Has anyone implemented a Drive line brake on a NON-F-SUPERDUTY

[FORDF250HDXLT]

my recent acquisition of knowledge of the F-superduty drive line brake, i wanted to inquire about it.

I have an exhaust brake and want to keep it, so we will see what GV has to say about engine- braking/exhaust-braking.

The drive line brake wouldnt be replacing the drum assembly it would be in addition too.

Im hauling trucks of the same and greater weight with a towbar and wish to keep as much wear and tear off of the standard braking system as possible.

Yes a hydroboost is in my near future.

some times i just cant leave "good enough" alone, but..

a man never complained about having something and not needing it...

...when it comes to braking, if i have a problem...i might not be around after to complain about it haha (really though)

one cant be to safe

like the warden stated above (edit; or back a page) the f450 parking brake isn't for use in slowing you down.it's simply to hold the truck while in park/neutral.
iv tried testing it,in the event of a hydraulic failure,and the old gal would just go up in smoke long before it would ever stop the truck.

with an 87-97 f-super duty/f450,there is no backup stopping system.it's kinda scary.feed 'em the gears and pray i guess.

your on the right path with thinking hydroboost,first and foremost.

 

[jay22day]

thanks LCAM!

You really want to avoid using any friction-based brakes you may have till last possible moment,

completely agreed, the driveling brake was an emergency, last resort, "oh gawd were gonana DIE!!!" option in my mind ha

Btw you really should look into one of those systems RV folks use on their "toads", it applies the towed vehicle's service brakes very much like electric trailer brakes, not very useful when the "toad" is hydroboosted but if it has vacuum brakes the tow vehicle will supply vacuum for that and after calibrated properly it's a very nice setup.

Here in ohio towed vehicle braking isnt a requirement and those systems get expensive + install time (this is for vehicles i pick up to flip). Its not very appealing to me as i dont tow the same vehicle over and over, if i was coaching the same car or truck like alot of RV'ers do i would go that route.

 

[jay22day]

like the warden stated above (edit; or back a page) the f450 parking brake isn't for use in slowing you down.it's simply to hold the truck while in park/neutral.
iv tried testing it,in the event of a hydraulic failure,and the old gal would just go up in smoke long before it would ever stop the truck.

your on the right path with thinking hydroboost,first and foremost.

bahahaha so what you and warden are informing me of is that the drive line brake is nothing more than a glorified fog machine when your rolling?? well that clears that idea up quick haha

That electro magnetic setup sounds pretty damn cool though!!!!

now what comes to my mind is- is anyone familiar with the duce and 1/2 axles? those have a proper "drive line" brake on them.

Maybe someone makes a similar kit thats mechanical/ hydro like these rather than electro magnetic.

 

[Black dawg]

wouldnt a proper trailer be a better deal all around?

 

[The Warden]

bahahaha so what you and warden are informing me of is that the drive line brake is nothing more than a glorified fog machine when your rolling?? well that clears that idea up quick haha

That's the first time I've heard it described that way, but it sounds about right to me

That electro magnetic setup sounds pretty damn cool though!!!!

Not having driven one, I agree...sounds like it'll do a heck of a job of slowing you down. But, again, $$!!

now what comes to my mind is- is anyone familiar with the duce and 1/2 axles? those have a proper "drive line" brake on them.

Maybe someone makes a similar kit thats mechanical/ hydro like these rather than electro magnetic.

I don't know the 2 1/2 ton trucks very well, but I know that those Rockwell axles are massive...I'm guessing that, unless you fit the Rockwell axle under your truck as well, adapting the brake setup to your truck is not going to be practical unless you put the ROckwell axles under your truck (not uncommon for hardcore 4 wheelers to do, but I'm not sure how practical that would be for a street truck).

And, unfortunately, I don't really know of any aftermarket brake "kits" for these trucks. I think about the best you can do is hydroboost, an exhaust brake, and quality trailer brakes and controller...unless you want to get creative and do some fabrication, or shell out the $$ for an electromagnetic driveshaft brake. Yes, disc brake conversions exist for these trucks, but from my research, there are basically two designs...one should be large enough but you lose any parking brake function, and the other keeps the parking brake but is way too small for our trucks unless we're empty all the time.

 

[towcat]

*THIS* is a driveling brake. and yes. it's on a F350 4x4.
http://www.telmausa.com/

 

[jay22day]

Oh my guuuurd that thing looks pretty heavy duty and awesome!!!!!!

thanks towcat! much appreciated!

 

[The Warden]

*THIS* is a driveling brake. and yes. it's on a F350 4x4.
http://www.telmausa.com/

Is that the Spring Valley truck?

 

[towcat]

Is that the Spring Valley truck?

yes.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Here in ohio towed vehicle braking isnt a requirement and those systems get expensive + install time (this is for vehicles i pick up to flip). Its not very appealing to me as i dont tow the same vehicle over and over, if i was coaching the same car or truck like alot of RV'ers do i would go that route.

Legal requirements are one thing, being truly safe can be completely different... In an emergency situation the weight of whatever you're towing will push on the hitch hard, hitch being at the very end of the truck and weight transfer unloading the rear axle means you got increased force (your toad pushing you) trying to get the rear axle to slide off to the side and reduced force (traction) working hard to prevent that, add a bit of less-than-sticky pavement and bypassed RABS (cause people just love to mess with that) and you can be headed for the ditch before you even realized *** just happened.

One way to avoid that mess is to just tow with a very big truck. For our medium-duty anything 10k or less hanging off the rear bumper is a "meh, whatever" type of weight as far as the brakes are concerned. Additionally, being as heavy as it is, there's very little chance for the whole "tail wagging the dog" experience. For what you're doing, it seems to me it's time that you also stepped up to a bigger truck. If you want an IDI even a F-superduty will work good for you, with the added bonus that you can set it up so it looks like a pickup truck which will help you fly under the DOT radar if you so wish.

Or you can just do what Black Dawg suggested and equip yourself with a suitable trailer. Ohio is farm country, doubt anyone would give you a 2nd look if you start using a 14k goose for your vehicle transportation needs...

 

[Waystro]

Legal requirements are one thing, being truly safe can be completely different... In an emergency situation the weight of whatever you're towing will push on the hitch hard, hitch being at the very end of the truck and weight transfer unloading the rear axle means you got increased force (your toad pushing you) trying to get the rear axle to slide off to the side and reduced force (traction) working hard to prevent that, add a bit of less-than-sticky pavement and bypassed RABS (cause people just love to mess with that) and you can be headed for the ditch before you even realized *** just happened.

One way to avoid that mess is to just tow with a very big truck. For our medium-duty anything 10k or less hanging off the rear bumper is a "meh, whatever" type of weight as far as the brakes are concerned. Additionally, being as heavy as it is, there's very little chance for the whole "tail wagging the dog" experience. For what you're doing, it seems to me it's time that you also stepped up to a bigger truck. If you want an IDI even a F-superduty will work good for you, with the added bonus that you can set it up so it looks like a pickup truck which will help you fly under the DOT radar if you so wish.

Or you can just do what Black Dawg suggested and equip yourself with a suitable trailer. Ohio is farm country, doubt anyone would give you a 2nd look if you start using a 14k goose for your vehicle transportation needs...

I would rather see a vehicle on a Gooseneck than a Trailer that's not set up for heavy hauling.

 

[LCAM-01XA]

Well what I meant was that if you must flat-tow without "toad" brakes you can safely flat-tow heavy stuff if your prime mover is big enough, if you're limited in prime mover size for whatever reason (like CHP being our #1 fans ) then you really should get a trailer. Either way works as long as your brakes add up to or higher than your CGVW.

 

[dunk]

Just get a trailer with suitable brakes. Upgrade the rear drums to disks if you feel the factory setup is inadequate for the weight you run. I see no reason to add complexity and additional wear and failure points for something so simple as brakes.

 

[jay22day]

Just get a trailer with suitable brakes.

Its pretty obvious if i could splurge on a trailer i would, as towbar-ing is a cost effective solution to spending thousands on an equipments trailer. A little car trailer is not going to haul a 21+ ft long dually

Upgrade the rear drums to disks if you feel the factory setup is inadequate for the weight you run. I see no reason to add complexity and additional wear and failure points for something so simple as brakes.

Doesnt upgrading to discs deletes the provision for e-brakes and then requires a drive line brake?

The theory that running a trailer with the addition of brakes is going to get away from "added failure points" is somewhat contradicting, as your just moiving the possible failure points to the trailer instead of the truck. regardless a giant equipment trailer isnt an option at the moment but dont think it hasnt been desired.

 

[jay22day]

another thing about the towed vehicle braking is the vehicles i pick up, for instance my current truck, had no brakes when i pulled it, line was bad, a common thing in ohio haha