Fuel fired starting system instead of glowplugs

[ameristar1]

What would it take to put a fuel fired preheat system on the motor?

 

[jcarr]

Check out some of the engines on the mid to late 90's new holland tractors. I can't recall right now if they are the cummins engines or the iveco engine but they have such a system on them. It consist of a small GP and a "injector" that drips fuel on that GP which ignites and the engine then sucks fire into the cylinders through the valves. Will this work on an IDI don't know.

This type setup has a weak point though. If the "injector" starts leaking it can flood the engine out and cause a no start or stalling engine issue. We frequently see this problem on the tractors so equiped that come into the shop.

I'm not saying its not possible but would take some work and you would still have 1 GP so its not a total GP free system.

 

[FordGuy100]

It would take....

More knowledge than I have

 

[jcarr]

Where's your sense of adventure Justin. I'll bet we got a tractor with this setup setting in the shop now if you'd like pics to help ya figure it out.

 

[dyoung14]

here something to think about, my step dad has an old massey fergerson 3 cyl diesel tractor(i thinks its 3cyl) and it doesnt have glow plugs and it fires off on the second-third turn of the motor even at about 30 degrees, so how does that work?

 

[ameristar1]

I'm just thinking about how to get around this, because if the volume difference in the cylinder without the glowplug is enough to justify doing something like this, I'm all for it.

I mean, after the old girl fires, you don't need the plugs anyway. Eliminate one more thing on the list of IDI fixes. Have the ability to go subfreezing temps knowing that it'll reliably start.

 

[ameristar1]

Where's your sense of adventure Justin. I'll bet we got a tractor with this setup setting in the shop now if you'd like pics to help ya figure it out.

Post the pics, I'd like to take a look.

 

[1320Cummins]

I was going to go out and get a picture of mine... But I remembered it is 45 minutes away right now;p Oh well.

 

[1320Cummins]

http://www.importtractorparts.net/fuelpump2.html
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Delphi-Thermo...wItemQQimsxq20091015?IMSfp=TL091015194003r604
http://media.photobucket.com/image/thermostart/HakanTh/Traktor/Ford/thermostart.jpg

Parts 6 and 7 from link one should be all you need. Maybe two of 6. They even sell a bracket to hold #7
$58 + S&H to get one of each.

 

[ameristar1]

Hooking up two to four of those things on a spacer at the inlet for the intake manifold (something like the 12/3/6/9 o'clock positions). Hmmm. Or put eight of those jokers injector style at the port in the intake manifold. If that doesn't start the motor, it deserves not to run.

 

[jcarr]

Maybe a good question for Mel, but wouldn't this have much the same effect as ether in that you are trying to compress a fire that is trying to expand.

 

[ameristar1]

I would think that since it's already fire, it shouldn't hurt anything since the fire itself would react better inside the precup than ether. I don't know if I am saying it proper, but ether explodes, and that's what causes the damage. Also, I don't think the fire reaches the cylinder, but rather the intense heat. And in that case, it won't hurt anything.

 

[Agnem]

I think it would do a swell job of heating up the chamber, but the lack of oxygen is going to make it tough to start. That's why I'm thinking several electric grids would do a better job. You want to heat the air, not necessarily the metal around it.

 

[towcat]

i know of a 1930's era Caterpilar tractor that used gasoline to get the pistons warmed up and moving before it was switched over to diesel to run.
got pics somewhere.......

 

[1320Cummins]

I want to try the 99.5 and up PSD intake heater but I am not having much luck finding em. I dont think I want to know what the dealer wants for them.