My first filtration rig... wmo processor

fields_mj · Jul 10, 2013

And then there's all the electrical connections, and trying find/fab a way to get my tranny to match up to what ever differential I end up dropping it into. And then there's the time issue. As it is now, I'm up before 5 to make it to work, and I don't come in for dinner until 8:30 or later. I'd love to do the swap if I had the time, place, and equipment. Just not in the cards right now.

AcIdBuRn02ZTS · Jul 10, 2013

I hear ya... hopefully you'll find a solution. I've heard people are having good luck running wmo in the newer 7.3 PS too

fields_mj · Jul 10, 2013

Yeah, I don't see any reason that it can't be done on anything built from '03 back. I seem to remember one guy who was running it on a '12, which surprised me a lot. Don't remember where I saw that at though.

Kalashnikov · Jul 15, 2013

Sounds to me like a first gen Superduty crew cab 7.3 would fit the bill. They are a little roomier and more comfortable than the OBS trucks but a little newer and less beat sometimes. I'd stick with a 7.3 PSD if you're looking for a newer truck.

fields_mj · Jul 16, 2013

Yeah, but the maint cost of a PSD scares the daylights out of me. It's pushing me over to the cummins.

79jasper · Jul 16, 2013

Uh, ta hell are you talking about "maintenance cost????"

How is it different than any other Diesel?
Especially a cummins?

What's a quality set of injectors going for?
Injector pump?

I can get quality upgrades injectors on my psd for $1150.
HPOP $700, again upgraded.

To be fair (apples to apples) we're talking a electric version, not the mechanical pump.

fields_mj · Jul 17, 2013

Honestly, I haven't looked into it a lot on the newer trucks. I'm going mostly off of what I'm being told by guys here locally. A good friend of mine is a machinest at one of the top diesel shops in the area, and he's commented that the repair bill on a PSD is always significantly more than that of a Cummins or Duramax. I've read posts of people having to dump over $3K to have the injection system serviced on a PSD. Last time I looked into it (it's been a few years now), PSD injectors were running $300 ea for a decent reman. I'm not sure how the Cummins counterparts compair because I never had to look into it. What I do remember from my past life was that the Cummins were a lot simpler to work on. Either way, I've got a fair amount of research to do before I give any serious consideration to a new purchase.

Kalashnikov · Jul 19, 2013

7.3 vs 6.0/6.4 PSD cost is a lot different. 7.3 PSD are one of the most reliable systems. The HPOP lasts as long time as do injectors. IDI vs PSD you'll spend at least $600 on IP and injectors in what could be only 100k miles. Plus labor of course. PSD you might spend 1800 in 200k miles, most likely more. My PSD has 260k on stock injectors and probably the rest of the fuel system.

SO miles vs miles you'll spend 1200+ on parts for an IDI and have to do it twice vs $1800 on a PSD and have to do it once The PSD will probably start much better than an IDI and in the end you'll get more miles out of the bottom end and not have to worry about having SCAs in your coolant with a PSD. Plsu there's more aftermarket for PSDs, more power from the start, and you'll probably get better MPG doing it. Now I'm starting to convince myself!

fields_mj · Jul 19, 2013

My stock pump and injectors were replaced at 190K, and I really didn't notice any change in performance or millage so they were probably still fine. I gave $300 for a new pump, $300 for a full set of matched injectors, and almost $400 for the labor, so it was around half what your PSD cost you

I know what you're saying though. I'm just in a boat where when I'm buying something I always plan for the worst so I assume the fuel system will need replaced. I've spoken to several people who owned both of the 7.3's and I'm having a hard time remembering any of them that liked the PSD over a turbo'd IDI. As far as SCA's, I don't add them. I buy Fleet Charge from TSC for the same price as any other coolant off the shelf. My NA 7.3 is a little weak at the top end, but I really don't have any need for 400 HP. The books say I'm at 185 HP, and if that's true, even pulling a 10K trailer, 250 HP should be enough to get me up to hwy speeds in a timely fashion, and if I'm pulling a 10K load very often I'm going to need some serious mods to the transmission. At the very least, I would want split gears. Either way, with a little work an IDI can reliably hit 300 hp and still keep the maint cost dirt cheap. It would never wind a truck pull, but when it comes to getting the work done it's hard to beat. Millage isn't much of a factor since I blend WVO or WMO (depending on the season and availability), blend it with 20% D2,K1 or RUG and feed it out of my rear tank.

Having said all that, the brown cancer is getting pretty bad in every IDI that I see. Mine looks okay on the outside (cancer wise anyway), but not nearly as good underneith. 20 years of beating around the back roads has taken it's toll on the supsension to the point that there's just not that much room left to bring the alignment back in. Both Stock and Aftermarket parts are getting a little harder to find for the IDI. The 7.3 is certainly the best PSD that Navistar ever made. Just with they had made them a few years longer. I remember the '04 and '05 trucks having some signifiant improvements to the interior and possibly the suspensions. I've known more than a few people who have gone away from Diesel trucks due to the increase in maint cost on the newer Fords (6.0 and after), and I can't really blame them. If I had the choise of buying any of the 7.3s brand new, I would take an early '94 turbo with no regrets. Since this isn't an ideal world, I've got to factor in the age of what I'm buying along with the cost of maintianing it. I've always believed that the Cummins had better designs and built better engines than Navistar (impossible to design and build a V8 that's better than an I6), but I've never been impressed by Dodge trucks when it comes to being a work horse. In the end, the differences may actually be splitting hairs, and it probably has more to do with the fact that I've been driving Ford trucks since before I was driving period, and it's just hard to leave what you know even if you really don't know it as well as you think you do.

79jasper · Jul 19, 2013

Also with the psd, you can have custom tunes for running waste oils or whatever. Which gets you your best bang for the buck.

The 300hp you speak of with the idi, how much $$$$$$$ will it take you to get there?

fields_mj · Jul 19, 2013

Yeah, but I don't need any tunes

I'm not sure what it would take to get 300 hp. Probably a fair ammount. As I understand it, the IDI will actually put out more than that, but that seems to be as far as the stock head studs will safely go. You'd have to start with a turbo, new exhaust, probably a different set of injectors, and maybe an intercooler. Either way, it's more than I'm willing to spend. For 95% of my driving, I'm perfectly happy with what I have now. For the other 5% of the time, the turbo and the associated exhaust work would get me there. That 5% isn't worth the $1K that it would take to add the turbo, let alone open up the exhaust.

Well, now that I've hi-jacked this thread and taken it totally off course, I suppose I should just sit down and be quiet.... :backoff

79jasper · Jul 19, 2013

My point is, it'd take a lot more $$$$$ to get what you want out of a idi than a PSD.

AcIdBuRn02ZTS · Nov 17, 2013

Been a while but figured I would update...

Since a friend of mine picked up a 93 f250 with an NA 7.3, Ive gotten back into wmo a good bit. He is a member here now (A48WillyzGuy)

Anyways, since we are working together, it has cut cost of getting things setup. We just ordered a 'fuge from PA Biodiesel which should be here early this week. Also got everything plumbed up and built a feed pump for the 'fuge out of an old 1/6hp delco motor and a ps pump from a ford focus I had laying in the garage. I know the power rating on the pump is a bit lower then most use, so we geared it down... running a 1.5" pulley on the motor and a 3.5" pulley on the pump and it seems to flow well.

Wont know pressure output until the centrifuge shows up.

I also picked up a DEF pump/nozzle station that had never been used... food grade drum, stainless fillrite filter assembly, stainless fill-rite gear pump, def rated hose and nozzle all for $150 which will all be used as our w80 filling station.

I also had a local farmer donate ~55 gallons of dieseline... the local co-op filled their ag tanks backwards which lead to two of his trucks being filled with the wrong fuels... so they pumped it out and gave it to us.. figured we can blend it on the heavy side and be safe with it.

Anyways, I'll get some updated pictures up of the system and what have you soon.. hopefully the centrifuge gets here soon as I'm chomping at the bit to get it setup.

More to come soon
-Chris

AcIdBuRn02ZTS · Nov 19, 2013

Here are a few shots of our plumbing nightmare... lol