance.

The red dot is the uniformity mark. As well as not being able to manufacture perfectly weighted tires, it's also nearly impossible to make a tire which is perfectly circular. Every tire has a high and a low spot, the difference of which is called radial run out. Manufacturers typically mark this high point with a red dot on the tire sidewall.

When you have this tire mounted the guys at the shop will know all of this and will mount it accordingly

 

[u2slow]

Not necessarily. Have any of you guys ever had a set of old Cragers or Keystone wheels? They had the cast centers with the metal outer rim. Those wheels were not hub centric, most aftermarket wheels are not in my experience. Their lug holes were larger than normal, and the lugs had a sleeve that fit tightly in these oversized lug holes and they had a shoulder with a metal washer. That would probably be what the original thread starter would need for his wheels, and possibly what I need for mine, haven't figured it out yet.

But those sleeves on those Crager style lug nuts centered the wheel, but they were not acorns, they were washered.

Not to mention slotted mags wheels (slots). They didn't have a hole, they actually had slots so that they could fit different bolt patterns. The washers that they used were kind of oval shaped instead of round.

Yes, same with most old indy-slot, or turbine wheels of the day. Add 40 years of corrosion and they don't center worth a darn. The OP's wheels are from this century.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

When you have this tire mounted the guys at the shop will know all of this and will mount it accordingly

This is funny since nobody but me had even heard of balance dots when I worked at a Good Year store.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Yes, same with most old indy-slot, or turbine wheels of the day. Add 40 years of corrosion and they don't center worth a darn. The OP's wheels are from this century.

I hated those things when I worked at a tire shop for a few months back in 1994.

 

[ncsumd]

To me, it looks like the dark area is tapered. I can't tell without a better pic or touching it. The OP needs to add more details.

EDIT: And those aftermarket wheels probably have a 5.125" center bore so they're not going to hub-pilot on any 4.88" Ford hubs.

Yes, the dark area is tapered. Looks to be the same angle as the lug nut in the picture.

 

[ncsumd]

Thanks for all the help. We are going to look for some different wheels with correct backspacing. Since my son will be driving, I don't want to take any chances with lug nut issues and rubbing.
Any idea where to look for wheels? Don't really care what diameter, it has 20" on now. Just don't like the more wheel than tire look. So maybe 16-18s x 8. Someone on this thread mentioned they should be hub centric also, correct? Not sure what options are available for this truck.

 

[ncsumd]

If the center bore of the wheel fits tight and centers the wheel on your hub then it is a hub centric wheel and needs lug nuts with a washer of shoulder. If the center bore is loose around your hub it is a lug centric wheel and you will need the tapered lug nuts that will center your wheel up when you tighten the lugs. If the wheel is lug centric and you use the washer style lugs nuts it will waller out the lug holes and I’m sure the truck will not ride good.

Thanks. The center bore does not fit tight on the wheels I posted, or on the wheels currently on the truck. The current tire/wheels rub at full turn, and we just don't like them. That's why we started looking for replacements, and found the wheels I originally posted. We will keep on looking for correct wheels.