5 speed swap

[m8094538]

been gone for a bit but now im working on the truck again got pissed off at it and had to leave it alone for a few days haha. first of all i screwed up the c6 2 weeks ago slips now. so i picked up the zf5 today now just gotta go to the junkyard and get what i need for it. i know im going to need a cross member (will one from a gasser f250 work from the 87 or newer trucks mines an 86) i know i need pedals i think they got some from my body style there, a driveshaft (ive never seen an f250 without a midshift bearing till i got my truck is this normal), steering colum, clutch master and slave cylinder and lines( can i use this from a gasser f250), clutch and flywheel(whats the best set up to use to be as stong as possible). if theres anything im missing plz let me know so i can finish my list. second i need to get my new ip to quit leaking and the truck to run right, ive been trying to do this for about a week now and im to the point i may just take it to a shop just to get it back on the road bein as i got a ride to work till the end of january then im on my own. anyway thanks for any help and merry christmas to everyone

 

[papastruck]

You'll need a firewall reinforcement plate. There's a guy on here who makes them - I think there's info in the stickies up top.

Btw, is the ZF5 the same length as the C6?

 

[m8094538]

i havent had time to measure yet ill do that tomarow. that would be sweet if they were

 

[papastruck]

We were trying to figure that out in another thread listing trans lengths.

http://www.oilburners.net/forums/showthread.php?t=44687&highlight=length

We got to the point where I roll around in the slush measuring my C6, and I confess I've not done that yet.

 

[Goofyexponent]

I JUST did this swap...well, similar. E4)D to ZF

What I found was this.....

The top two bolts on the bell housing were too long by about 1/2". Shorten them or get new ones...they are cheap, use grade 8 bolts though.

The bolts that hold the flexplate to the crank are also the wrong length. They need to be 3/4" longer to use a DMF setup. I am not sure on a SMF setup, but I would think it would be the same situation.

I used a factory DMF from a 1990 (I think 1990) 5 speed truck. It works fine, but it is getting lucky modded when I do the turbo treatment to my spare motor and install it this spring/summer.

BENCH BLEED THE PEDALS AND MASTER BEFORE YOU INSTALL IT!!! If it's not already bled and full, or you will have a HELL of a time with it.

If you don't have the clip to hold the clutch rod back in the slave, do yourself a favor and grind about 1/8" of an inch off each end WHILE KEEPING THE ROUNDED SHAPE ON IT!!!! This made life SO much easier when it came time to put the slave in place.

Pull the carpet back and unbolt the plate on the floor....find a truck with a 5 speed and take that plate out and put it in your truck. It's much easier than trying to measure anc cut the proper size hole in your existing floor.

What I did to install the clutch was buy an extra 2 flywheel bolts that are 1 1/2" longer than what you need. Cut the heads off and thread them into the crank a little ways. These will act as dowels to slide the flywheel on (it's HEAVY) and allow you to thread the preoper size bolts in with BLUE loctite on them. Once the rest are in, remove your dowels and replace with the other two proper bolts. Torque these to 47 ft. lbs.

The pressure plate is a PITA to get right with the clutch disc if you don't have the proper tool. I just installed it loosely, and slid the transmission in place...then once the bellhousing bolts were in, I went back and tightened up the flywheel bolts (20 ft. lbs.). Blue loctite here as well!

RTV or gasket between the transmission and transer case. This keeps crap and water out of there. Ignore this if your truck is 2WD. (looks like 4x4 from your pic, I think I see front locking hubs)

Once you get this far, the rest of the truck goes together pretty fast.

I had a custom rear shaft made, but I need to get the front shaft shortened. This mightnot apply to you, as the C6 and Zf are close to the same length IIRC.

My pedals come fron a 1996, and my truck was a 1992. I am not sure of compatibility of older trucks and new trucks firewalls and pedal fitments.

A gasser crossmember SHOULD work, as I would think that driveline angles on gassers are the same as diesels.

Your starter will work, you don't even have to take it off.

Also, this is the time to fix a rear main if it is leaking, or any other little leaks. Also, take apart the connections on your GPR and clean them, dielectric grease and put it back together.

WATCH YOUR HEAD UNDER THERE!!! There are tiny screws that poke through the floor that are waiting to stick in your head...watch yourself under there!!!!

Other than that it's a piece of cake. Goodluck and if you need any help, shoot us a reply on here and we will do our best to help. You are going to LOVE that stick behind that diesel...it made my truck REALLY come to life!!!

 

[Diesel JD]

I think there is a high likelihood you could use the C6 transmission crossmember, but you might have to drill some different holes in it. Your pedals need to be from 80-86, as you already knew, it's probably easier to just shorten the driveshaft and have it rebalanced if need be. You may instead find that it's now too short like I did with my C6 to T18 swap, or you might get lucky and not have to modify it at all. In any case you probably won't be able to grab a healthy driveshaft in the junkyard, at least not in my experience....they were always crushed beyond repair. It might be different where you are, but whoever operates the local junkyard takes no pains to preserve them here. The bottom line is measure carefully, measure twice and cut once, it keeps the costs low. Good luck, most people who have done a manual swap love their truck even more when it's finished.

 

[Goofyexponent]

In any case you probably won't be able to grab a healthy driveshaft in the junkyard, at least not in my experience....they were always crushed beyond repair. .

Good point, but if that is the case, measure it in the truck and write down the length from center to center of the U joints. Then compare that with your truck when it is together....this way you don't have to guess and guess with a measuring tape.

 

[m8094538]

thanks very much. this is some awesome information. another question i have is i heard that a single mass flywheel is the way to go. is this true, if so what one do i need to order, either years that will work or possibly a part number. and what clutch kit would you guys recommend using. as i said i want this to be as strong as possible and once its done i dont wanna have to take it apart for any reason. and once again thanks for the full writeups, i couldnt have asked for better info.

 

[m8094538]

btw its 2wd

 

[m8094538]

so i just looked and my driveshaft has a slip yoke and the tranny i bought has a u joint coupler. is this normal for a zf5 to have a coupler or do the zf5 in the trucks usually have slip yokes? i cant find my tape measure but just by looking at it the zf5 is shorter by about 6-8 inches. i can post a pic of the tranny if ude like but this kind of stumps me. and also about my truck not having a midshift bearing on the driveline, is this normal for a single cab to have. my 85 f150 even had a midshift bearing and the 4 speed in that was a slip yoke and it to was a single cab long bed. i know i kind of sound like a ******* here but i was too excited about getting the tranny to notice the difference haha

 

[Goofyexponent]

so i just looked and my driveshaft has a slip yoke and the tranny i bought has a u joint coupler. is this normal for a zf5 to have a coupler or do the zf5 in the trucks usually have slip yokes? i cant find my tape measure but just by looking at it the zf5 is shorter by about 6-8 inches. i can post a pic of the tranny if ude like but this kind of stumps me. and also about my truck not having a midshift bearing on the driveline, is this normal for a single cab to have. my 85 f150 even had a midshift bearing and the 4 speed in that was a slip yoke and it to was a single cab long bed. i know i kind of sound like a ******* here but i was too excited about getting the tranny to notice the difference haha

This is common for a ZF IIRC. I had a 2wd out of an F350 gasser with a yoke instead of a splined shaft. All you need is a U joint strap kit for it....similar to the rear of the shaft where it bolts to the axle. I am not sure how much as I never had to buy one yet, but I can't imagine it being costly.

As far as the shaft goes, my F150 reg cab long box was a one piece shaft, even my chebby ext cab short bed was a one piece shaft.

As far as a clutch, a SMF (single mass flywheel) is the cats meow to have. The DMF's had springs that broke causing really annoying noises. LuK or South Bend both offer a really nice kit for these trucks....but be prepared to spend about $500 plus on one. But that being said, you get what you pay for!!

One other thing to watch out for is your shifter boot. Mine didn't have insulation under it and I get a LOT of road noise.

If you stuffed it with insulation or somethign like that it will cut down on the noise under the truck. This is what I plan on doing to mine before winter REALLY sets in.

 

[Squeaky_Wheel]

I just completed my C6 to ZF5 swap and found all of the information needed on this website. If you have a early style banks turbo the piping will not work with the ZF5 without modifications and a body lift.

 

[towcat]

btw.....
somebody stole your pic.....



1986 ford f250 turbo diesel - $22 (fremont / union city / newark)

Date: 2010-12-20, 4:15AM PST
Reply to: [email protected] [Errors when replying to ads?]

i have a 1986 ford f250 2wd with a 6.9l idi diesel and a c6. the truck has 142,000 miles and an aftermarket ats turbo kit on it. i just put new injectors and a new injector pump on it less than 1000 miles ago. new glow plugs about 8 months ago. its has water temp, oil pressure, exhaust temp, and boost aftermarket guages and they all function. truck runs good and drives good. right now its primered black as the origional paint was faded and the clear coat was flaking off. no bondo, no major dents, or rust just a ding or two the body is very straight for being 24 years old. the truck has new tires with some nice chrome rims on it. the interior is all there with a cd player but the seat has a few tears in it. still plenty useable and doesnt look bad. as with any truck this old it could use alittle tlc but i wouldnt be afraid to drive it anywhere. took it to reno 3 months ago. plus itll tow anything. reason for sale is i need a smaller truck for commuting. might consider a trade for a ford ranger or other small pickup in good running condition. would like to get 2200 for it. if you would like to see the truck or have any questions please call justin at 510 ***-xxxx. calls would be the best way to get ahold of me, if i dont answer please leave a message and ill get back to you asap, i work nights and usually wake up around 4 pm. thanks for reading

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[m8094538]

no they didnt. me and my dad got into a huge fight because he thinks i need to sell my truck and buy a reliable small car bcuz i cant get my truck to run quite right yet. so i posted it for way too much money to make him happy. he also thinks i bought the tranny to resale for more money. the reason i actually posted it is because he goes out and checks i just tell everyone who calls it needs more work then it does.

and i have the ats turbo and downpipe on my truck. looks like it will fit but i dont mind modifying the exhaust if i have too, plus i want to go 4 inch anyway and having an actual excuse to do it would make spending the money easier

 

[towcat]

no they didnt. me and my dad got into a huge fight because he thinks i need to sell my truck and buy a reliable small car bcuz i cant get my truck to run quite right yet. so i posted it for way too much money to make him happy. he also thinks i bought the tranny to resale for more money. the reason i actually posted it is because he goes out and checks i just tell everyone who calls it needs more work then it does.

and i have the ats turbo and downpipe on my truck. looks like it will fit but i dont mind modifying the exhaust if i have too, plus i want to go 4 inch anyway and having an actual excuse to do it would make spending the money easier

i have a '95 civic EX I will be willing to trade for
should I bang on the front door in the evenig?