LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
I bought the rear hangers from Sky, bit pricey but for the fab time they saved me it's OK. I played weld-ninja with the fronts, it's somewhat of unusual setup there but I expect it to ride better than factory.
87 Crew Cab Project
- Thread starter freebird01
- Start date
6.9poweredscout
Bleeds IH red...
I've always wondered that those pin things hanging off the frames were...
freebird01
Post Turtle!
they are locating pins for production. the bogey's they ride on in the factory have holes in them so as they move through the plant the frame is in the proper location for the robotic assembly machines
kind of like the bogeys under this truck...
kind of like the bogeys under this truck...
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freebird01
Post Turtle!
will definitely be an idi... 6.9 or 7.3
Nice truck! Debating on the factory setup or a RSK kit for my dually when I go 4x4. I have another donor frame for the factory setup and in the short distance I drove it, I did not think it road all that bad, it was a cclb srw idi turbo truck, 280k. Maybe springs were worn and seemed soft. Everything I read says the ride quality is so much better with RSK. So I am watching this topic to see how it comes out.
How do you plan on doing the frame horns, just notch frame for shackle and box in and make it like the factory 4x4?
Btw, I thought those pins might be for some alignment on a jig at the factory. Thanks for confirming that. I keep bumping my head on those!
How do you plan on doing the frame horns, just notch frame for shackle and box in and make it like the factory 4x4?
Btw, I thought those pins might be for some alignment on a jig at the factory. Thanks for confirming that. I keep bumping my head on those!
LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
My take on the RSK or not, is that it depends on the springs to be used:
1) A spring that at ride height remains positively-arched (like the rears are) under compression will move the axle forward if in factory configuration, while the force of impact is trying to push it backwards - the two "collide" and the suspension ends up fighting itself and giving a lousy ride. Doing an RSK affixes the front of the springs and allows the axle to move backwards under compression, which is also the direction the road force is pushing it into, so the suspension soaks up the bumps better.
2) A spring that at ride height sits flat or is negatively arched (F250 front springs for example) with factory bracketry upon compression will want to move the axle backwards slightly, which is the way the road force is pushing it. If you do an RSK on one of those and affix the front end of the springs and let the rear float on the shackles, the spring will end up trying to pull the axle forward while the road force is pushing it backwards, and you'll probably end up with no better ride than before.
I'm using big block gasser springs under my IDI, they must be somewhat softer than diesel specific springs and end up with a slight negative arch to them at ride height (which heights is about and inch lower than factory 4x4 F350, but for my purposes that's actually a good thing). Because of this I kept the factory setup of fixed rear ends of the springs and shackled fronts, I also angled my shock towers back some 10-15 degrees so they absorb road force better. Overall I think my setup rides about as nice a my 2wd front did, which was actually quite nice to begin with. If I were going for a lift and/or positively arched springs I'd do an RSK in a heartbeat, but for the spring geometry I'm running this setup works out quite well.
About the frame alignment pins, I've also smacked my head on them a few times, every time it happened I thought of chopping them, sure glad now I never followed thru with that
1) A spring that at ride height remains positively-arched (like the rears are) under compression will move the axle forward if in factory configuration, while the force of impact is trying to push it backwards - the two "collide" and the suspension ends up fighting itself and giving a lousy ride. Doing an RSK affixes the front of the springs and allows the axle to move backwards under compression, which is also the direction the road force is pushing it into, so the suspension soaks up the bumps better.
2) A spring that at ride height sits flat or is negatively arched (F250 front springs for example) with factory bracketry upon compression will want to move the axle backwards slightly, which is the way the road force is pushing it. If you do an RSK on one of those and affix the front end of the springs and let the rear float on the shackles, the spring will end up trying to pull the axle forward while the road force is pushing it backwards, and you'll probably end up with no better ride than before.
I'm using big block gasser springs under my IDI, they must be somewhat softer than diesel specific springs and end up with a slight negative arch to them at ride height (which heights is about and inch lower than factory 4x4 F350, but for my purposes that's actually a good thing). Because of this I kept the factory setup of fixed rear ends of the springs and shackled fronts, I also angled my shock towers back some 10-15 degrees so they absorb road force better. Overall I think my setup rides about as nice a my 2wd front did, which was actually quite nice to begin with. If I were going for a lift and/or positively arched springs I'd do an RSK in a heartbeat, but for the spring geometry I'm running this setup works out quite well.
About the frame alignment pins, I've also smacked my head on them a few times, every time it happened I thought of chopping them, sure glad now I never followed thru with that
Good points...I was leaning towards the factory setup, because a) already have it b) didn't want a lift c) no additional costs. I am not near the truck, but my f350 springs are nearly flat looking at pictures I have. I had not considered leaning the shock towers back.
freebird01
Post Turtle!
my plan is to use all the hangers off my F250 frame as well as the factory F350 panhard bar. I am going to notch the frame (you have to) and i am actually going to cut out the factory frame reinforcement and weld that into my frame. when im done it will look like it was originally 4x4.
stock shackles...stock F350 springs... eventually id like to go with superduty springs and an RSK but getting the D60 in place and all the rest of the bugs worked out as well as a new motor is more important to me right now. especially when i have all the factory stuff on hand
stock shackles...stock F350 springs... eventually id like to go with superduty springs and an RSK but getting the D60 in place and all the rest of the bugs worked out as well as a new motor is more important to me right now. especially when i have all the factory stuff on hand
junk
Full Access Member
Sounds like a solid plan to me. I used clapped out f250 springs with my dana 60 swap for a while and my truck rode awesome. It was a crewcab so I had length working for me also. Now in my 89 I have 99 up superduty springs with positive arch and a home made revers shackle. I don't know how it rides yet though as the trucks still all torn apart.
What Notch needs to be added to the frame? Also have you looked at the steering gear pitman arms? Evidently the F350 4x4 have a different arm that is longer? I've been running a 2wd on in my crewcab, but want to find one of these f350 4x4 ones to compare. I have an F250 4x4 one but haven't compared yet.
Thanks for the updates!
What Notch needs to be added to the frame? Also have you looked at the steering gear pitman arms? Evidently the F350 4x4 have a different arm that is longer? I've been running a 2wd on in my crewcab, but want to find one of these f350 4x4 ones to compare. I have an F250 4x4 one but haven't compared yet.
Thanks for the updates!
freebird01
Post Turtle!
the 2wd is a coil spring truck. it doesnt have the cut out in the bottom of the frame rail for the shackle to pass through and have sufficient room for movement. nothing the plasma cutter cant fix though.
im just going to run with the stock 2wd steering gear unless i come across a 4x4 one. i sold/gave away all my other steering boxes so i dont have any to compare to.
im just going to run with the stock 2wd steering gear unless i come across a 4x4 one. i sold/gave away all my other steering boxes so i dont have any to compare to.
junk
Full Access Member
Yeah I wasn't thinking today. Dah the front notches for the shackles. I knew that.....
I'm running the 2wd pitman also. I'm looking to order a dorman F350 replacement and see if it's longer. If it is, it might give a little more steering angle. Overall not a must have in my book.
I'm running the 2wd pitman also. I'm looking to order a dorman F350 replacement and see if it's longer. If it is, it might give a little more steering angle. Overall not a must have in my book.
LCAM-01XA
Full Access Member
The F350 4x4 pitman arm is indeed longer. With 2wd arm you will max out your steering box travel before the knuckle hit the bump stop on the axle. Meaning you won't get the max steering angle and thus min turning radius. Makes for very easy steering tho, lighter feel at the wheel. Also, I can't see a need to replace the whole steering box, just the pitman arm should do the trick.
Edit: some measurement for ya'll, F350 4x4 pitman arm is right around 6" long center to center, F350 2wd pitman arm is about 5-1/4" long center to center. Both arms are installed on trucks so I can't get quite precise measurements, but these are well in the ballpark.
Edit: some measurement for ya'll, F350 4x4 pitman arm is right around 6" long center to center, F350 2wd pitman arm is about 5-1/4" long center to center. Both arms are installed on trucks so I can't get quite precise measurements, but these are well in the ballpark.
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freebird01
Post Turtle!
LCAM...the only reason to swap the box is mine leaks like crazy
freebird01
Post Turtle!
well i was back at it today... put my new air hammer to the test. i think i could be heard for 4 blocks hehehe
i started by removing the radius arm brackets and cleaning and painting the frame
then i managed to start pulling apart my donor frame. got the 60 pulled out and out of the way
then i proceeded to cut about a 1000 rivets and eat the hell out of the brackets to get them off the frame. even managed to cut out the factory frame brace for a 4x4. i also got the reliefs for the shackles cut out of the frame
this is whats left of the donor frame and thats where im at.
i started by removing the radius arm brackets and cleaning and painting the frame
You must be registered for see images attach
then i managed to start pulling apart my donor frame. got the 60 pulled out and out of the way
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
then i proceeded to cut about a 1000 rivets and eat the hell out of the brackets to get them off the frame. even managed to cut out the factory frame brace for a 4x4. i also got the reliefs for the shackles cut out of the frame
You must be registered for see images attach
You must be registered for see images attach
this is whats left of the donor frame and thats where im at.
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