turned up ip

[jtate]

i have a question about an ip. if the pump was turned up too much by the previous owner could it cause the engine to lack in power? my truck is horrible on fuel and when your going up an incline it pours the smoke out and has a constant trail of smoke out the exhaust at idle. i just dont think this truck should be burning $30.00 worth of diesel on a 40 mile round trip . what do you guys think?

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

Yeah, if it is getting more fuel than it can burn - more than the available air will allow to burn, then it will smoke a lot, use a lot of fuel, and performance will suffer.

If you turn it down, turn it only 1 flat of the allen wrench at a time to fine-tune the fuel delivery. You want as much fuel as you can burn with the quantity of air it is taking in - but no more.

 

[jtate]

thanks cheeper for the info, but i have more question though. did the 85 6.9 have the external fuel screw on the ip? i know the po changed the ip but dont know if he put the right one on, what would be the model of the ip for a 6.9 with a auto trans?

 

[Cheaper Jeeper]

thanks cheeper for the info, but i have more question though. did the 85 6.9 have the external fuel screw on the ip? i know the po changed the ip but dont know if he put the right one on, what would be the model of the ip for a 6.9 with a auto trans?

Not sure of the model number, but I can tell you that the external fuel screw was not a feature of the original pump on an 85. Seems like I read somewhere that the external fuel screw first showed up on the pumps installed with the factory turbo.

 

[jtate]

thats kind of what i was thinking. i know sure as day mine has the external screw on it and am wondering if its the wrong pump, and if its my whole problem with the fuel and smoke.

 

[Diesel JD]

I think the timing is probably way off. Most people don't know enough to turn up the fuel on these trucks. Unless this truck has a turbo and all I doubt the fuel has been turned up. Especially since you say the performance sucks. Too much fuel usually means it runs great but over pollutes and fuel mileage suffers. What you're decribing sounds like very advanced timing... I wonder if the gear jumped a tooth when he had it out. Really the model of IP doesn't much matter as long as its a Db2 pump(the only one that will fit) the only ones different enough to mention are the Ford factory turbo calibrated pump which does have an external as well as an internal fuel screw and then the high altitude pump( to reduce fuel delivery...but once that max fuel screw is turned all bets are off) and of course our own Mel Agne offers the Moose pump through his stanadyne dealer and Ken from DPS has his version of a turbo cal pump...but I'm pretty sure that you have a pump that will work, its just a matter of getting it timed properly. Try getting the marks on the flange of the pump and the timing cover lined up +- a dime's thickness either way. You are now static timed...and you'll run at least OK as long as the gear hasn't jumped and the pump wasn't bad out of the box. If the PO took the gear cover off when he changed the injector pump, it probably has jumped timing. There are references here to the appropriate procedure to get the gears lined back up without taking the whole front of the motor off or using one of those funky dental mirrors to try to see the marks. I personally believe that the calibration should be left stock or very nearly so in a stock engine, if you have a turbo, or some other mods to give it more air you should burn as much fuel as you can without creating damaging exhaust temps or over polluting with smoke.

 

[jtate]

ive checked all the marks to see if they were off and nothing, everything is dead on. ive also tried advancing and retarding it and it doesnt really make a difference in the way it smokes. i can gain a little more power out of it though. i ran it a dimes width for awhile and now have both marks lined up. the fuel mileage realy sucks on this truck. if it burns this much fuel empty id hate to see how much fuel its going to burn with my fifth wheel camper on it. with the way it runs (power) i dought i could get 55mph out of it.

 

[sootman73]

do you happen to have a pyrometer on it? it would be nice to know what the egt's are. they could give you and indication as to whether you have too much fuel, improper timing or neither. you may have a fuel leak somewhere too. maybe even a bad sending unit makin it look like you are using that much fuel.

 

[Diesel JD]

Its true that supposedly you need to run a turbo pump(with the external fuel screw) with the G code injectors, but I'm not really sure that is actually correct info. You say you checked the timing marks but did you check the timing gear?

 

[Mr_Roboto]

"Turning up" the pump won't affect anything at idle. More fuel at idle simple increases the RPM, since our engines are unthrottled.

Your problem is unburnt or poorly burnt fuel, which may be caused by incorrect timing or other issues.

 

[jtate]

Its true that supposedly you need to run a turbo pump(with the external fuel screw) with the G code injectors, but I'm not really sure that is actually correct info. You say you checked the timing marks but did you check the timing gear?

ive checked all the marks and everything is right. i did do a top end gasket change after i bought the truck and know first hand that they are on. and the truck still runs the same after the head gaskets (lack of power and realy bad fuel consumption).

 

[jtate]

do you happen to have a pyrometer on it? it would be nice to know what the egt's are. they could give you and indication as to whether you have too much fuel, improper timing or neither. you may have a fuel leak somewhere too. maybe even a bad sending unit makin it look like you are using that much fuel.

no sootman i dont have a pyrometer, that was future mods. im just trying to get this thing running a little more fuel economic. you know i forgot all about it and was going to ask questions about it and my mind got occupied on something else. one night i was coming home and i saw a spark come out the exhaust pipe. what do you think would have caused that?

 

[Mr_Roboto]

ive checked all the marks and everything is right. i did do a top end gasket change after i bought the truck and know first hand that they are on. and the truck still runs the same after the head gaskets (lack of power and realy bad fuel consumption).

You need to "time" the motor. The marks are only a base reference point (starting point).

 

[jtate]

ive asked around shop after shop and nobody ever heard of a luminosity probe.

 

[Diesel JD]

True, but even static timed it should run well enough not to cook the engine and get decent economy, not too much smoke. I have a feeling something isn't right about the fuel system or the motor or the timing gears are not lined up. Most shops don't have the timing equipment for these engines anymore. The tools are expensive and hard to replace if damaged. Many shops are just lazy. They mostly get away with it because being experienced they know how an IDI should sound. But for most of us the tools are a big help, and even someone with a good ear can be off a degree or two, not enough to hurt anything, but enough to make a difference in economy and EGT.