Starting Issue.. Update

[MandolinMan]

Hello all,

I posted a few weeks asking for advice on where to begin with starting issue I was dealing with. Here's the link to that forum:http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?65611-Help-with-a-Starting-Issue

I replaced the glow plugs and now my wait to start light stays on for 8-10 seconds, but it still won't start. There also is not the clicking that was present before I changed the glow plugs. I should be able to hear the controller clicking on and off right?

I needed the truck yesterday so I disconnected the glow plugs and used a small shot of starting fluid and it started up fine. Also if the block heater is plugged in it will start up within a few seconds without starting fluid. This leads me to think that the problem is still glow plug related, I'm just not sure what to replace next? Relay, controller, etc.

Oh yeah, when I disconnected the glow plugs the clicking sound from under the hood returned. Not sure what this means but thought it might be worth mentioning.

I'm completely new to diesels and am reading the forums to learn more as I have time, I'm just really busy and just don't have the time to wade through dozens of forums. So I apologize if this has been addressed before.

Just need some advice on where to go next, Thanks.

 

[icanfixall]

Welcome to the forum first off. Now when you say you disabled the glow plugs and the clicking started happening again just how did you disconnect the plugs. Another issue with our plug system is the engine main wire harness plug connecter found on the passenger side of the engine. Just find the electrical line feeding power to the engine and see the main plug. Its about 1 inch wide and 3 inches long. At one end of that is the 2 yellow wires that feeds power to the glow plug controller. Ford engineers found out 2 small wires are cheaper than one big wire to handle the load of the controller but. They failed to consider the small pins in that plug connecter. They get dirty and corroded. Then heat builds and the plug melts or worse. Starts a fire. Look it over but better yet. Bypass it and tun a 6 gauge wire from the fender solenoid directly to the controller. then never have that melted plug issue again. A few years ago I started my engine and saw smoke flow out from that side of the hood. Shut down the engine thinking I burned up the starter but nope. Started easy. So I went exploring and found a hot melted plug. I fixed that right quick and in a hurry. Used audio stereo speaker wire found in any stereo shop.

 

[riotwarrior]

Hello all,

I posted a few weeks asking for advice on where to begin with starting issue I was dealing with. Here's the link to that forum:http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?65611-Help-with-a-Starting-Issue

I replaced the glow plugs and now my wait to start light stays on for 8-10 seconds, but it still won't start. There also is not the clicking that was present before I changed the glow plugs. I should be able to hear the controller clicking on and off right?

Ok what GP's did you get to replace the ones in there? It shouldn't matter if new but would be good to know anyway. The general consensus here is to go with BERU from Ford or IHI only, the can be had online too but BERU are the preferred GP's

I needed the truck yesterday so I disconnected the glow plugs and used a small shot of starting fluid and it started up fine. Also if the block heater is plugged in it will start up within a few seconds without starting fluid. This leads me to think that the problem is still glow plug related, I'm just not sure what to replace next? Relay, controller, etc.

So long as no power to GP's crack in a can is ok in moderate use.

Based on the fact the block heater allows the the engine to start without crack, I'd say you are experiencing a GP related issue still.

Did you check the power to the GP's themselves? what voltage are they getting?

Look on the LH/Passengers fender for a large squarish/rectangular plug about 3/4" x 1 1/4" it feeds the GP setup. Corrosion on the contacts of the two large yellow wires at the connection can get bad enough to melt the plug. Check that thoroughly. Some people bypass the two yellow wires with a 4gua wire from the solenoid on fender to the GP controller.

Low voltage to the GP's due to resistance or bad wiring can really wreak havoc on the starting of these trucks.

Oh yeah, when I disconnected the glow plugs the clicking sound from under the hood returned. Not sure what this means but thought it might be worth mentioning.

That sounds correct the controller is attempting to feed power and not able to and it's resistance based IIRC so no load it just is going on and off.

I'm completely new to diesels and am reading the forums to learn more as I have time, I'm just really busy and just don't have the time to wade through dozens of forums. So I apologize if this has been addressed before.

Just need some advice on where to go next, Thanks.

No worries, btw welcome to OB,

Al

 

[mblaney]

Can you get your hands on a clamp-on current meter? Google Fluke 36 to see what one looks like. This is the best tool to tell you what is or isn't working because it tells you the current draw for the whole system (measure around the large conductor at the controller), or for each GP (measure around the wire going to each). I don't remember exact numbers (I have recorded complete measurements as described for my truck when it was brand new) but I think the controller should be putting out 350 - 400 amps from cold, current drops off as the GP's heat up. Each glow plug should be drawing (350 / 8) 40 - 50 amps (from cold).

If you don't have a clamp-on then do this (note, get help; you want to do the measurements at the initial key-on when GP's are coldest):

1. key off: with negative meter lead to battery ground, measure to supply side of controller relay (should be battery voltage)
2. Same as #1 but turn key on. this is your supply voltage to the controller under load
3. same as #1 but measure on the other relay post that goes to the GP's. This measurement when subtracted from the #2 measurement is the voltage drop across the relay. Should be very low; if not then your relay is shot (see my signature for a quality fix).
4. Measure voltage to each glow plug in turn. Should be the same as the voltage measured in #3
5. Switch to Ohms; measure the bullet end of each GP to the block for resistance. I think they should be close to 1 Ohm each. Used up GP's will read higher, blown ones will read open (infinity).

These tests won't replace some of the information you get from the clamp meter but should be enough to steer you to the issue. Just because voltage is there doesn't mean it will be there when a heavy current is drawn (as in the poor connections already described). The current meter will immediately tell you the where the fault is.

I can provide real numbers for these measurements when I get home if they are of use to you.

 

[MandolinMan]

Thanks for your replies.

I installed new motorcraft/beru ZD9 plugs ( The plugs I removed were champions, every one was swollen)

By disconnecting the glow plugs I mean that I simply pulled the connecter at the top of each plug. I did this because I had read that using starting fluid with glow plugs connected will destroy them.

I don't own a voltage tester myself, but I know my brother has one I could borrow. I'll try to do the tests mentioned above and report back with what I find.

 

[mblaney]

The problem using starting fluid with GP's operating is that you never know when ignition is going to happen... lotsa bad things going on.

 

[riotwarrior]

Ya hot GP and starting fluid in intake can make one hell of a boom boom and ya...make a bad day badder really really fast!