typ4 cam installation

[JSVD]

I'm doing a bunch of work on my truck because i'm fixing an external head gasket leak. One of the things will be a typ4 cam. I see a lot of theads talking about the cam, but few about actually istalling it. I'd like to keep the block in the truck (s1600 so there's a lot of room) will this be possible? Can i re-use the cam bearings? lifters? They only have 80,000 miles. Any tips? or a writeup on this?

Thanks,

Jared

 

[OLDBULL8]

Why would it be any different than a OEM cam. Just gotta line up the timing marks and make sure it's on the compression stroke TDC #1. It's just a different grind.

 

[racer30]

You can use the same lifters just make sure they are not pumped up when you install the rockers.

 

[wildman7798]

The standard top end rules would apply to keep your parts matched where they came from. Rockers, pushrods and lifters should go back to the same place they came from. I usually take a piece of cardboard and auger the size hole ahead of time and then label front, back, left, right or the firing order, cylinder number. Some guys make a quick parts tray from wood. Either way just keep stuff in order and clean.

 

[icanfixall]

The biggest issue I see is the front of the cam. Theres plenty of parts that needs to be switched over. Its not just a gear. There is the lift pump lobe. The thrust ring and keeper. Then there is the gear itself. I would suggest replacing the gear if you find the old gear has 2 drilled and tapped holes in it. Thats the older gear that had a balance issue. So our engines vibrate when they idle. You can fell it come and go at about every 7 seconds. Its not a bad thing but it is annoying to many like me..

 

[jaluhn83]

No reason you can't do it in truck, just got to take everything off to get access to the front of the engine, rockers and lifters, then have enough room in front to get cam in and out.

One concern would be getting the cams in and out without dragging on the bearings. Usually on a fresh motor it's on the stand and upside down so you can reach between the webs and support both ends - can't do that in frame. Probably want to figure out some sort of a handle to attach to the front of the cam so you have some leverage.

Reusing bearings and lifters should be fine as long as they're in good shape. Cam bearings are typically low wear items. Lifters do wear out, so if you can I would replace them anyway - much easier to do when it's all apart then find one's shot and have to do it all over again later. Just my $0.02 though.

Al, Where do you get the gear from?

 

[icanfixall]

Al??? Hmmm. Anyway. The gear can be bought thru many places Nappa is just one of them. Ford or International will have them too but you need a buttload o money to buy theirs. They do come up but not very often on ebay.

 

[riotwarrior]

K will throw in my 2CW here..

If you have the head off take the second one off too...

I'd buy, rent, borrow, beg, ahem abscond, what ever it takes...to get a valve spring compressor and check valves for guide wear while head is off and replace seals while at it if guides in good condition.

If not well guess it's time for a valve job then.

Just me but it's what I'd do for certain....especially after my catastrophic failure I recently had!

Just sayin..knowledge empowers owners and gives peace of mind

Al

 

[riotwarrior]

Al, Where do you get the gear from?

Al??? Hmmm. Anyway. The gear can be bought thru many places Nappa is just one of them. Ford or International will have them too but you need a buttload o money to buy theirs. They do come up but not very often on ebay.

I gotta say, that's one of the biggest compliments I can ever get...to be confused with Gary...hmmm...

TEe Hee hee... Al Icanfixall2?

 

[jayro88]

When you do the install take alot of pics and make a "How To" thread. I have done cams a number of times before, but they were all in OHC engines which makes it very easy.

 

[icanfixall]

There is a cam installation tool made just for this. I think I have it but will have to check my Rotunda tool kit. BTW that small little allen head screw in the front of the cam gear is torqued to 15 lbs. If you want to make the assembly go easier warm up all the parts that have to be pressed on to 250 degreesF. Not much higher than that. Then have something ready to incourge it to press on if it stops sliding on easily. The wear ring thrust collar has a spec too. The end play os 0.002 to 0.009. The thrust flange thickness is 0.4305 to 0.4355. .

 

[Fozz]

It's not a quick swap, I'm in the middle of it right now and my engine is on a stand. You have to pull the intake, remove water pump and front plate and all the valve trained mentioned above. You need a puller (inside pull) for the harmonic balancer - inside pull so you don't ruin it, then another puller to pull the camshaft gear (can use the same puller if reversible (inside/outside) use outer pull), or use a puller that will utilize the threaded two holes in the cam gear (Gary talked about above), that's what I used. Then you can unbolt the 2 bolts for the plate that keeps the cam in place and pull the cam out. But then you have to pull the fuel pump lobe and the thrust flange (I think it's called?) before you can get the plate off to put on your new cam. I used a bearing splitter (I think that's what he called it) to pull those two, because there's not much room to grab with a standard puller. Then you have to press the thrust flange and fuel pump lobe on the new cam. I am working in the auto hobby shop on base, and I got everything pulled off. But their hydraulic press was broken and they were missing some parts to the one puller that I was going to reverse to push/press the two lobes back on. I think I'm going to take it to a machine shop and have them press them back on, then I can start putting the engine back together. With work, I can't get back to it until Wednesday anyway.

 

[icanfixall]

Whatever you do don't loose the small gear woodruff key. Thats a special order part and you will not find it any any stores. The shop that reground my cam lost that key and I had to special order it from Ford.. Kinda pissed me off too cause it really slowed down the cam job when I rebuilt my engine..

 

[JSVD]

The biggest issue I see is the front of the cam. Theres plenty of parts that needs to be switched over. Its not just a gear. There is the lift pump lobe. The thrust ring and keeper. Then there is the gear itself. I would suggest replacing the gear if you find the old gear has 2 drilled and tapped holes in it. Thats the older gear that had a balance issue. So our engines vibrate when they idle. You can fell it come and go at about every 7 seconds. Its not a bad thing but it is annoying to many like me..

Thanks for the tip on the gear. I'm going to take a look at the cam when it's out and see if replacing all that is something i'm comfortable with. If not i'll take it to a machinist and have them press it all on and off.

No reason you can't do it in truck, just got to take everything off to get access to the front of the engine, rockers and lifters, then have enough room in front to get cam in and out.

One concern would be getting the cams in and out without dragging on the bearings. Usually on a fresh motor it's on the stand and upside down so you can reach between the webs and support both ends - can't do that in frame. Probably want to figure out some sort of a handle to attach to the front of the cam so you have some leverage.

Reusing bearings and lifters should be fine as long as they're in good shape. Cam bearings are typically low wear items. Lifters do wear out, so if you can I would replace them anyway - much easier to do when it's all apart then find one's shot and have to do it all over again later. Just my $0.02 though.

Al, Where do you get the gear from?

I was thinking about doing the lifters... just wasn't sure if it was worth it with only 80k on them... proabaly will end up getting new ones though. I don't have much ability to fabicate at the moment. The truck recieving the swap is also my house... which i'll be living in while doing the work. Itll be parked in an empty barn.

K will throw in my 2CW here..

If you have the head off take the second one off too...

I'd buy, rent, borrow, beg, ahem abscond, what ever it takes...to get a valve spring compressor and check valves for guide wear while head is off and replace seals while at it if guides in good condition.

If not well guess it's time for a valve job then.

Just me but it's what I'd do for certain....especially after my catastrophic failure I recently had!

Just sayin..knowledge empowers owners and gives peace of mind

Al

I don't know much about this, but will plan on doing it as i'm pretty sure my other truck (isuzu pup) needs some valve work. I

When you do the install take alot of pics and make a "How To" thread. I have done cams a number of times before, but they were all in OHC engines which makes it very easy.

I'll be taking photos and writing both for myself and for a few different how-to's i guess. I can't gaurantee anything as this is by far the biggest project i've undertaken... but i've done some walkthoughs in the past so hopefully I can get something together

There is a cam installation tool made just for this. I think I have it but will have to check my Rotunda tool kit. BTW that small little allen head screw in the front of the cam gear is torqued to 15 lbs. If you want to make the assembly go easier warm up all the parts that have to be pressed on to 250 degreesF. Not much higher than that. Then have something ready to incourge it to press on if it stops sliding on easily. The wear ring thrust collar has a spec too. The end play os 0.002 to 0.009. The thrust flange thickness is 0.4305 to 0.4355. .

If you or anyone else have one i'd love to rent it. I'm in White Salmon, WA so if anyone close has one please let me know.

It's not a quick swap, I'm in the middle of it right now and my engine is on a stand. You have to pull the intake, remove water pump and front plate and all the valve trained mentioned above. You need a puller (inside pull) for the harmonic balancer - inside pull so you don't ruin it, then another puller to pull the camshaft gear (can use the same puller if reversible (inside/outside) use outer pull), or use a puller that will utilize the threaded two holes in the cam gear (Gary talked about above), that's what I used. Then you can unbolt the 2 bolts for the plate that keeps the cam in place and pull the cam out. But then you have to pull the fuel pump lobe and the thrust flange (I think it's called?) before you can get the plate off to put on your new cam. I used a bearing splitter (I think that's what he called it) to pull those two, because there's not much room to grab with a standard puller. Then you have to press the thrust flange and fuel pump lobe on the new cam. I am working in the auto hobby shop on base, and I got everything pulled off. But their hydraulic press was broken and they were missing some parts to the one puller that I was going to reverse to push/press the two lobes back on. I think I'm going to take it to a machine shop and have them press them back on, then I can start putting the engine back together. With work, I can't get back to it until Wednesday anyway.

Thanks for the tips on the pullers. Definitally helps to have the right ones and i'll be renting/borrowing all tools like that.

Whatever you do don't loose the small gear woodruff key. Thats a special order part and you will not find it any any stores. The shop that reground my cam lost that key and I had to special order it from Ford.. Kinda pissed me off too cause it really slowed down the cam job when I rebuilt my engine..

noted. I'll be making a thread when i start this all to keep everryone posted

 

[icanfixall]

You can reach in thru the cam gear to get at the 2 bolts thats holding the cam thrust plate in the engine. That plate holds the cam in the block. they are either 7/16 or 1/2 inch hex head bolts. Remove those and the complete cam and thrust and gear come out as one piece. Then its seperating the parts so they can be installed on the new cam. If you have nothing to remove the cam gear and parts this might be the best way to take the comlete cam to a machinst and have them remove and install parts.