Better, but she still runs hot towing!

[Jim73]

OK, took the IDI to Grand Canyon last month towing my 5700 lb travel trailer, whole rig weighed maybe 14,000. Still cannot pull even a moderate desert grade without coolant temps creeping up past 230, fan roaring away, and if i don't watch coolant temp on the Isspro like a hawk, an eventual engine light. I'm forced to back off and lose revs and air flow, and resorting to running the heater full blast just to keep her out of meltdown, and I'm aware that I'm flirting with head gasket trouble. The after market radiator and all the other stuff (see signature) didn't get me to an adequately-cooled condition. The coolant has been maintained throughout the life of the truck. I wonder whether a custom five-row like icanfixall has is the next step. Or maybe a custom aluminum crossflow piece with factory hose locations? Doesn't seem unreasonable to me to expect to be able to pull a moderate grade with my truck and just shut off the A/C and not see this type of issue. My old Dakota gasser with a 318 and five speed towed the same trailer up the same grades in summer no problem.

Beginning to think that Ford just did a crappy job on radiator sizing - this thing is as close to Zero-timed as I could get it in the cooling system, but it just is not up to desert pulling so far. Anyone see something I'm missing? What have you done that helped cooling? JUst can't seem to reject enough BTUs in this thing...

Happy Fourth!

Jim

 

[Compu Doc]

I have an E350 ambulance that weighs 10K empty. I have towed 15K up the adirondacks without any overheating issues. Total weight was about 25,200 including me. The radiator I have is all stock. Have you done anything with the thermostat?. My Cadillac ambulance wouild heat up if i drove it far. Not enough to boil over but you could tell it was running hot especially up hils. That has a 4 row core in the radiator and I changed the thermostat and all was ok. I took the old thermostat put it in a pot of water on the stove with a temp gauge and at 195 it just cracked open. At a full boil it did not open any further. It should have been wide open at a full boil. if you havent changed yours then I would take the one you have and test it as I did with mine.

 

[Mont91]

Some stats are bad out of the box. Seems a good starting point.

 

[Compu Doc]

Some stats are bad out of the box. Seems a good starting point.

Thats why whenever I install a new thermostat I always test it first using the above method. I would rather have it fail in a pot of water than in an engine.

 

[flybear]

I just went through all this also.......Get the factory thermostat from Ford!!! I had problems with several others, including NAPA's. They later checked and said their computer system had the wrong recommendation. I also did the water pump and outlet while I was there, but I'm sure the problem was an incorrect thermostat.

 

[Jim73]

Sorry, guys, should've included the new factory t-stat in the sig. It controls to a hair over 200 degrees per the Isspro under no towing load and passed a hot water test, opening at a shade under 198, wide open by 210 - I installed it at the same time icanfixall helped me with everything else. I really tried to use Ford parts whenever possible. The truck is EGT limited rather than coolant temp limited towing at moderate ambient temperatures, say under 95, but take her into real desert heat (which I need to be able to tow through to reach most favorite destinations) and hit any extended grade and the party is over. I just don't reject enough heat under those conditions with my overhauled stock cooling.

Not sure the Adirondacks have the same type of summer temp/grade combinations as the desert southwest, Compu Doc. An extra ten or twelve degrees ambient makes a huge difference in the behavior of my IDI, which is why I specualte that the system just isn't physically capable of dealing with my tow conditions, which are fairly extreme.

BTW, went to a fully-external thermostatically regulated trans cooler setup to remove a little heat load from the radiator. I've thought about a big engine oil cooler too, but think better heat rejection from the radiator is a more likely solution.

Jim

 

[sassyrel]

jim--have you had the rad rodded--or is it a new rad--and i wonder if its the heavy one--ive towed on hot days with mine--and the needle never moved--not desert--but hot iowa and humidity

 

[rubberfish]

Is it possible that the fan went back on incorrectly at some time?
Won't be the first time that's happened to somebody.

I hope you have better luck than my ex BIL with his Jeep.
Every time they took it out of town it'd overheat.
They replaced just about everything they could think of.
He should have kept it for another year or two.
Another $million and it would have been all good.
I've had some troubles with "Stant" thermostats.
Some are good, some are ****. Good luck.

 

[SKimballC]

I was thinking about this while crossing western CO, Utah, and Idaho a couple weeks ago. Not towing, but the truck was packed to the gills. My EGT's really made the engine temps soar up the many LONG grades, but the highest temp I saw was 230*. If I had a trailer I suspect I may have had some overheating issues. I had to turn the fuel down in the Rockies to be able to keep it under control more easily.

 

[MIDNIGHT RIDER]

If you are having over-heating troubles, it AIN'T the Ford diesel radiator.

I tow(ed) VERY heavy, with the old 6.9, and now with the 5.9.

Big gooseneck livestock trailers, lots of times 15 big cows averaging around 1500 to 1600 each, and the naked truck weighs in at 9800 on the scales, not counting trailer, cows, extra junk.

Up hill and down, in Georgia heat, or across the Divide, A/C on MAX, I have never, ever, experienced even a rise in temperature.

The most likely culprit, in an overheating issue, is the fan-clutch.

Either find a direct-drive fan hub from an International truck application, or do like I have done dozens of times and PIN the clutch, thus making it direct-drive.

Your over-heating problems will then fade away.

I have never noticed a loss of power or mileage from changing a clutch-fan to direct-drive.

Think about it, when you need power the most, that fan had better be engaged.


One other thing:

Check your engine/injector-pump timing.

Advanced timing can cause over-heating issues.

To cool things down, slightly RETARDED timing is best.

 

[vail54]

Not to sure where to start some of these fords run hot I bought mine new and it has heating issues from the non turboed state till now I'm in the process of tring to correct this myself right now. I just replaced the radiator with an oem type with the agreement with the guy he would build me one and credit that cost to the new one. Well as it goes he just built me a radiator that is supposed to have more cooling than a 5 core (his words) its 4 row 5/8 tube about a heavy son of a gun any way just put it in and took a short trip seems a lot better will know in a couple weeks I'm going on a longer trip and more mountains I know what your talking about desert heat it was around 110-112 that day and I had my 5er and other gear. will try to let you know more as I learn a little more I also switched to the hayden fan clutch seems to come in 6-8* quicker as best I can tell.
Sorry this was so long good luck ohh not sure of the sig thing mine is a 91 cc drw zf 5.

 

[dwaymar]

Midnight Rider how did you go about pinning the fan clutch i live in the heart of the heat in az and i am thinking of the same thing

thanks
Dave

 

[82F100SWB]

Strange you're having heating issues, the rad definitely isn't too small, provided you have the deep/narrow one, not the LD cooling short wide that fits in a gasser rad support. Either one is larger than what you'll find in front of a Cummins in a Dodge.
I'd look hard at your fan clutch, mind you, in cooler temps(mid 70's-low 80's) I can run 20,000 + GCWR with a fan clutch that doesn't lock up and the a/c cranked with no heating issues so long as I have some speed on, it will heat crawling around in 1st gear.

 

[Jim73]

Fan clutch

Well, I replaced the fan clutch at the same time I went through the rest of the system as the old one was definitely NOT engaging - there is very little doubt when it engages, that fan roar is pretty obvious, and there is a slight dropoff in power. I suppose it could be slipping more than optimum and I'd have no way of knowing, but it's definitely coming on. Per the sig, a Motorcraft, not aftermarket, clutch, not quite a year old now, but only about 4000 miles on it. I know some guys have mentioned an aftermarket/custom clutch that kicks in at a lower temp - anyone have a supplier name & contact info? Thought about running that one down last year, but thought I'd be replacing the whole system and the stocker should be fine.

Yes, I have the deeper radiator, the new one being a four row with higher fin count than the original.

The timing issue is intriguing, Midnight Rider - I ought to get her over to Diesel Tune and cover that base. I've put a lot of time and effort into this truck and I want to keep it as my family tow vehicle, but if she won't cool, she'll have to go. I am ashamed to admit never getting her properly timed since getting her two years back...

It's frustrating having it feel like it is almost cooling well enough. I am interested in anybody who had custom radiators built. I might have access to some guys who are off-road racers and willing to tap into their fab experience for me - they think I ought to custom-fab an aluminum crossflow piece with a custom electric fan and shroud arrrangement, but that will cost and I'm then off into non-standard experimental land.

 

[FordGuy100]

It's frustrating having it feel like it is almost cooling well enough. I am interested in anybody who had custom radiators built. I might have access to some guys who are off-road racers and willing to tap into their fab experience for me - they think I ought to custom-fab an aluminum crossflow piece with a custom electric fan and shroud arrrangement, but that will cost and I'm then off into non-standard experimental land.

A custom aluminum radiator/electric fan might do it for you but that will cost you an arm and a leg like you stated. I know that Flex-a-light offers a fan that will flow good enough for "diesel applications of up to 18,000 GVW. It will flow up to 5500 CFM's, its there part #270 puller, 280 puller, 282 puller, 285 puller, and 290 puller. But they cost anywhere from $550-650. And the fan doesnt even have a very high GVW rating. Maybe you should look at something like a cowl hood or even scoops if your into that stuff.