pennsylvaniabo
Full Access Member
here is a good link. Now this is cummins application, but lots of resources for the big transmission conversion...
DT 360 swap - the planning stages
- Thread starter bike-maker
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Diesel_brad
Dunce
My best friend put a Dt360 from a bus(not sure what year) in his IH 666. It has a5.9 cummins manifold and a HX35 turbo. He is 300HP at the PTO, with just a MILD fuel screw turn(1/4)
pennsylvaniabo
Full Access Member
my only concern with using MDT truck parts, is i have no idea what works together......
bike-maker
Full Access Member
Is the Cummins manifold a bolt on?
I know the DT manifold can both be turned upside down.
Diesel_brad
Dunce
It was "kinda" a bolt on. He couldnt just flip the DT manifold because the turbo was in the middle and hit his fuel tank. The 5.9 put the turbo in the right place, he just had to do some porting work and open up the bolt holes
bike-maker
Full Access Member
As far as medium duty stuff goes, here's what I have figured out so far.
They are standardized into SAE sizes, with SAE #1 being the biggest.
My DT has an adapter bolted to the back of it that adapts it to a SAE #2 bellhousing (it was an Allison auto in the bus)
Industrial IH IDI's came in bigger trucks with SAE trannys bolted to them. The back of an IDI does not have an SAE bolt pattern in it; there is an adapter from the engine block to the SAE bellhousing, just like on the smaller pickup engines, but different bolt pattern.
So pick your trans out, find the appropriate SAE size bellhousing, and bolt it to the SAE adapter on the back of your engine block.
Clutches seem to be sized as SAE also.
2 things I still would like to find out; are the flywheels different between different engines?
Do the tranny's have a standard bolt patern where they bolt to the bellhousing?
A medium duty tranny will bolt up to a cummins because truck applications have created the adapter between the Cummins block and a SAE bellhousing.
This should be possible with a PSD also, although I haven't seen anyone complaining about destroying a bunch of transmissions behind the PSD's.
Makes me think a ZF5 might be way more capable than what it is rated at.
There's gotta be soeone else on here familiar with the whole SAE setup; I'm not 100% sure about all of my info.
They are standardized into SAE sizes, with SAE #1 being the biggest.
My DT has an adapter bolted to the back of it that adapts it to a SAE #2 bellhousing (it was an Allison auto in the bus)
Industrial IH IDI's came in bigger trucks with SAE trannys bolted to them. The back of an IDI does not have an SAE bolt pattern in it; there is an adapter from the engine block to the SAE bellhousing, just like on the smaller pickup engines, but different bolt pattern.
So pick your trans out, find the appropriate SAE size bellhousing, and bolt it to the SAE adapter on the back of your engine block.
Clutches seem to be sized as SAE also.
2 things I still would like to find out; are the flywheels different between different engines?
Do the tranny's have a standard bolt patern where they bolt to the bellhousing?
A medium duty tranny will bolt up to a cummins because truck applications have created the adapter between the Cummins block and a SAE bellhousing.
This should be possible with a PSD also, although I haven't seen anyone complaining about destroying a bunch of transmissions behind the PSD's.
Makes me think a ZF5 might be way more capable than what it is rated at.
There's gotta be soeone else on here familiar with the whole SAE setup; I'm not 100% sure about all of my info.
Dang .I was in Albany sunday.
I would use the zf, make an adapter to make it fit, use the zf flywheel if the balance is correct. There are clutches to hold more power so not an issue. If you had a dt flywheel that was too big I would find a bigger lathe and make the FW smaller. I have done this before not a big deal. Or open the ZF FW to bolt onto the DT.
I think a RTO would require Huge floor mods to fit in there.
I would use the zf, make an adapter to make it fit, use the zf flywheel if the balance is correct. There are clutches to hold more power so not an issue. If you had a dt flywheel that was too big I would find a bigger lathe and make the FW smaller. I have done this before not a big deal. Or open the ZF FW to bolt onto the DT.
I think a RTO would require Huge floor mods to fit in there.
bike-maker
Full Access Member
I was in Lebanon picking the DT up.....
It came with the flex plate to bolt it to an Allison. It does not have any weights to make the engine externally balanced. It's about the same weight as an IDI SMF flywheel (heavy)
That sounds like a good option; the real question is would the DT flywheel fit inside the integrated bellhousing of the ZF5, so I could use the stock DT starter.
Call Columbus Diesel Supply, Scheid Diesel, Gene's Machince Shop, Hypermax, WipeOut Enterprises, or any other place that builds diesel pulling parts. There litterally is a metric ton of stuff for the DT 300 and 400 series diesels. IF THE TRACTOR IS RED, IT HAS A DT UNDER THE HOOD!!!
That's why you'll need a custom flywheel to use the ZF. You know my 2 cents on the trans. Medium duty all the way. You can get medium duty parts at any truck shop in the country. Not so much if a custom part gives you an issue while hauling the camper. The RTO6610 is a "small" RTO, but still, 10 speeds it a lot of shifting in a truck that light with a DT360. Keep an eye out for 5,6, and 7 speed overdrive transmissions from Spicer or Fuller on Craig's list. I got mine for cheap.
By the way....... That is one heck of a deal on the DT360.
Heath
rhkcommander
Full Access Member
I was torn between wanting a 360 and doing a idi rebuild. Money is the limit, isn't it always? The dts have a much higher power capability. I'll definitely be watching this thread 
Why don't you see a 360 very often in pullers? Because they all run 466s. Some of those guys are highly competitive.
Why don't you see a 360 very often in pullers? Because they all run 466s. Some of those guys are highly competitive.
Diesel_brad
Dunce
What bolt patten is the trans behind a IDI in a pickup? would an adapter from a IDI in a pickup bolt to a DT?
bike-maker
Full Access Member
They're not even close. The DT being an in-line block, has a pretty narrow bolt pattern compared to an IDI. The DT doesn't really have an kind of flange for the bellhousing adapter to bolt to; it's just a flat spot machined on the back of the block.
Another question; what is the diameter of an IDI flywheel? Somebody here has got to have one they can measure. I don't think the flywheel that came with the DT is much bigger; but it's been a while since I set eyes on mine.
Another question; what is the diameter of an IDI flywheel? Somebody here has got to have one they can measure. I don't think the flywheel that came with the DT is much bigger; but it's been a while since I set eyes on mine.
Eason
Full Access Member
Bike-maker Just a thought would a 6.9 or 7.3 in a bus with an allison have an adapter to SAE pattern? Could you use one of them backwards to convert your SAE to the ford pattern on your ZF5 Might be a little thick with 2 adapters. As for rebuild kits go to a Navistar dealer and price a "works" kit for the DT-360 It should include every thing for a inframe. It just won't have the main bearings. I have a buddy in the septic tank business and he pulls a 15000 lb backhoe with a 1700 IH truck with a DT-360. He's grossing about 30,000 lb truck trailer and backhoe. I don't think you will run out of power. Eason
In tractors, most guys run 400 series as the more cubes, the more power. In trucks, the fact that the DT360 was never used in a 1 ton or smaller truck, it can't be used except for exhibtion runs. That may change in time, but that's the rule at most places/sactioning bodies.
Heath
I can measure an IDI SMF for you and the flywheel on my DT466 with a #2 SAE. I'm pretty sure they are a few inches smaller than the DT flywheel.
Heath
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