California ( and others ), RV's, and more laws...

[Nero]

To clarify, the CO2 isnt the problem. Its more so the NOX and particulate matter that is the problem. But even then, with DPFs and DEF on newer diesels, since 2017 its practically zero. Its just states being controlling buttheads.

 

[DaveBen]

I lived in Santa Ana (Disneyland) in 1957 and you could hardly see across the street it was so smoggy! We left Calif for Colorado in 1959. Lived in Colorado for four years and moved back to SoCal, Thousand Oaks in Ventura county. The air was getting better but by how much??? My family moved to the Bay Area, to the future Silicon Valley, in 1966. Norcal was almost smog free as I remember...

 

[KansasIDI]

Yes, although I have never experienced it, smog was a problem. Still is to a small extent. But, I feel like, after a while, maybe… after DPF, it’s gotten over the top. Possibly on the verge of scamminess… but that’s my speculation only. It’s up to interpretation mostly. And definitely a regional issue. AFAIK smog never has been a thing in Kansas. So my ‘speculation’ doesn’t work everywhere.

I need to remind myself, takes all kinds to make the world go round

I’ll be hard pressed to believe that DEF isn’t a scam though… IMO that’s where they took it too far.

 

[IDIBRONCO]

Yes, although I have never experienced it, smog was a problem. Still is to a small extent.

Some of it had/has to do with weather conditions. Sometimes, the air just likes to hit the mountains and sink down lower. That's when it's still an issue as far as I know. There's nothing that we can do to change that part. I saw smog over Denver a few years back and they Have pretty restrictive regulations too.

I feel like, after a while, maybe… after DPF, it’s gotten over the top. Possibly on the verge of scamminess… but that’s my speculation only.

Absolutely! It is. I believe that DEF is poisonous. At least not healthy to breathe after coming out of an exhaust.

AFAIK smog never has been a thing in Kansas.

Not often. I do remember seeing some smog over Kansas City one time back in the 1980s.

I’ll be hard pressed to believe that DEF isn’t a scam though… IMO that’s where they took it too far.

Once again, I agree. That's why, if I were to buy a newer diesel, one of the first things that would happen would be a delete and tune. Laws be d a m n e d.

 

[KansasIDI]

Some of it had/has to do with weather conditions. Sometimes, the air just likes to hit the mountains and sink down lower. That's when it's still an issue as far as I know. There's nothing that we can do to change that part. I saw smog over Denver a few years back and they Have pretty restrictive regulations too.

Yes, definitely climate/weather related…

Absolutely! It is. I believe that DEF is poisonous. At least not healthy to breathe after coming out of an exhaust.

It is corrosive, so…

Not often. I do remember seeing some smog over Kansas City one time back in the 1980s.

Interesting… Kansas City is pretty big though…

Once again, I agree. That's why, if I were to buy a newer diesel, one of the first things that would happen would be a delete and tune. Laws be d a m n e d.

Although I cuss it… I wouldn’t delete. It’s all meant to go together, and it’s become very illegal to delete… and yes, it makes repair bills expensive, it’s a pain in the ass, but, it’s livable IMO. All but three of the Dodge/Ram trucks at work have DEF… it’s not terrible, but it is still stupid.

We have one deleted DEF truck, and two deleted DPF only trucks… the two 2011s haven’t been too troublesome after delete, less so than before, but I can’t say the same for the 2016 that had DEF. It’s less reliable than before…

 

[ttman4]

Sooooo, I got a question???
Thankfully I don’t have to mess around with DEF cause somehow it got deleted from the ‘14 Chev Silverado 6.6 that I inherited when our son passed.

I kinda know what DEF is but what is DPF??

BTW one thing really bothers me is watching all these different diesel guys take off from a stoplight, all really wound up. BLOWING SMOKE all over the country side, giving-em-He%# …..
Currently here in Central Oregon we don’t yet have to have smog check etc etc……. But stuff like this is gonna make it happen soon!!!!
And I’ll have to go back to bicycles cause I don’t got ANYTHING AT ALL that could ever pass anything!!!!

 

[Nero]

A dpf is essentially the black smoke catcher. The black smoke is particulate matter. The dpf catches it and bakes it into ash and gasses, to put it in simple terms.

 

[franklin2]

Sooooo, I got a question???
Thankfully I don’t have to mess around with DEF cause somehow it got deleted from the ‘14 Chev Silverado 6.6 that I inherited when our son passed.

I kinda know what DEF is but what is DPF??

BTW one thing really bothers me is watching all these different diesel guys take off from a stoplight, all really wound up. BLOWING SMOKE all over the country side, giving-em-He%# …..
Currently here in Central Oregon we don’t yet have to have smog check etc etc……. But stuff like this is gonna make it happen soon!!!!
And I’ll have to go back to bicycles cause I don’t got ANYTHING AT ALL that could ever pass anything!!!!

DPF is Diesel Particulate Filter. It's that huge thing in the exhaust on a newer truck. I think they still use them on the DEF trucks, but my 09 6.4 powerstroke at work doesn't use DEF, but it does have the DPF under it. Every once in awhile it will tell me on the dash "cleaning exhaust filter". When that happens, if I am not in a higher speed limit area I will pull the transmission down in a lower gear and let it eat. It is supposed to turn the fuel up in the engine to burn off and clean out the filter.

That is what I have never figured out. The DPF filters all the particulates out of the exhaust to clean it up. But then later it goes into this mode that burns all this "pollution" out of the filter and that exits the exhaust. So why not let it go ahead and come out when it's produced instead of waiting to burn it off later?

 

[Nero]

That is what I have never figured out. The DPF filters all the particulates out of the exhaust to clean it up. But then later it goes into this mode that burns all this "pollution" out of the filter and that exits the exhaust. So why not let it go ahead and come out when it's produced instead of waiting to burn it off later?

During the filter service, the exhaust temps will get to about 1100°F to cook the particulate. Particulate is essentially soot. It breaks it down into ash and gasses. When a dpf has to be taken off and cleaned manually, its because its capacity to hold ash has maxed out.

Dpf was made mandatory in 2008, and DEF was made mandatory in 2010.
Systems with DEF still have DPFs in them. Dpf is upstream.

Now if you really want to know what the killers of engines are.. High idle time, and EGR....

 

[KansasIDI]

EGR

Sounds like they might do away with this soon…

 

[Nero]

Sounds like they might do away with this soon…

Thats not what Ive heard, but would be thrilled if they did. I know some gas powered cars have gotten away from it by variable valve timing achieving the same things...

 

[franklin2]

During the filter service, the exhaust temps will get to about 1100°F to cook the particulate. Particulate is essentially soot. It breaks it down into ash and gasses. When a dpf has to be taken off and cleaned manually, its because its capacity to hold ash has maxed out.

Dpf was made mandatory in 2008, and DEF was made mandatory in 2010.
Systems with DEF still have DPFs in them. Dpf is upstream.

Now if you really want to know what the killers of engines are.. High idle time, and EGR....

From the rumors I have heard, my truck at work (a 6.4) should not be still running. 2009 with 168,000 on it. But I have never had a major problem with it. Thermostats, radiator hoses, idler pulleys, that is about it. I do run it hard, and I haul a lot of tools and parts around in it. I also heard a rumor that I should not see any black smoke out of the tailpipe when I get a hard pull on it. If I do, the DPF is burnt out. Well, I do get a good amount of black smoke out of the tailpipe. The back corner of the truck is black from it.

 

[Nero]

A 6.4 powerstroke that hasn't blown up yet? Even... "Not modified" I'm surprised its made it that far

 

[IDIBOBS]

Nah, it's not. Smog in cities used to be horrific, just due to unfiltered exhaust. Unless you lived in a major city back then, you have no idea. My mom recalls how bad Sacramento smog used to be in the 60s-Early 80s. California emissions for gasoline vehicles went into effect in 1975, but a ton of exempt vehicles were still on the road in 1984 (when she moved away) pumping out tons of smog.

An article about LA:

Opinion: 'No sign of mountains': What it was like in L.A. before today's clean-air rules

To the editor: In 1971, my 2-year-old son and I moved to Los Angeles from Boston.

www.latimes.com

There were smog alerts, warning people not to go outside too much, if possible, on days when it was especially bad.

Diesel emissions regulations didn't go into effect until 1997, because they kept kicking the can down the road, to appease the trucking industry.

That smog was from industry Not cars or trucks. They tossed industy and 10s of 1000s of jobs so the smog lessened. Nothing to do with cars. Also they had smog equipment on cars long before 1975. California used to have a 20year rolling no smog check deal but in 1995 the gobernor stopped that so to 20year no smog stalled at 1975. Gotta do some real research about California smog

 

[Nero]

Thats how the portland testing areas are in Oregon. 1975 forward needs to pass smog. Non-portland standard areas abide by a 20yr requirement.